996 Turbo / GT2Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2004 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2. Sponsored By Vivid Racing
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the intermediate shaft noise on 996tt have a great tolerance
your car is on the upper tolerance, i didnt hear it over 1100 rpm corse the video is only on idle
the tolerance can be reduced, but it need a lot of time, work and money
if the engine is complete cold the noise begins after 5minutes warm up, if the engine is realy hot the noise should be reduced...if the engine is not cold and not realy warm the noise is more....
x50 engines have a different oilpump (greater) so the noise is not so loud for my experience / my 2002 was most on great tolerance and more noise than other modellyears
over 1100/1200 rpm it should not be a noice
sorry about my bad english, i am a bavarian and try to do my very best
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Porsche 996 GT2 Clubsport, BMW Alpina B10 3,5,, BMW E30 2,7 Stroke Kit, BMW E30 Cabrio 2,7 Stroke Kit, BMW E30 325i MTech 2, BMW E46 328i Coupe, BMW 530d GT 09
Folks you need to draw a line in the sand and jump into two different groups. The first group is folks with noise at start up and idle. The shaft and chain noise makes a racket and smooths out above 2500 RPM's. One can change your oil to a 5W50 weight Mobil 1 sells a Porsche approved oil for this application. The noise will drop around 35 to 45%.
The second group has folks that have noises at idle and past 2500RPM's the noise grows louder and will not go away. The solution for this is to rebuild the engine and replace the intermediate shaft. The bean counters at Porsche removed the lock washers that have been in place for over 25 years. The bolts do not have enough stretch on them to hold the gear on the shaft. The gear will start to wobble, and metal will be found in your oil. If you pull your oil filter and look in the pleats you will find metal. The gear will back off the shaft and you will have a major engine failure. Interesting enough, I have seen more '02 failures with '03 running a close 2nd. X50 cars are failing more than non X50 cars.
Folks you need to draw a line in the sand and jump into two different groups. The first group is folks with noise at start up and idle. The shaft and chain noise makes a racket and smooths out above 2500 RPM's. One can change your oil to a 5W50 weight Mobil 1 sells a Porsche approved oil for this application. The noise will drop around 35 to 45%.
The second group has folks that have noises at idle and past 2500RPM's the noise grows louder and will not go away. The solution for this is to rebuild the engine and replace the intermediate shaft. The bean counters at Porsche removed the lock washers that have been in place for over 25 years. The bolts do not have enough stretch on them to hold the gear on the shaft. The gear will start to wobble, and metal will be found in your oil. If you pull your oil filter and look in the pleats you will find metal. The gear will back off the shaft and you will have a major engine failure. Interesting enough, I have seen more '02 failures with '03 running a close 2nd. X50 cars are failing more than non X50 cars.
So if I split the case what do you think I will find? Is it a problem with the shaft itself or is it the problem with the case casting? I noticed Porsche sells two different intermediate shaft sizes. Do these cars make noise because the gears are incorrect size or do they make it because the shaft is too far from the crank and the clearance between the gears is too great?
I had the same problem when I first bought my turbo. I posted my experience earlier this year. Mine sounded the same. Pm me if you'd like to.
What was the conclusion of your story. Your thread ended when the car was going under the knife to see if there was an issue. Did they open it up and discovered that IMS was indeed the culprit of the noise?
What was the conclusion of your story. Your thread ended when the car was going under the knife to see if there was an issue. Did they open it up and discovered that IMS was indeed the culprit of the noise?
I'd like to know what the issue was as well. Can someone with more posts PM him please.
Last edited by art@rmeuropean; 10-17-2009 at 09:46 PM.
Art, the different sizes refer to the LASH and matching gearset that is driven off the crankshaft. When you tear it apart you will see wiped out bearings and a gear that is running offset.
Michael, if you continue to run the engine with metal in the filter>it gets worse. The gear and chain will cut thru the #7 main webbing and eventually shed the chain or seize the gear set from metal chucks lodging between the two gears.
I'm told the intermediate gear chatter at idle is normal, mine certainly does but goes when you rev the engine, this can be fixed by replacing the gears as a pair but its not really that much of an issue, as said changing to a thicker oil 15w15 or 5w50 will improve.
I've always heard that IMS failures were the doom of the N/A engines. The info that supposedly bulletproof TT engine can succumb to the same malady is indeed very disconcerting since the TT engine will run at least double the costs of the N/A engine.
I tried to post last night, but my browser was giving me problems and I lost the whole post. In a nutshell, they found metal fragments (very small) in my oil prior to disassembly of the motor. The Porsche dealer stated that this would normally be enough to replace the engine if it was under the factory warranty. It wasn’t enough for my extended warranty company, so I had to dig deeper into the engine to find the failure point. The Porsche techs first noticed that the passenger side camshaft was scored and the lifters were worn. They dug deeper into the case and found the intermediate shaft bearings were worn through. This was enough to cover under warranty, but my warranty company has a “Like kind and quality” replacement clause. Basically, it means they will replace your engine with an engine from a salvaged vehicle. Uh…no thanks. I had to pony up $10k to get the Porsche reman engine. The plus is that it comes with a 2 year manufacturer’s warranty. They didn't specifically tell me what was the root cause. They said it would take more money than is necessary at this point to check runouts on the different shafts. They had enough to claim and that was as far as they were going to take it. It seems that Kevin's diagnosis is spot on.
Kevin, last question. If I replace the intermediate shaft bearings and the intermediate shaft, am I going to have the same problem in 30K miles? What causes those things to wear out? The car I purchased had oil changes every 5K miles so it is definitely not neglect.
Last edited by art@rmeuropean; 10-21-2009 at 10:19 PM.
My car sounds loud too (well it is a GT-800), but seems to go away at 1500 RPM. I am going to try the mystery oil additive thing and see how things go.
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