997Current model of the 911 C2, C2s, C4, C4S, Targa and Cabriolet Discussion. Sponsored ByHRE Wheels
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I am amazed at this car !!! They kept PDK and DFI out . That surprised me . The manual transmission and power upgrade as well as the aerodynamic changes hint at such a drivers' car . Plus this car looks like it could be driven daily or certainly as a weekend vehicle .
I wonder if PDK was more geared towards comfort and convenience . Fast paced luxury . I scratch my head if DFi was a means of generating a Hp bump with fuel efficiency, street use and cost in mind.
Is the new Gt3 the last pure Porsche ?
Does the omission PDK and DfI change anyones perception of those items ?
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PDK is heavier, plus, in the GT3 you bet it would get paddles, requiring some more time plus creating controversy with the initial button offering (a mistake).
DI on the GT3 would most likely come with completely new architecture, as in ditching the GT1 block. This would prove far too controversial right now. Not to mention DI gets challenging over certain rev ranges. It was not practical in that sense and the added cost/time of engineering.
The GT3 is not the last pure Porsche. The last pure Porsche is the last sports car Porsche produces.
I posted it in this forum to draw a comparison beyond the car to the specific components of PDK and DFI and their omission . The Gt3 has long been held as the benchmark of normally aspirated 911 track cars and yet it lacks the newfangled cutting edge technology found (and often praised) in the 997.2 and 997.2 S .
It's relevant that the Gt1 block was not abandoned even though the DFI has been so greatly touted as "improved" along with the "fast shifting" PDK . Unless the light bulb lit up on building better with traditional merrit.
The Porsche 911 has its roots within all the models and the lack of uniformity is worth noting as well.
In my opinion .. the Gt3 is the car that will not only slam dunk your M3 in every performance category but more importantly has a certain significance in the 997 line up.
I posted it in this forum to draw a comparison beyond the car to the specific components of PDK and DFI and their omission . The Gt3 has long been held as the benchmark of normally aspirated 911 track cars and yet it lacks the newfangled cutting edge technology found (and often praised) in the 997.2 and 997.2 S .
It's relevant that the Gt1 block was not abandoned even though the DFI has been so greatly touted as "improved" along with the "fast shifting" PDK . Unless the light bulb lit up on building better with traditional merrit.
The Porsche 911 has its roots within all the models and the lack of uniformity is worth noting as well.
In my opinion .. the Gt3 is the car that will not only slam dunk your M3 in every performance category but more importantly has a certain significance in the 997 line up.
I understand where you posted it and why, I just prefer clear organization. Plus, many GT3 guys have moved from 997's or 996's... regardless, your thread, your decision, merely providing my view as to where GT3 discussion should take place.
It is relevant that the GT1 block was not abandoned and DI was not added. Goes to show that DI is being pushed for emissions and fuel efficiency not performance.
I'm not really sure why you brought up my M3, irrelevant to the discussion at hand, unless you felt threatened by something I said. I would suggest focusing on the topic and not suggesting something that may cause it to sway quite considerably.
If Autoweek and Automobile Mag are correct, the 2010 GT3 engine/tranny combo are for the homogulation requirements of the racing circuits, plus there would have been no more bang for the buck putting a DFI in this car. As far as the efficacy of PDK, Porsche was pretty damn successful running it in the 956 and 962 25 years ago, so it isn't just a new untested toy as some on other threads like to postulate.
DFI wasn't added because the GT3 motor already has high compression, and adding it would have meant a lot of extra work and extra weight for very little gain.
As for PDK, according to Porsche GT3 Drivers want a manual, and the short shift kit shifts faster then the normal manual. Also PDK adds 66lbs to the rear end, and it didn't fit with the GT1 Block, as the PDK is longer and would have to be repackaged to fit.
__________________ 2006 997 C2S Seal Gray
A few mods 2004 VW Touareg V8 Offroad Gray
Hitch, Tekonsha P3, iPod kit, Parrot 3200 18' Aluma Open Trailer
PDK is heavier, plus, in the GT3 you bet it would get paddles, requiring some more time plus creating controversy with the initial button offering (a mistake).
DI on the GT3 would most likely come with completely new architecture, as in ditching the GT1 block. This would prove far too controversial right now. Not to mention DI gets challenging over certain rev ranges. It was not practical in that sense and the added cost/time of engineering.
The GT3 is not the last pure Porsche. The last pure Porsche is the last sports car Porsche produces.
Additionally, this is in the wrong section.
I guess it wouldn't be one of your posts with out controversy!
__________________ 2006 997 C2S Seal Gray
A few mods 2004 VW Touareg V8 Offroad Gray
Hitch, Tekonsha P3, iPod kit, Parrot 3200 18' Aluma Open Trailer
The others have said it already but the juice was not worth the squeeze for DFI. Meaning the performance advantage is not worth the time and effort in development. Will it eventually happen?....Probably
There are several reasons why PDK was not added in my view. To be honest, I am really surprised this is not even an option as the performance advantage of a dual clutch tranny cannot be denied. Weight is probably a factor or its possible the PDK has its limits on how much power it can efficiently handle and Porsche does not want to test those. I imagine the next gen TT and GT3 will include some sort of PDK option as a newer version is probably already in development.
PDK will not fit with the GT1 block. DFI in the .2 engine is a whole different engine...it is smaller, lower and many many fewer moving parts.
No I would not say the 2010 GT3 is the last of a pure Porsche....no way no how.
As far as PDK weighing 66lbs...with the new lighter engine in the .2 it makes no difference and with the performance advantage of PDK it will end up in the GT3 soon.A 997.2S is much faster already than a 05-08 997.1S....even with the 66lbs PDK.
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Mike
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How do I get the blinking brake lights?
During the video, one of the rear shots shows the brake lights blinking when applied. Is this an option or a special light for Europe?
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2009 C4S Coupe
2008 C4S Cab. gone
2008 BMW 335xi
2006 Volvo V70R
How do I get the blinking brake lights?
During the video, one of the rear shots shows the brake lights blinking when applied. Is this an option or a special light for Europe?
I noticed that too, perhaps it is the police edition that they were testing.
__________________ 2006 997 C2S Seal Gray
A few mods 2004 VW Touareg V8 Offroad Gray
Hitch, Tekonsha P3, iPod kit, Parrot 3200 18' Aluma Open Trailer
How do I get the blinking brake lights?
During the video, one of the rear shots shows the brake lights blinking when applied. Is this an option or a special light for Europe?
put in a flasher; available (or at least used to be) at most automotive stores
if GT1 block will not make it into the next gen GT3, then I predict that PDK will eventually be available in GT3, along with the manual transmission.
as far as GT3 remains pure, will all the current electronic technologies added, it is not really that pure anyway. PDK transmission is only one of these electronic driving aids, the ones that you don't see or touch doesn't mean they're not there.
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Tim
2010 Porsche 997.2GT3RS, January build To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2008 Porsche Cayenne Turbo
2006 Porsche 911 Club Coupe #13 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
if GT1 block will not make it into the next gen GT3, then I predict that PDK will eventually be available in GT3, along with the manual transmission.
as far as GT3 remains pure, will all the current electronic technologies added, it is not really that pure anyway. PDK transmission is only one of these electronic driving aids, the ones that you don't see or touch doesn't mean they're not there.
It's latest and possibly last modern gen 911 with the Gt1 block unless the Turbo retains it in it 997tt.2 model.
Let me clarrify "pure" as a car that retains some of the traditions which made it legendary . The Gt1 is over a decade old and the manual is timeless.
To draw an analogy many BMW folks will call modern gadget BMW's just as pure as the old models but when BMW went "Bangelized" a distict split in ownership sentiment began . The leeast Bangled BMW was the 3 series and it also kept its sales volume .
Is the Gt3 the the modern Porsche version of the traditional car?
Porsche once upon a time released the best car they could . I believe this Gt3 will be the best Gt3 made .
I also agree withg the others that cost played a role and it simply wasnt worth making the change yet I also believe the new Gt3 will outperform it previous model as well as its PDK counterparts.
I also agree with Northvan that most Gt3 owners simply sidn't want it.
When the Gtr came out a lot of attention went to the Turbo as the rival but many raised the point that the Gt3 was a true drivers car and that the Gtr technology would overtake the driver error of manual shifting .
Porsche could have scratched the Gt3 for a year or two . But they didn't . Instead they built it better with some old school 911 traits. This is the car to get --IMO. I just how to figure out how to fit one next to my Turbo in mu garage and cope with having one too many cars.
How do I get the blinking brake lights?
During the video, one of the rear shots shows the brake lights blinking when applied. Is this an option or a special light for Europe?
This is the wave length of the LED's and the frames per second on the digital video camera. My car does this on you tube vid and you can see this happen on the 09 Fabspeed muffler test vid's.
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Mike
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