Is seat weight realkly an issue ?

[JEllis]

Combine the Sport Buckets (GT2 seats) with other lightweight options such as no sunroof (I wish), no PCM or upgraded sound, no PADM, PCCB's (PCCB's alone remove a lot of unsprung mass which is comparable to about 100lbs of sprung weight), and you have a car that is much more nimble around the track. Will you notice it in a straight line, when merging on the highway or when your car is sitting pretty in the garage... no Jason

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[yrralis1]

Originally Posted by JEllis

Combine the Sport Buckets (GT2 seats) with other lightweight options such as no sunroof (I wish), no PCM or upgraded sound, no PADM, PCCB's (PCCB's alone remove a lot of unsprung mass which is comparable to about 100lbs of sprung weight), and you have a car that is much more nimble around the track. Will you notice it in a straight line, when merging on the highway or when your car is sitting pretty in the garage... no

Jason

i understand the the gt3 PCM combines with the sport chrono delivering useful info . I happen to like the sport adaptives .
Many of the guys who insist that i get the sport bucket seats weigh more than I weigh in the heavist seat . I understand the tradoff on comfort is performance but I also think an ill fitted seat and an uncopmfortable driver isn't necessarily an advantage .
Maybe I am just trying to convince myself to make a Gt3 comfortable.

[adias]

A light sports car is always a good thing. Colin Chapman knew it well.

The majority of 911s bought these days are overweight with motorized seats, too many speakers and subwoofers and the like. But no matter these cars are bought mostly for show and the occasional green light launch for bragging rights. Curve dynamics do not matter or are not understood.

My new car has manual sports seats (the ASS are too heavy), no Bose, no directional lights or other doodads which add nothing to the driving dynamics. It has LSD as that certainly helps driving dynamics.

[JEllis]

Originally Posted by yrralis1

i understand the the gt3 PCM combines with the sport chrono delivering useful info . I happen to like the sport adaptives .
Many of the guys who insist that i get the sport bucket seats weigh more than I weigh in the heavist seat . I understand the tradoff on comfort is performance but I also think an ill fitted seat and an uncopmfortable driver isn't necessarily an advantage .
Maybe I am just trying to convince myself to make a Gt3 comfortable.

The GT2 seats are great track seats that are more comfortable and easier to live with than a typical fixed back seat.

Your thinking is really opposite to what most GT3 buyers are looking for...which is fine. Just understand your going against the grain a little.

Jason

[adias]

Originally Posted by JEllis

... Your thinking is really opposite to what most GT3 buyers are looking for...which is fine. Just understand your going against the grain a little.

Jason

I see many GT3s these days used exclusively for show and boulevard runs. What a waste.

[yrralis1]

Originally Posted by JEllis

The GT2 seats are great track seats that are more comfortable and easier to live with than a typical fixed back seat.

Your thinking is really opposite to what most GT3 buyers are looking for...which is fine. Just understand your going against the grain a little.

Jason

The idea of taking a track car and making it more street friendly is the inverse of taking a street car 997S and gearing it for track . I know both are against the grain . I can fit in the sport bucket . It's small though.

What if i was bigger though ? How can a big guy cram into the seat ?
The idea of a nose lift and a spacious seat .. can that really add so much weight ?

I understand that there's a racing essence to the car just like a speedo is for swimming faster but if I go body surfing at the beach shorts are better attire for beach wear .Even in sports theres a cross training concept. Why not apply this to driving.

[mdrums]

Originally Posted by yrralis1

I see a lot of posts about seat weight . In this recent Gt3 endeavor I heard even more about seats and weight.

In my many discussions the general notion was "if you get a gt3 you have to get sport bucket, they weigh less" but I even see this on the Turbo and the 997 forums too.

I fit in all the seats and if I simply chose my favorite it wouild be the sports adaptives .
If I drove two equal cars with the only difference being the seat would the car with the lighter seat win? Is it really that big a difference ?

No, but we like to think it is. For street driving and DE's no seat weight is not an issue.

[sin911]

Well, I am planning to get Recaros installed soon and get the rear seats uninstalled... The weight reduction will be good... I unfortunately have Sunroof on my car, I wish I didn't sometimes...

[adias]

Originally Posted by yrralis1

The idea of taking a track car and making it more street friendly is the inverse of taking a street car 997S and gearing it for track . I know both are against the grain . I can fit in the sport bucket . It's small though.

Those 2 tracks are very different. It makes sense to prepare a street car for the track. It makes no sense at all to undo a track car and make it a street car. This is what logic dictates. But logic is often out the window.

It is PC to finish now and say... but that's OK, people are free to do as they please. Yes, they are... but they will be judged by their actions.

[ntlgnt1]

I think you should get what's most comfortable for you. If you are concerned about resale, seats can be swapped out very easily as you know. Weight won't matter for your intentions.

[NorthVan]

Originally Posted by adias

I see many GT3s these days used exclusively for show and boulevard runs. What a waste.

How many times do you see ads for used GT3's never been tracked? Why would some one buy a GT3 and not track it. You can't use the car on the street the way it should be.

[JEllis]

Originally Posted by yrralis1

The idea of taking a track car and making it more street friendly is the inverse of taking a street car 997S and gearing it for track . I know both are against the grain . I can fit in the sport bucket . It's small though.

What if i was bigger though ? How can a big guy cram into the seat ?
The idea of a nose lift and a spacious seat .. can that really add so much weight ?

I understand that there's a racing essence to the car just like a speedo is for swimming faster but if I go body surfing at the beach shorts are better attire for beach wear .Even in sports theres a cross training concept. Why not apply this to driving.

I am 6ft 4in and 210 pounds and fit in the GT2 seats just fine. Then again my job does keep me fit. They are supposed to be snug, their job is to hold you tight while your sliding around the track. My butt cheaks and legs were sore after one day of tracking from having to brace myself in my Adaptive Sports Seats. GT2 seats will be one of my next mods!

Like adias said, taking a 997S and making it more track friendly makes a lot more sense than taking the track friendliness out of the GT3.

Personally I think Porsche along with a few other automakers makes all their cars track friendly. (SUV's aside) I had no problem beating 996 GT3's and 997TT's around the track. There was only one 997 GT3 at the event and I did not have a chance to race him.

Does 100lbs or even 200lbs make a big difference? Well, my lap times went down about 2 seconds without my instructor in the car.

Will it make a difference to you? Depends if you go to the track or not.

How will Sport Buckets effect res-sale? I think that depends on the typical GT3 buyer. I am just guessing but I would say about 60% of GT3's find their way to the track eventually. So if you say that the majority of GT3 buyers plan on tracking their GT3's then you might consider speccing a car that appeals to the weekend track day enthusiast. I have noticed that with most sports cars the "stripper" versions tend to be worth more in the long wrong. For example, find a E36 or E46 M3 with a speed cloth interior and no sunroof and for some reason these always sell for more. The Porsche 964 RS America was actually a cheaper car when it was sold new but now commands a hefty premium.

But you should do what you want to do. If you dont want sport buckets. Dont get them.

Jason

Originally Posted by adias

Those 2 tracks are very different. It makes sense to prepare a street car for the track. It makes no sense at all to undo a track car and make it a street car. This is what logic dictates. But logic is often out the window.

It is PC to finish now and say... but that's OK, people are free to do as they please. Yes, they are... but they will be judged by their actions.

Well put

Jason

[adias]

Originally Posted by JEllis

...
Does 100lbs or even 200lbs make a big difference? Well, my lap times went down about 2 seconds without my instructor in the car.

I easily notice a 100lb difference inside the cabin when I drive fast on twisty mountain roads. To me it is very noticeable.

But it does not matter. 90% of these cars are driven on freeways on flat land anyway.

[NorthVan]

Originally Posted by JEllis

Well, my lap times went down about 2 seconds without my instructor in the car.

Never mind the weight, the distraction of the instructor telling you where to go when to brake, etc is always a good reason to slow down.

[JEllis]

Originally Posted by adias

I easily notice a 100lb difference inside the cabin when I drive fast on twisty mountain roads. To me it is very noticeable.

Yes, I also really notice the difference when I have a passenger or not. My goal is try to remove about 150lbs from my car. I think its doable. I am already on my way with my center exit exhaust and reducing the unsprung weight with BBS E88's has also really helped. I think GT2 seats, Brael Battery, rear seat removal, K&N intake, will help in the fight.

I think the best and easiest way to make a car more nimble is a quality set of lightweight wheels.

Saving 5 lbs per corner of unsprung mass is about the same as removing 100lbs of sprung weight!

Jason