996 Turbo / GT2Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2004 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2. Sponsored By Vivid Racing
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60-130 is a measure that I really hate. It basically is for people who are too big of babies to set foot on a track because they are afraid they could miss a gear due to ****ty driving. Even rolling out of the hole and making a complete pass can show a true guesstimate of how much power the car is really making. That is why there is NO 60-130 HP CALCULATOR! The fact that 60-130 is really gimped by gearing on some cars, like a Vette with stock 3.42's and a stock transmission (Non-z06). They have to start in 2nd gear and have 2 shifts which kills the 60-130.
My fastest 60-130 times have been with 2-shifts.
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Further more please stop bringing up the fact that Pump + Meth is the same as 109octane race gas files. It's equiv to MAYBE a 100oct file which in a EPL cars case the car is tuned with really low timing so that it can safely run on pump+meth and still run a decent amount of boost to make the power.
Wrong. Muscle Mustangs and FF did an article on this topic last month. They compared the HP from a car with advanced timing running 117 octane fuel to the same car running 93 + water/meth. The car made 469 and 470 rwhp, repectively. A tie. http://www.musclemustangfastfords.co...son/index.html
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Sorry if I offend people here, but I'm really getting tired of 60-130 this... 60-130 that... Take the car to the f***ing 1/4 mile if you want a real measure of power. The only thing you are doing with 60-130 is comparing yourself to other Porsches, and that's not what you are going to run into on the street.
You are incorrect, but I'm not going to spend the time explaining why.
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No, because you can't run out of IC on a long drive.
Race fuel, W/I and NOS are all the same in my book. If you want to squeeze the most out of your car, then go for it. But there is no difference in my book. They are not what you use day in and day out. If your car can't race on pump gas because it has a race tune or if you are squeezing something out of a bottle that eventually runs out, it is all the same.
Its pretty hard to run out of meth...about as likely as running out of gas IMO...
And in my case, if I did, my car is no slouch at wg boost...
So what is the goal of comparing here then? The OP was comparing gt28s to 24/18gs..... there are differences in hardware....
My only reason for responding to this thread was due to the OPs statements that the 60-130 is a flawed way of measuring acceleration, which it isn't.
His car ran what it ran, and others making more power than he is ran what they ran. The 60-130 measurement isn't flawed at all. His car is simply slower than the cars he's comparing his to.
I have seen both your brothers car and Scotts car go and you are wrong if you think your brothers car would win in a roll on.
The 60-130 doesn't break axels which is no big deal on cheap American muscle but is a very big (financial) deal on German cars (I was going to run the 1/4 in my M3 the other night until I saw another E46 break its axel).
I have tremendous respect for 1/4 miling and road coursing. Why is it that people who have ****ty 60-130 times are the only ones who don't respect the 60-130? Why has Jason said about 20 times that he doesn't care about his 60-130 when clearly he does care?
Sean do you think before you speak? The only way Scott would have won is if Matt spun... That's it... Scott did not have brake boosting and have you ever seen how hard a Nitrous car jumps if it has traction... Scott would have to shift into 5th before Matt even got out of 4th. SHIFTING LOSES GROUND! 148mph on his best mph (Granted these were his old 30s, he THINKS it would have gone a 150mph with his new ones) vs 147mph on a pass with the progressive set really conservative. If you aren't sure what a progressive does do a little search on Google about how a Nitrous Progressive Controller works... Maybe you can learn about something before you open your mouth and spew bull****. Sean I consider you a friend, but dude please just think about things before you speak.
Let me tell you something about a car that goes those kind of speeds in the 1/4. Going from a 300-400shot would gain Matt MAYBE 2-3mph. It will not pick up 10+mph just like when you add a 100shot to a stock car. Drag racing is something I know more about than probably 80% of this forum and honestly I've been faster in the 1/4 than anyone in this thread (8.9s @ 151 launching on motor and spraying 40-50ft out). I bet you'd **** bricks if you saw that 60-130 because at the ~1000ft I was out of gear and just stood on the rev limiter. Think about it like this... It took 5.7sec to get from 0-125mph and I didn't even use the N2O for the first little bit of it. My 1/8th mile MPH showed the car should have gone 156-160 or so mph. Woulda, coulda, should've though.. That was in the past. I was the 4th or 5th Nitrous LS1 in the 8s over 4 years ago now I'm in the Porsche world to kick ass and take names.
If anyone thinks I care about 60-130 should really pay attention to my threads about 60-130 and my showing to run my car at the events (although Peter and John put on an awesome event to go watch, I just don't like the measurement). I have 1 pass on high boost and I had _Zac with me and I ran a 6.2 in ~60* weather... If I cared more I'd have kicked his ass out of the car and waited till 3am (when it was in the high 40s) and done the pass. Maybe when it gets cold again I'll bring the car out with my soon to be RWD swap and my possible new heart and veins and crack off a number.
I don't own my Porsche any more. Not sure why it's being discussed here. That said, I was half a car behind a TT Viper that trapped 152 on street tires. I had a passenger, he did not. If I didn't have a passenger, well.....
We will never know who would have won in a roll-on race between my car and Matt's. So it doesn't really matter.
FYI; when I would only shift once, my 60-130 times were typically low 5's...same as your brothers.
Its pretty hard to run out of meth...about as likely as running out of gas IMO...
And in my case, if I did, my car is no slouch at wg boost...
still doesn't change the fact that it is a race file of sorts. Truly if you want to compare apples to apples, and both cars are fitted and tuned with WI then I can see that. Or both cars tuned to C16, 109, 250 shot of NOS, or just run them both on pump file on pump gas plus 3-4 gallons of 100 or 109(for safety as some people have indicated in the past).
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Wrong. Muscle Mustangs and FF did an article on this topic last month. They compared the HP from a car with advanced timing running 117 octane fuel to the same car running 93 + water/meth. The car made 469 and 470 rwhp, repectively. A tie. http://www.musclemustangfastfords.co...son/index.html
You are incorrect, but I'm not going to spend the time explaining why.
I think if you would have had brake boosting you're 60-130's would have been significantly better because you could have eliminated a shift. Plus a race between a big n2o car vs a turbo car would be a real toss up. If your lag was ANYTHING like mine is then he'd have 3-4 cars on you before you even got fully into boost. I know this because on motor alone my brother jumped out 4 cars on me before I even got into full boost.
Bro I've never ever disagreed with you on many major topics, but if you think comparing a 60-130 time will decide a roll race outcome then you are FAR from right. Roll races aren't just 60-130. Personally I prefer 30/40-130 because I don't think going much faster on a freeway with someone next to you doing the same is very safe. Maybe I'll consider a 140mph if I run it in the 1/4 because then at least I'm running till I finished my 1/4 Mph.
I don't own my Porsche any more. Not sure why it's being discussed here. That said, I was half a car behind a TT Viper that trapped 152 on street tires. I had a passenger, he did not. If I didn't have a passenger, well.....
We will never know who would have won in a roll-on race between my car and Matt's. So it doesn't really matter.
FYI; when I would only shift once, my 60-130 times were typically low 5's...same as your brothers.
Yup you are right, the race never could happen again. We did not make the street meet when you were in town and you had to leave the next day. Which sucks cause I wanted to get to meet you while you were here. Anyway back to the topic. I've got a few hours before I'm headed to the new house to do more so lets get back on topic so we can get Sean to write a song about me.
. Personally I prefer 30/40-130 because I don't think going much faster on a freeway with someone next to you doing the same is very safe. Maybe I'll consider a 140mph if I run it in the 1/4 because then at least I'm running till I finished my 1/4 Mph.
not a bad idea at all. a 100 mph difference would tell a lot.
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My only reason for responding to this thread was due to the OPs statements that the 60-130 is a flawed way of measuring acceleration, which it isn't.
His car ran what it ran, and others making more power than he is ran what they ran. The 60-130 measurement isn't flawed at all. His car is simply slower than the cars he's comparing his to.
I never said it was flawed that was Jason. I just wanted to know why is the times so low. I can tell you my car is a lot faster then a 997tt with a flash, I raced one. So I wanted to know if there is a way to do a calibration or is there any special methods of getting the best time. I dont see how someone with the same car and hp/tq is going to pull on me by 10-20 car lengths. I have a tip so I dont even have to shift.
Yup you are right, the race never could happen again. We did not make the street meet when you were in town and you had to leave the next day. Which sucks cause I wanted to get to meet you while you were here. Anyway back to the topic. I've got a few hours before I'm headed to the new house to do more so lets get back on topic so we can get Sean to write a song about me.
I'm going to try and make it next year, but of course I'll be in a car with 150 or so less HP than my last one had.
Sorry, I was talking about Jason. I shouldn't have used the term "OP". I know it wasn't you.
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I just wanted to know why is the times so low. I can tell you my car is a lot faster then a 997tt with a flash, I raced one. So I wanted to know if there is a way to do a calibration or is there any special methods of getting the best time. I dont see how someone with the same car and hp/tq is going to pull on me by 10-20 car lengths. I have a tip so I dont even have to shift.
Which 997TT with a flash are you guys talking about? Obviously, your car is faster than one.
still doesn't change the fact that it is a race file of sorts. Truly if you want to compare apples to apples, and both cars are fitted and tuned with WI then I can see that. Or both cars tuned to C16, 109, 250 shot of NOS, or just run them both on pump file on pump gas plus 3-4 gallons of 100 or 109(for safety as some people have indicated in the past).
When was the last time there was an true "apples to apples" comparison....people race different cars, different turbos, different tunes, different overall mods. I don't see how pump + 50/50 WI disqualifies or makes a comparison unfair. Someone who spends $$$ on ICs, larger intake tracks, weight reductions, etc...and someone else spends $ on a WI kit... go ahead and compare each cars acceleration speeds... whats the big deal?!
Wrong. Muscle Mustangs and FF did an article on this topic last month. They compared the HP from a car with advanced timing running 117 octane fuel to the same car running 93 + water/meth. The car made 469 and 470 rwhp, repectively. A tie. http://www.musclemustangfastfords.co...son/index.html
Thanks for sharing this article...interesting test.
But with same boost and same timing... isn't it expected that the dyno numbers would be very similar? I would think race gas is going to allow you to run more timing and/or more boost than pump + meth mix....
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