997 TT beats GT-R at Ring. Nissan accused of cheating.
997 Turbo / GT22004–present Turbo discussion on the current model Porsche 911 Twin Turbo. Sponsored By SharkWerks, Inc
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Wow! Well said and to the point. I guess anyone that hasn't driven the GTR including myself is guilty for mag-racing and speculating, regardless which side you're on, whether you're hatin on the GTR or a fan of the GTR. I honestly think that the whole issue of the 7:29 in The Ring doesn't really matter because if it is proven which it has been already with the video, GTR haters will still not give the GTR any credit or validation. On the other hand, the issue with the warranty being voided if the VDC is off and the LC being used is just utterly ridiculous and unfair. Nissan should be embarrased about this and should get sued for this and i hope the owners that are having problems with this should be properly taken care of and not a dime should come out of their pocket. JMHO
BTW, can we move on and just stop childish bickering. Seriously, it's just a car, try not to take this so personal. Unless you're one of the GTR owners that are having problems with the warranty, there's really no need to be upset about Nissan or the GTR. And if Nissan is lying, which i don't think they are, at least not with the 7:29 time, so what. Again, I think and almost sure that the only thing that Nissan is lying about is the HP of the GTR. And if you think about it, the 997TT has the upper hand since the GTR has to make so much more power just to match the 997TT's performance. Cheers.
At last, half-way sensible posts.
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IMO Launch Control/Warranty Void Mode should be removed as a performance enhancer and/or selling point unless Nissan will honor it's use, otherwise it's absolutely absurd.
That being said, no one realizes aside from the obvious warranty issues that Nissan should be ashamed of, that the performance point is really moot until a head to head comparo is done with full verification of both cars by independent sources, around the ring or not.
So far P-car owners whine about "magazine racers/PS3 fanboys/etc " coming in and talking about the GTR like they have driven it.
I still have to ask, aside from Chrisn (who is so obviously above this ridiculous pettiness) how many of you have had the keys to one??
HC?? How many hotlaps have you made in a US spec GTR?
HC, I respect your extensive track experience, but point is, you have never driven one or done any hotlaps with one. Considering the whole magazine racer argument, do come back with seat time in one and then talk about what a retail GTR feels like to drive based on experience. Until then, everything you say is still conjecture, albeit informed conjecture.
As for the rest of the P-car owners who seem to have little to actually contribute to the argument, do pull your tongues out of HC's ass.
He doesn't need the ego boost nor the cheer-leading, and you don't need his defense of your TTs from the GTR.
While I agree to a certain point, me driving a GT-R isnt going to be any confirmation of a ring time. I fully acknowledge that its a fast car, but until I see them without obviously inconsistent mag results, some of which obviously rigged, and beating the guys I knowto be fast in GT3's and Z06's, then I wont be convinced.
There is no way to really make a comparison based judgement unless you are driving them all GT2,GT3, GT-R, Z06, CGT, Scud etc etc etc. I have no interest in driving the GT-R either, so it will have to be a case where I'm asked to do so, because there wont be any where I will seek the opportunity.
Beyond that, this is a forum of mostly grown men here posting, so telling them what to do isnt going to carry any weight. I get the most heat in this thread from the fanboys, and onversely the most support from people with similar opinions. So like I always say, until you can balance out your arguement, which is clearly one sided (and on foreign turf no less), and show yourself a reputable member of this forum, your demands and ctiticisms wont gain much ground.
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
Wow! Well said and to the point. I guess anyone that hasn't driven the GTR including myself is guilty for mag-racing and speculating, regardless which side you're on, whether you're hatin on the GTR or a fan of the GTR. I honestly think that the whole issue of the 7:29 in The Ring doesn't really matter because if it is proven which it has been already with the video, GTR haters will still not give the GTR any credit or validation. On the other hand, the issue with the warranty being voided if the VDC is off and the LC being used is just utterly ridiculous and unfair. Nissan should be embarrased about this and should get sued for this and i hope the owners that are having problems with this should be properly taken care of and not a dime should come out of their pocket. JMHO
BTW, can we move on and just stop childish bickering. Seriously, it's just a car, try not to take this so personal. Unless you're one of the GTR owners that are having problems with the warranty, there's really no need to be upset about Nissan or the GTR. And if Nissan is lying, which i don't think they are, at least not with the 7:29 time, so what. Again, I think and almost sure that the only thing that Nissan is lying about is the HP of the GTR. And if you think about it, the 997TT has the upper hand since the GTR has to make so much more power just to match the 997TT's performance. Cheers.
You still stuck on this extra hp despite there being no support for it. Many of the tuners say the clutch/ tranny can only handle 600 BHP for about a year before going. So how then can people be gaining lots of power over stock and not replacing clutches for which there arent any solutions?????
THE GT-R DOES NOT MAKE MORE POWER THAN THE TURBO!!!!!!
And finally, I'm sick of the whining about closing the thread, it's not going anywhere and is beneficial to the point of keeping all the GT-R huggers in this thread. And the only ones who seem to want it to dissapear are the ones who cant stand to see the truth come out about the car and it's flaws. You cant cover it up forever. SO GET OVER IT!!!!!! This thread is here to stay, and if not, I'll start another one.
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
See Evo and Car magazine for details.
Last edited by heavychevy; 10-11-2008 at 02:40 AM.
Of course the global economy has a lot to do with this, but it's been obvious from day one that the GT-R isnt a cash cow for Nissan, in fact just the opposite, I bet that recall in Japan cost them a fortune. Now with durability issues questioned, and Nissan down heavily on sales for September (like everyone else), they cant afford to throw money away.
But in lue of the current global economy problem, it does give light to what sectors of companies might be losing money, they are always the first to take a hit. Similar to the ZR-1 with GM. Just like ZR-1's are being affected by large numbers of Z06's and C6's sitting on lots, the GT-R is affected similarly by the 350z's sitting around.
__________________ The GT-R is harder to drift than a 997 TT or 997 GT3, therefore if you are trying to drift, the GT-R will consequently get a faster lap. Normal apexing and driving not included.
You still stuck on this extra hp despite there being no support for it. Many of the tuners say the clutch/ tranny can only handle 600 BHP for about a year before going. So how then can people be gaining lots of power over stock and not replacing clutches for which there arent any solutions?????
THE GT-R DOES NOT MAKE MORE POWER THAN THE TURBO!!!!!!
And finally, I'm sick of the whining about closing the thread, it's not going anywhere and is beneficial to the point of keeping all the GT-R huggers in this thread. And the only ones who seem to want it to dissapear are the ones who cant stand to see the truth come out about the car and it's flaws. You cant cover it up forever. SO GET OVER IT!!!!!! This thread is here to stay, and if not, I'll start another one.
No support? What are you talking about, I showed you two dyno-test confirming the GTR is making more than the advertised 485hp. One with 430hp at the wheel and the other at 457hp at the wheel, btw not from the flywheel. You're the only one that is saying that, everywhere else that i've read especially in M3post where the GTR is just as hated is saying the same thing that the GTR is well under-rated. What support do you have that it is not. And again, this is the only logical explanation on how it is able to virtually match 997TT's performance. How else can you explain it. The Amuse dyno chart, isn't that 612hp at the wheel. And what is it with your obsession with the GTR not being better than the 997tt, i got news for you, it isn't. Just because it's making more power than the 997TT, it doesn't mean it is better. Why don't you GET OVER THAT. You posting articles from Autoblog or any other websites does not prove anything either, just like you didn't consider the dyno test charts that i posted as proofs. If you think the guys from Motor Trend are morons and you know better, that's fine, but at least show something to prove them wrong. But don't just show another article, show some actual proof if you think you know better. BTW, i never said the GTR is making over 600hp at the wheel, i'm guestimating 540hp minimum and probably around 575hp at the crank, not at the wheel.
Cons:
- DCT fails if LC is Enabled + VDC Off (CHECK)
- WARRANTY: It stays if you drive like a sissy - VDC ON (CHECK)
- Wheel hop (CHECK)
- Overweight (CHECK)
- Blackbox: Forces you to pay the dealer any amount they ask for whether you like it or not (CHECK)
- Stupid owners launching 50 to 100 times expecting the horsepower to increase automatically after an oil change (PS3/GT5 technique) (CHECK)
- Nissan has given the word ugly a new meaning (CHECK from all 5 continents)
- $20k ~ $35k over MSRP for a beefed up altima coupe based on a fwd with 350Z headlights that turns it into a rwd then comes in the 4wd from Infiniti FX (CHECK)
- Fanboys start to sign up at every porsche message board to defend their only dream/supercar that ran a 7.29 with the help of Hollywood film editors and Walt Disney (CHECK x100)
Pros:
- Every fanboy will own a 2nd hand by mid 2009 with a broken tranny
- Ricey body kits will start to flood the market
- Eventually the hypocrites will start drag racing when they find out how to fix or replace that $200 gackbox (what happened to "it was only meant to be driven on the track" )
- 90% will end up getting totalled (beautiful ending for a Japanese legend that had nothing but issues since day 1)
Heavychevy is the one that posted the link with that picture, i just posted the pic to show the reading of the dyno. I can't read japanese either, sorry. But if you look closer, you can see that the dyno is reading 611, i'm almost sure that is the whp reading.
Yes i know, HC is just showing me how much power is the GTR making with all that upgrade. I'm not sure if he knows if that is from the wheel or the crank, i'm almost sure it's from the wheel. HC and I are arguing about the GTR's real HP, i'm saying they're well under-rated, he's saying they're not.
Cons:
- DCT fails if LC is Enabled + VDC Off (CHECK)
- WARRANTY: It stays if you drive like a sissy - VDC ON (CHECK)
- Wheel hop (CHECK)
- Overweight (CHECK)
- Blackbox: Forces you to pay the dealer any amount they ask for whether you like it or not (CHECK)
- Stupid owners launching 50 to 100 times expecting the horsepower to increase automatically after an oil change (PS3/GT5 technique) (CHECK)
- Nissan has given the word ugly a new meaning (CHECK from all 5 continents)
- $20k ~ $35k over MSRP for a beefed up altima coupe based on a fwd with 350Z headlights that turns it into a rwd then comes in the 4wd from Infiniti FX (CHECK)
- Fanboys start to sign up at every porsche message board to defend their only dream/supercar that ran a 7.29 with the help of Hollywood film editors and Walt Disney (CHECK x100)
Pros:
- Every fanboy will own a 2nd hand by mid 2009 with a broken tranny
- Ricey body kits will start to flood the market
- Eventually the hypocrites will start drag racing when they find out how to fix or replace that $200 gackbox (what happened to "it was only meant to be driven on the track" )
- 90% will end up getting totalled (beautiful ending for a Japanese legend that had nothing but issues since day 1)
280hp / 112mph Skyline GTR V.Spec II
__________________
Regards,
Can
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You are aware of this thread right? Variable power ratings! The point is, why bother discussing power figures from this car? If there are such variations in power ratings, why bother? It's like entering a lottery, why bother?
It's lies, more lies, explanations, excuses.
http://www.rennteam.com/showthreaded...04&page=0&vc=1
Firstly we found that a japanese spec GT-R was quite noticeably quicker than a US-spec GT-R, also from within a batch of 12 US spec GT-Rs when lapped around Silverstone's GP circuit they were not all equal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaeS4
Heavychevy is the one that posted the link with that picture, i just posted the pic to show the reading of the dyno. I can't read japanese either, sorry. But if you look closer, you can see that the dyno is reading 611, i'm almost sure that is the whp reading.
__________________
Regards,
Can
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