Looking for specific users of the Aquamist HFS1 Water Methanol System
996 Turbo / GT2Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2004 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2. Sponsored By Vivid Racing
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I spoke to Mike in detail about it, it is something I want to do, the question is the tuning? It would be tough for me to go to a different tuner now.
I don't see what the issue would be running a higher octane on a 94 pump program. I have asked EVOMS but I yet to get a reply.
Running race gas or meth on a pump file is not utilizing the capabilities at all...adding so much more octane yet not running the timing it'll take....you might gain a little but certainly not the full potential.
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Running race gas or meth on a pump file is not utilizing the capabilities at all...adding so much more octane yet not running the timing it'll take....you might gain a little but certainly not the full potential.
No I realize that. It is more for ensuring my car does not detonate. The cooling effects also help the motor perform during hotter weather. My intent was not significant power gains which would obviously require a new tune which will be difficult to achieve with a different tuner. That is my dilema.
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02' Seal Grey on Black TT with EVOMS GT800+, Water Cooled GT3076, EVOMSit To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. , EVOMS I/C's, 83 lbs Injectors, EVOMS dual fuel pump system, CF driveshaft, Sachs Stage 3 clutch, EVOMS motor build, 12mm head studs, GT30 Cams, 76MM TB, Custom gearbox, 3" Exhaust, 47mm Headers, 14" BBK, GT3R brake ducts, PSS9's, H&R Front & Rear Sway Bars, SS Brake Lines, EVOMS SSK, EVOMS V-Flow, V1, K40 LD5500, Recaro Sport Topline seats, Full OEM GT2 Front Bumper conversion, OEM GT2 Rear deck lid and spoiler, Toyo RA1's 245/335 18's
No I realize that. It is more for ensuring my car does not detonate. The cooling effects also help the motor perform during hotter weather. My intent was got significant power gains which would obviously require a new tune which will be difficult to achieve with a different tuner. That is my dilema.
Your tune and ecu should prevent it from detonating on pump gas.
For cooling your IATs you will want to run a mix of water and meth (water is better for cooling then meth).
If you're running water and meth you will want a custom tune to take advantage of it.
I think if you want to take advantage of any/all of the benefits of a WI system you'll want a custom tune for it.
Your tune and ecu should prevent it from detonating on pump gas.
For cooling your IATs you will want to run a mix of water and meth (water is better for cooling then meth).
If you're running water and meth you will want a custom tune to take advantage of it.
I think if you want to take advantage of any/all of the benefits of a WI system you'll want a custom tune for it.
Agreed on the detonation issue. A bad tank of gas which is possible could cause me to detonate though. The 12 mm studs and dual fuel pumps with help that for sure, the heads won't lift but still I am pushing the limits of 94 with my set-up.
I would be running -35 washer fluid, it's cheap as hell up here so makes for a perfect solution. I totally agree with you on the custom tune, the question is how do I do that as EVOMS has only dabbled with water/meth in the past.
Don't get me wrong if there was an easy solution to the tuning problem I would take advantage of the extra power capabilities of such a system.
I will discuss this in more detail once Tony gets back from Europe. I have asked him the question re the tune.
For the $$$ spent it is a great addition to my car. Just like yours
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02' Seal Grey on Black TT with EVOMS GT800+, Water Cooled GT3076, EVOMSit To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. , EVOMS I/C's, 83 lbs Injectors, EVOMS dual fuel pump system, CF driveshaft, Sachs Stage 3 clutch, EVOMS motor build, 12mm head studs, GT30 Cams, 76MM TB, Custom gearbox, 3" Exhaust, 47mm Headers, 14" BBK, GT3R brake ducts, PSS9's, H&R Front & Rear Sway Bars, SS Brake Lines, EVOMS SSK, EVOMS V-Flow, V1, K40 LD5500, Recaro Sport Topline seats, Full OEM GT2 Front Bumper conversion, OEM GT2 Rear deck lid and spoiler, Toyo RA1's 245/335 18's
No I realize that. It is more for ensuring my car does not detonate. The cooling effects also help the motor perform during hotter weather. My intent was got significant power gains which would obviously require a new tune which will be difficult to achieve with a different tuner. That is my dilema.
I think something like this is what you are looking for. It appears that it can be done, but you need to test to make sure you don't loose power. This was an answer to a similar question I had many moons ago:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ace996
You could always run small nozzles (5% fueling or under) and not retune. However, you'd need to double check the AFRs to make sure you don't run too rich. If AFRs are kept in check (a 50%water mix should not be an issue with small nozzles) then the system would mostly be added safety, from cooler intake charges and a detonation inhibitor (added octane). You probably wouldn't see gains on a cool motor, or a motor that didn't pull timing at high load/high rpm, but you wouldn't lose power from heatsoak and pulled timing when pushing your motor.
Really, the proper way is to retune a conservative map with the WI. You'll see better spool, higher power and torque, and a much improved powerband.
It seems like Tony really ran the WI on the car on the conservative side...and still pulled some fantastic results.
Be good,
TomK
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Your tune and ecu should prevent it from detonating on pump gas.
For cooling your IATs you will want to run a mix of water and meth (water is better for cooling then meth).
If you're running water and meth you will want a custom tune to take advantage of it.
I think if you want to take advantage of any/all of the benefits of a WI system you'll want a custom tune for it.
I agree with auidikp and the post quoted above by Prch951.
Adding meth for safety against a bad batch of gas is a great idea, but it will have to be retuned because it will richen the mixture if not accounted for properly.
There is no way to add it properly without a tune.
Ben, what are your power goals? The buffet style approach at these power levels are counterproductive in my opinion and dangerous.Formulate some goals and stick to them. I made approximately 680 AWHP on ACTUAL pump fuel with an ACTUAL pump file. I decided to have Todd turn the car down to 653AWHP because I chose to do so, not because it was unsafe. I took it to the roadcourse and turned the gates back two turns and added 100 as a safety measure. The car has 1000 miles so far and has run flawlessly and safely. If I get the bug for more power, well I can always add MS109 and go over 950 with my second file. Your car will make more power on ACTUAL pump gas safely running an ACTUAL pump file than most cars on race fuel..... Good luck.
__________________ TX Mile Results: 2.8MPH Slower Than Topgun
Ben, what are your power goals? The buffet style approach at these power levels are counterproductive in my opinion and dangerous.Formulate some goals and stick to them. I made approximately 680 AWHP on ACTUAL pump fuel with an ACTUAL pump file. I decided to have Todd turn the car down to 653AWHP because I chose to do so, not because it was unsafe. I took it to the roadcourse and turned the gates back two turns and added 100 as a safety measure. The car has 1000 miles so far and has run flawlessly and safely. If I get the bug for more power, well I can always add MS109 and go over 950 with my second file. Your car will make more power on ACTUAL pump gas safely running an ACTUAL pump file than most cars on race fuel..... Good luck.
Wait....so you're saying that a car running Pump Gas with a Pump Gas Tune will be "safer" then a car running Race Gas with a Race Gas Tune??
Wait....so you're saying that a car running Pump Gas with a Pump Gas Tune will be "safer" then a car running Race Gas with a Race Gas Tune??
Read the post..what I am saying is pick your goals and stick to them.... EVOMS has pump gas files for pump gas and Race gas files for race gas, both are safe and do not need Aquamist....
__________________ TX Mile Results: 2.8MPH Slower Than Topgun
Read the post..what I am saying is pick your goals and stick to them.... EVOMS has pump gas files for pump gas and Race gas files for race gas, both are safe and do not need Aquamist....
I did read your post...hence my question.... I guess I don't understand this comment "Your car will make more power on ACTUAL pump gas safely running an ACTUAL pump file than most cars on race fuel...." Why do you say that?
It is my understanding that it is safer to run race gas over pump gas....(with any OTS tune)...based on your comment about running 100 at the track I'm assuming you agree with that statement.
It sounded to me like the OP's goals were that he wants to help cooling in warmer weather, and have increased octane (i'm assuming to reduce CFs and help prevent detonation). Seems to me like he has a couple options.... He could run pump gas+WI or a race gas and a respective tune. ...or less power!
I did read your post...hence my question.... I guess I don't understand this comment "Your car will make more power on ACTUAL pump gas safely running an ACTUAL pump file than most cars on race fuel...." Why do you say that?
It is my understanding that it is safer to run race gas over pump gas....(with any OTS tune)...based on your comment about running 100 at the track I'm assuming you agree with that statement.
It sounded to me like the OP's goals were that he wants to help cooling in warmer weather, and have increased octane (i'm assuming to reduce CFs and help prevent detonation). Seems to me like he has a couple options.... He could run pump gas+WI or a race gas and a respective tune. ...or less power!
I agree completely with the race fuel at the track for an added safety margin, you would be a fool not to do it.
Ben is looking for an added safety margin on pump fuel, what I am trying to say is given his combination of heads,cams etc. that he will make more power on ACTUAL pump than most cars that are running race fuel or pump fuel /meth. If he is overly concerned about safety, he can turn it down a bit more for his comfort level. The reason I capitlize ACTUAL pump is because the way EPL promotes pump fuel numbers. Those numbers are actually race fuel parameters, as Tony has said himself in many posts, that are achieved with an economical mix of pump and meth and are not comprable to ACTUAL pump fuel numbers. If any EPL pump /meth tune ran on actual pump fuel alone....it would not last long.
__________________ TX Mile Results: 2.8MPH Slower Than Topgun
I agree completely with the race fuel at the track for an added safety margin, you would be a fool not to do it.
Ben is looking for an added safety margin on pump fuel, what I am trying to say is given his combination of heads,cams etc. that he will make more power on ACTUAL pump than most cars that are running race fuel or pump fuel /meth. If he is overly concerned about safety, he can turn it down a bit more for his comfort level. The reason I capitlize ACTUAL pump is because the way EPL promotes pump fuel numbers. Those numbers are actually race fuel parameters, as Tony has said himself in many posts, that are achieved with an economical mix of pump and meth and are not comprable to ACTUAL pump fuel numbers. If any EPL pump /meth tune ran on actual pump fuel alone....it would not last long.
I guess if you're comparing one car to another....but when you're just concerned about your own car...its a different story. My car has a pump gas tune and I run pump gas daily. I also have WI. Its still a pump gas file. When I run race gas and a race gas tune I make higher numbers. I understand your point if you want to compare different tunes, builds, cars, etc. but for accomplishing your own goals I think there is certainly a difference between running WI and pump gas and straight pump gas.
WI has other benefits then just added octane....you can add larger IC's to improve IAT deltas, but people don't make comments about numbers on pump gas being inflated b/c of it... Same goes for adding making other hardware upgrades....
I agree completely with the race fuel at the track for an added safety margin, you would be a fool not to do it.
Ben is looking for an added safety margin on pump fuel, what I am trying to say is given his combination of heads,cams etc. that he will make more power on ACTUAL pump than most cars that are running race fuel or pump fuel /meth. If he is overly concerned about safety, he can turn it down a bit more for his comfort level. The reason I capitlize ACTUAL pump is because the way EPL promotes pump fuel numbers. Those numbers are actually race fuel parameters, as Tony has said himself in many posts, that are achieved with an economical mix of pump and meth and are not comprable to ACTUAL pump fuel numbers. If any EPL pump /meth tune ran on actual pump fuel alone....it would not last long.
Hey Kevin,
Glad to hear your car is running perfectly, you waited a long time for that!!!
I am interested in the WI system for the reasons I stated. It gets in the low 100's here in the summer. I notice how the car looses power in those conditions so going with a WI system that will dramatically lower my IAT will help considerably plus boost my octane. I am assuming with the head studs EVOMS will be able to run my car at 28 lbs+ boost. If not then it will have been a waste of money doing that? In reality there are limits to what 94 can do.
WI offers lots of benefits with no negatives that I can see assuming the tune is designed for it. Race fuel is a joke up here ($1000 for 200 liters) so that is out of the question. WI is my only real option that works and is dirt cheap by comparison and I can get -35 washer fluid anywhere.
I intend to find a solution, EVOMS has played around with it but their focus is elsewhere so I have to find a solution somehow. I did ask John about it. They were talking about doing a WI system but I have not heard anymore.
Race fuel is the ideal for sure but it is so cost prohibitive in Canada!
The research continues.
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02' Seal Grey on Black TT with EVOMS GT800+, Water Cooled GT3076, EVOMSit To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. , EVOMS I/C's, 83 lbs Injectors, EVOMS dual fuel pump system, CF driveshaft, Sachs Stage 3 clutch, EVOMS motor build, 12mm head studs, GT30 Cams, 76MM TB, Custom gearbox, 3" Exhaust, 47mm Headers, 14" BBK, GT3R brake ducts, PSS9's, H&R Front & Rear Sway Bars, SS Brake Lines, EVOMS SSK, EVOMS V-Flow, V1, K40 LD5500, Recaro Sport Topline seats, Full OEM GT2 Front Bumper conversion, OEM GT2 Rear deck lid and spoiler, Toyo RA1's 245/335 18's
Glad to hear your car is running perfectly, you waited a long time for that!!!
I am interested in the WI system for the reasons I stated. It gets in the low 100's here in the summer. I notice how the car looses power in those conditions so going with a WI system that will dramatically lower my IAT will help considerably plus boost my octane. I am assuming with the head studs EVOMS will be able to run my car at 28 lbs+ boost. If not then it will have been a waste of money doing that? In reality there are limits to what 94 can do.
WI offers lots of benefits with no negatives that I can see assuming the tune is designed for it. Race fuel is a joke up here ($1000 for 200 liters) so that is out of the question. WI is my only real option that works and is dirt cheap by comparison and I can get -35 washer fluid anywhere.
I intend to find a solution, EVOMS has played around with it but their focus is elsewhere so I have to find a solution somehow. I did ask John about it. They were talking about doing a WI system but I have not heard anymore.
Race fuel is the ideal for sure but it is so cost prohibitive in Canada!
The research continues.
Ben, 100% satisfied. My wife has been taking the kids to ball games with the car, very civilized. I see what you are getting at with the heat, I would not have guessed you even have Summer up there let alone 100+F days. I realize that the whole water/meth system is a great sytem and economical to run at race gas settings with pump gas only, but it appears to me to be an "integrated" system as opposed to a " bolt on" system. I know it physically is a bolt on but needs to be tuned/integrated into the system to achieve the proper benefits /protection. That is ultimately your choice, but I am happy letting Motronic do its thing. I am running 1.4 on Sunoco 94 around here and my Zeitronix has been logging boost and it is right on the mark... until recently since the weather was very hot and humid and boost slowly reduced to about 1.2 last week. Yup, it lost power, I could feel it, but it was doing what it was designed to do. Yesterday was in the 60s and boost was back to a solid 1.4.... Good luck, I am picking up Tom and Joe's car mid July, if your is still there I would be happy to test drive it for you!
__________________ TX Mile Results: 2.8MPH Slower Than Topgun
with my second file. Your car will make more power on ACTUAL pump gas safely running an ACTUAL pump file than most cars on race fuel..... Good luck.
..what I am saying is pick your goals and stick to them.... EVOMS has pump gas files for pump gas and Race gas files for race gas, both are safe and do not need Aquamist....
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