Definitive 2005 996 Turbo "S" Flash Guide

[ShokWaveRider]

Or at least this is what I would like this thread to turn out to be. I am in the final stages of selecting my flash vendor. I think I have made up my mind but I would like some more info before I pull the trigger. What I am trying to establish are the following data about any / all flash vendor contendors. Sorry folks I am an Engineer and need facts a data. I have done limited research on them as of now. I would encourage both vendors and users who have their products that they are happy with to contribute. I would not mind betting a lot of folk (No disrespect intended) do not really know all the info about their car's flash setup other than stated HP gain. My setup is basic stock 2005 996 turbo S 6 Speed with the following mods: FABSPEED MaxFlo Exhaust System Stock Wastegate Actuators (adjusted to 8.5 psi crack) Billet diverter Valves Stock AirBox, MAF & Fuel Regulator I plan on adding 1 Bar Wastegate Actuators and water injection at some point. I have had good experience with water injection on other Turbo vehicles. I would rather get 1 flash to cater for my goals, as opposed to getting it tuned as needed. Here is my list current of FLASH contenders. (Could be Expanded) They are all within my price range, I am personally looking for a solution under $1500: Please help with updated pricing, these were just got off the web. UMW - ($1295) Softronic - ($1549 Sale Price) EPL - ($1299) GIAC - ($2500 +) Upsolute - ($699 ??? Platinum 550hp Do not know about turbo S specific) EVOMS - ($2600 Sale Price) - 100hp, 95tq What I would like to know is info specific to the 2005 996 TT "S". as opposed to a standard 996 Turbo. Is the flash code different between models? 996 TT 996 X50 996 Turbo S What is the NET turbo HP Gain for the Turbo S? BHP Wheel HP What is the RedLine Max on the flash, Stock seems too low? What is the MAX Boost Pressure (Not Spikes) that the flash will deliver? (I currently get a 1 - 1.1 reading on my gauge at WOT, A/F Ratios are within spec. I would like 1.3 bar.) How invasive is the flash? Can Dealers Detect how many times the ECU has been Flashed? Can it be installed easily buy user? Can it be removed easily? -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Vendor specific Information (Thanks for Responding) Is the flash code different between models? EVOMS - X50 & S similar different from 996 TT What is the NET turbo HP Gain for the Turbo S With Upgraded Exhaust? EVOMS BHP ~100 HP / 95 TQ Wheel HP ~80 HP / 75 TQ What is the RedLine Max on the flash, Stock seems too low? EVOMS Stock 6,750 RPM Flashed 7000 - 7100 RPM What is the MAX Boost Pressure (Not Spikes) that the flash will deliver? EVOMS 1.2-1.3 bar is about the max boost pressure that the K24 turbos will put out with these components Can Dealers Detect how many times the ECU has been Flashed? EVOMS - Not with EVOMS Software Can it be installed easily buy user? EVOMS - No, Via Mail or On-site at EVOMS or Rep Can it be removed easily? EVOMS - No, Via Mail or On site at EVOMS or Rep Stock BHP of 2005 996 Turbo "S" 450 BHP or Crank HP. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Any help would be appreciated. I will update the post as I receive the pertinent Information. Thanks SWR

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[buzzm]

some tuners will also give you a credit or discount if you perform more mods later and then need another flash, softronic offers this so they are top of my list so far

it would be good to note the price of the flash next to each tuner as well

i have heard prices for an upsolute flash as low as $700.00, dont know much about them though and the price almost seems too good to be true, any feedback from anyone with an upsolute flash would be good

[KPG]

Originally Posted by ShokWaveRider

(I currently get a 1 - 1.1 reading on my gauge at WOT, A/F Ratios are within spec.

If you are actually seeing a true 1.1 bar, and that may not be a reality given the OEM boost gauge deficiencies, then you may already have a flashed car....

[ShokWaveRider]

No it is not flashed. When my wastegates were set at 6 psi (What they were stock. I was lucky to see .8 bar. I usually see 1 at WOT, the 1.1 was probably a spike.

SWR

Originally Posted by KPG

If you are actually seeing a true 1.1 bar, and that may not be a reality given the OEM boost gauge deficiencies, then you may already have a flashed car....

[GBXSport]

i'd assume that the turbo S flash is the same as the x50 flash.

[ShokWaveRider]

Originally Posted by GBXSport

i'd assume that the turbo S flash is the same as the x50 flash.

Remember what assume means.......

I would have thought some vendors would have responded to help us here. I did get a PM from EVOMS (THank You). I just need a lot more info on this. To me as an Electronics Engineer a Flash is an expensive option, I would just like to know exactly what I am getting. EVOMS seems to have the highest HP / TQ but at a cost. Most others average out at 65-70HP increase.

SWR

[sleepys4]

I'm the same boat as you. I have a stock 2004 turbo s cab, but its a tip. Looking into what you find. What is this wastegate adjustment you are talking about?

[enoyskt]

This seems like it would be a good thread when it develops. Looking for this info as a 966TT setup.

[Evolution MotorSports]

Originally Posted by ShokWaveRider

What I would like to know is info specific to the 2005 996 TT "S". as opposed to a standard 996 Turbo.

• Is the flash code different between models?
  • 996 TT
  • 996 X50
  • 996 Turbo S
• What is the NET turbo HP Gain for the Turbo S?
  • BHP
  • Wheel HP
• What is the RedLine Max on the flash, Stock seems too low?
• What is the MAX Boost Pressure (Not Spikes) that the flash will deliver? (I currently get a 1 - 1.1 reading on my gauge at WOT, A/F Ratios are within spec. I would like 1.3 bar.)
• How invasive is the flash?
  • Can Dealers Detect how many times the ECU has been Flashed?
  • Can it be installed easily buy user?
  • Can it be removed easily?

I cannot seem to establish what the published HP of the S is. I read 440 - 457, is that BHP or WHP?

Any help would be appreciated. I will update the post as I receive the pertinent Information.

Thanks

SWR

Hello SWR,



Here is some more information:

• Is the flash code different between models? YES, the software coding is different between the listed models. The X50 and "S" are nearly the same but the standard (NON X50/S) model software is very different
  • 996 TT
  • 996 X50
  • 996 Turbo S
• What is the NET turbo HP Gain for the Turbo S?
  • BHP ~100 HP / 95 TQ with exhaust*
  • Wheel HP ~80 HP / 75 TQ with exhaust*
• *The stated gains include the gain from exhaust system. The OEM exhaust system is very restrictive and power gains from software alone is significantly less.
  • What is the RedLine Max on the flash, Stock seems too low? The rev limit can be set from 6750 RPM (stock) to ~7100 RPM for this power application. We typically set this upgrade at 7000 RPMS
  • What is the MAX Boost Pressure (Not Spikes) that the flash will deliver? (I currently get a 1 - 1.1 reading on my gauge at WOT, A/F Ratios are within spec. I would like 1.3 bar.) 1.2-1.3 bar is about the max boost pressure that the K24 turbos will put out with the present components
  • How invasive is the flash?
    • Can Dealers Detect how many times the ECU has been Flashed? Not with our software
    • Can it be installed easily buy user? No, either mail in or on location at one of our installation centers
    • Can it be removed easily? Yes - either mail in or on location at one of our installation centers
• I cannot seem to establish what the published HP of the S is. I read 440 - 457, is that BHP or WHP? Engine HP

The power gains that can be measured on the dyno only account for 10% of our tuning process. We spend a considerable amount of time tuning the car on the street to maximize part throttle power and throttle response as well as highway fuel consumption. We also tune the ECU to minimize the amount of turbo lag for improved power and torque under the curve. All of these "other" aspects of our tuning are not measurable on the dyno per se, but are significant to the overall drivability and power delivery. Hope this helps.

[GBXSport]

so you're TTS and X50 is "nearly" the same? On your site it shows exactly the same. Are there 2 different flashes?

[Evolution MotorSports]

Originally Posted by GBXSport

so you're TTS and X50 is "nearly" the same? On your site it shows exactly the same. Are there 2 different flashes?

The question was - was there a difference in the software coding from the different models. There are 3 different types of coding for the USA 6-speed X50 and S models. The differences between the software variations is minimal in terms of the map structure that are changed with the software upgrade (timing, boost, fueling, etc) So, when we make a performance file for any X50/S, we use the same coding that is extracted from the ECU to base our performance software. There are virtually no performance differences between the 3 different software variations.

[ShokWaveRider]

Evolution Motorsports

Thanks for your detailed response. This is EXACTLY what we are looking for for each vendor. I assume my FABSPEEd Maxflo exhaust is OK.

Thanks again.

SWR

[Dr_jitsu]

You are spending way too much time and effort on something that does not matter that much. All basic flashes are about the same.

If you want a worthwhile increase in hp, you need an 18G compressor in your turbos, a 5 bar and a customized flash/tune (you will need to datalog your info and go back and forth a couple of times).

[ShokWaveRider]

Originally Posted by Dr_jitsu

You are spending way too much time and effort on something that does not matter that much. All basic flashes are about the same.

If you want a worthwhile increase in hp, you need an 18G compressor in your turbos, a 5 bar and a customized flash/tune (you will need to datalog your info and go back and forth a couple of times).

I respectfully dissagree. It would be different if there were not such large price difference between vendors. I want 500 - 550 WHP out of my stock turbos with minimum modifications.

Thanks

SWR

[ColoradoSilver]

Originally Posted by ShokWaveRider

I respectfully dissagree. It would be different if there were not such large price difference between vendors. I want 500 - 550 WHP out of my stock turbos with minimum modifications.

Thanks

SWR

Dr_jitsu is pretty much correct on this one. I went through the same thing you are a while back. Trying to collect as much info as I could on each flash to see the differences and what I would get out of each. In the end, the differences are trivial.

With an exhaust, you'll be at 1.1 Bar on 91 octane and 1.2 on 93 with your setup, but thats about as far as you can go before you start to get into the heavier mods (turbo upgrades).

I have the same setup as you do with the basics done. Exhaust, DV's, F-Hose, Intake.

I went with the Softronic flash because Dan at Vivid cut me a deal because I bought a bunch of things together.

Car went from 0.8 to 1.0 Bar withthe tune and exhaust at same time.

I don't think that any other flash tune would have been any better or worse.