997 TT beats GT-R at Ring. Nissan accused of cheating.
997 Turbo / GT22004–present Turbo discussion on the current model Porsche 911 Twin Turbo. Sponsored By SharkWerks, Inc
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trommel, let me give you an example of the point. you work at an engineering facility as an engineer. I come over and tell your bosses, hey trommel is stupid and I am much better, look at my test results. So they believe me and fire you.... is that the way things work? no. I go get a job at the same place and I let my performance on the job speak for itself. I do not try to rob others of their glory and take short cuts to get to the top, which is exactly what the sleazy nissan reps did. In fact, I will go so far as to say, that I will not buy another nissan because of their little adv campaign.
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They are turning the ring into a circus by throwing a race car budget at it.
I guess we know where the MSRP increases this year and next are going.
If you have been to the 'Ring, you will know that pretty much all the major manufacturers (and a lot of smaller ones) have big-budget test facilities there - Nissan are no different. There's always something wearing a disguise going around.
Quote:
Originally Posted by heavychevy
I'm not concerned about the tires, but that GT-R had extra horsepower end of story.
There's so much more to lap times than power - you can do as as many guessing-game calculations about speeds on straights or whatever, but it is no substitute for being there.
The two standard, straight-off-the-boat, dyno'd at around 500 bhp cars the UK press first got hold of still managed to set extremely quick laptimes. Standard cars, standard tyres, known horsepower, zero Nissan involvement.
trommel, let me give you an example of the point. you work at an engineering facility as an engineer. I come over and tell your bosses, hey trommel is stupid and I am much better, look at my test results. So they believe me and fire you.... is that the way things work? no. I go get a job at the same place and I let my performance on the job speak for itself. I do not try to rob others of their glory and take short cuts to get to the top, which is exactly what the sleazy nissan reps did. In fact, I will go so far as to say, that I will not buy another nissan because of their little adv campaign.
Are you serious? The series of events:
1. A company launches a new car, which happens to be very effective around a circuit. A video (filmed in conjunction with a magazine) is put on the internet, showing real-time footage of a timed lap on a well-known circuit.
2. The internet goes wild when fans of other manufacturers of performance cars don't like the fact this car is quicker than their preferred model around a certain circuit.
3. Fanboy arguments and rumours, the majority cobbled together very amateurishly, circulate like wildfire for over a year.
4. Repeat 3 ad infinitum.
I've driven quite a few cars, and I've driven a GT-R (admittedly only on a track). It's a great car no matter who manufactured it, and I don't see how that takes anything away from Porsche, Corvette, Ferrari or whoever.
If you have been to the 'Ring, you will know that pretty much all the major manufacturers (and a lot of smaller ones) have big-budget test facilities there - Nissan are no different. There's always something wearing a disguise going around.
There's so much more to lap times than power - you can do as as many guessing-game calculations about speeds on straights or whatever, but it is no substitute for being there.
The two standard, straight-off-the-boat, dyno'd at around 500 bhp cars the UK press first got hold of still managed to set extremely quick laptimes. Standard cars, standard tyres, known horsepower, zero Nissan involvement.
How do you explain that?
I'm not explaining anything to any more trolls. You all come in here asking questions and answering none.
Explain to me how the 500 bhp GT-R runs faster down parts of the backstraight than the ZR-1 and Zonda.
Or dont bother, I'm not waisting any more time with trolls. This is a Porsche forum and I'm free to bash anything that isnt a Porsche if I want to, it's a simple as that. If you dont like it, leave.
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
Nissan picked the fight. They paraded the TT around with the GTR the whole time so it's pretty clear what statement they were making. Porsche laid low until they could find out for themselves and now they know. They have every right to call Nissan out when they suspect a smear campaign at their expense, and so do we.
Yeah these trolls are getting kinda annoying as well as these comparison threads.
Well this thread has served a great purpose here as a consolidation of trolls that have been plaguing all the various sections of the forum. We are keeping them occupied here. The usual trolls and the new ones are all here instead of posting thread after thread of GT-R garbage, even after being granted a section here which is B.S. in my opinion to begin with and still hasnt helped at all.
They are mad becuase there is now actually some honest press coming out on how Nissan has lied and cheated to get their way. But the GT-R owners are the ones who are getting screwed.
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
Behavioral Psychology holds that you continue doing something because you are some how being rewarded for it. Now, I know that if I were to head over to NAGTROC and start spouting off about how great Porsches are and that they are far superior to Nissans (which of course, is true) I'm going to get flamed to death. So, I don't bother. Also, I don't want to read about all that GTR coolaid that we know to be hype and lies. The trolls must like catching hell, that's all I can figure.
Hey, in that picture that has the Nissan head (can't think of his name) with Chuck Norris throwing a kick at him, The Nissan guy looks like Godzilla!
It does have a strong resemblance to godzilla..... HAHAHA
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
Well this thread has served a great purpose here as a consolidation of trolls that have been plaguing all the various sections of the forum. We are keeping them occupied here. The usual trolls and the new ones are all here instead of posting thread after thread of GT-R garbage, even after being granted a section here which is B.S. in my opinion to begin with and still hasnt helped at all.
They are mad becuase there is now actually some honest press coming out on how Nissan has lied and cheated to get their way. But the GT-R owners are the ones who are getting screwed.
I find it entertaining that the world's biggest motoring forum troll is accusing me of the same behaviour.
I have a GT-R arriving in July next year, this week I've been looking at used 997 Turbos. Does that make me a fanboy? I don't think so.
Show facts (hard evidence, the truth, reality) which prove the 'Ring laptime is incorrect and that the press cars are not standard - not hearsay, not fabricated figures, not adolescent nonsense, but facts. Then you may be taken more seriously.
Until then these interminable posts of unfounded criticism make you look like a teenager with a weird agenda.
The video clearly shows Nissan's chief test driver Tochio Suzuki making the 7-minute, 29-second lap, and the Japanese automaker has even offered images of the actual tires used in the test.
Inside Line says: Even the biggest GT-R skeptics can't deny the cold, hard facts now presented by Nissan. — Mike Lysaght, Correspondent
This has been explained to you a zillion times already. You are just choosing to ignore it. Please go and find a better excuse than this one which you keep on using and re-using and re-using and re-using......C'mon HC, don't you know that a good magician never shows the same trick to the same audience more than once? Your fans are waiting for your next trick. Don't disappoint now.
Nothing has been explained here..... Care to do it for us? Go back through the posts and see if I'm the only one who finds it suspect. This has been gone over in this thread several times and not one decent answer.
The majority of the whole automotive world agrees that Nissan has been lying, so if you look around, you'll likely find less people in your corner than you think.
Again, dont try to make this personal, just state some real facts. Some that you actually though of and arent pasting from Nagtroc might help because I've seen those already.
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
That link just sent me to buy a car, had nothing to do with anything. But as for what you quoted. Again, let's see a test that was indeed witnessed and proven to be factual with a factory stock car proven by others than NISSAN? it doesn't exist. Seems like everyone is calling foul.
Let's see voided warranty, 20K clutch replacement, 7k brake replacement, lies by Nissan. Oh yah, that makes me want to go out and buy one. A porcherboy, troll, whomever you are, why don't you go buy one and then hit your local track, I am sure we can find a few 6speeders that would be more than happy to put that car in it's place, way down the line, kinda like what happened in the "one lap of America" where it came in outside of the top 10, being beaten by porsche, Vette's and Vipers
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