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Bentley is already old news, the VW Group is simply doing their best to get the most they can during this last gasp from this old girl. From what i've been hearing, their product partnerships aren't doing that well. Heck, look at the massive discounts on the Brietling/Bentley timepieces online. The competition is eating them alive in many aspects. The good thing is they're now getting really cheap to buy, but as we all know service and maintenance will eat you alive. As the saying goes, "Their chickens have come home to roost."
I'm waiting for Bentley condoms. Ride smooth and comfortable with the luxurious feel of Bentley condoms by Trojan. Trojan's Bentley condoms come with a handcrafted leather carrying case with wood highlights to match your automobile. Ride in style.
Last edited by stevenrmusic; 10-10-2015 at 06:46 AM.
It's very interesting to compare the VW and BMW strategy regarding their ''english'' brands.
VW started by going back to the ''roots'' of Bentley by creating a very innovative ''grand tourer'' and all the proper genes were there: technology, power,design, innovation, comfort, prestige... I guess that old WO Bentley should have been proud of that car.
then they added a convertible to the coupé. perfect.
and it seems that the marketing gurus from Wolfsburg started loosing it.in my opinion the ''speed'' version is their first mistake, the technical innovations should have been added to the original model without ''adding'' a kind of souped up version of the base model, Bentley is not Volkswagen, one can understand the reason of creating an ''R'' version of the Golf, less so for a bentley.
and then, from face lift to face lift they lost the purity of the original, magnificent, design...hell, the face of the 2016 looks like a bloody japanese job!
the addition of the Super Sport and the recent ''limited edition'' of the GT3R is the living evidence that they are using the same marketing technics they use for their other brands.
who is going to take a 300k$ GT3R to the track when ANY proper sport cars, Mc Laren, Ferrari, Porsche GT2 can make circles aroud it!
they are slowly but surely destroying the bentley image by applying mass production and main line cars marketing gimmicks to one of the most exclusive brand that exists.
I'm not even arguing about the BENTYAGUA! is land rover going to sell a sport car?
they are mixing up Bentley and Porsche!certainly very clever for their balance sheet, but look to where is Porsche now, their main production is the diesel cayenne or the diesel Macan...
now compare all the above to Rolls Royce.... I guess that we are not close to see a Ghost or a Wraith for sale at 40k$!!
last, but certainly not least for us Bentley owners, their support to the brand and their choice of dealers is....questionable.
having said all the above doesn't mean that I don't love my car and that I'm, almost, entranced when I drive it and that I have no intention of seeling it.
It's very interesting to compare the VW and BMW strategy regarding their ''english'' brands.
VW started by going back to the ''roots'' of Bentley by creating a very innovative ''grand tourer'' and all the proper genes were there: technology, power,design, innovation, comfort, prestige... I guess that old WO Bentley should have been proud of that car.
then they added a convertible to the coupé. perfect.
and it seems that the marketing gurus from Wolfsburg started loosing it.in my opinion the ''speed'' version is their first mistake, the technical innovations should have been added to the original model without ''adding'' a kind of souped up version of the base model, Bentley is not Volkswagen, one can understand the reason of creating an ''R'' version of the Golf, less so for a bentley.
and then, from face lift to face lift they lost the purity of the original, magnificent, design...hell, the face of the 2016 looks like a bloody japanese job!
the addition of the Super Sport and the recent ''limited edition'' of the GT3R is the living evidence that they are using the same marketing technics they use for their other brands.
who is going to take a 300k$ GT3R to the track when ANY proper sport cars, Mc Laren, Ferrari, Porsche GT2 can make circles aroud it!
they are slowly but surely destroying the bentley image by applying mass production and main line cars marketing gimmicks to one of the most exclusive brand that exists.
I'm not even arguing about the BENTYAGUA! is land rover going to sell a sport car?
they are mixing up Bentley and Porsche!certainly very clever for their balance sheet, but look to where is Porsche now, their main production is the diesel cayenne or the diesel Macan...
now compare all the above to Rolls Royce.... I guess that we are not close to see a Ghost or a Wraith for sale at 40k$!!
last, but certainly not least for us Bentley owners, their support to the brand and their choice of dealers is....questionable.
having said all the above doesn't mean that I don't love my car and that I'm, almost, entranced when I drive it and that I have no intention of seeling it.
but...
I dont agree with some of your points.
The Speed version of the car is a must because the base car has a suspension that is too soft, which introduces way more body roll than some people like. Also, some people are perfectly fine with the base engine and some others want more power. Having both choices helps a car company appeal to a broader customer base (i.e. sell more cars). This is the same reason they introduced a V8-based car. It helped them reach customers shopping for a sub-$200K car. Since a vast majority of people buy these cars for attention/status and not for performance/luxury/quality, this strategy works well.
I agree with you on the 2016 face lift. It was a perfect case of "It aint broken, but lets fix it anyway". Hopefully 2018 MY will be similar to the EXP 10 Speed 6 concept (which is gorgeous). I would not go as far as a Japanese job though.
The Supersports was and remains my favorite Bentley and I hope they will make a new one. It was not really meant for a track and none of the Bentley marketing materials stated that. It was basically "the sportiest Bentley" and everything about it was perfect as far as I am concerned. If you have more money and want more performance out of your Bentley, get a Supersports. If you don't care about performance and just want luxury and/or status, the base car is for you.
The GT3-R is not even worth talking about, with 300 cars made worldwide. It's obviously not a track car. Its a TRIBUTE to a track car (i.e. the GT3). It's more of a souvenir for someone who loves Bentleys or for someone who likes to brag about owning one of the 300 cars ever made. And of course, a Ferrari and a MacLaren will run circles around it on a track, but go ahead and try driving a MacLaren year round and see what happens. A Bentley is more capable, more luxurious and more practical. Granted its not a track car, and yet it managed to score SECOND in Motor Trend's World's Greatest Drag Race 5. It was .2 seconds slower than a Corvette Z06 . Think about it. The Corvette has 78 more horsepower, 134 more lb-ft of torque and weighs 1,316 lbs. less than the GT3-R.
The Bentayga.....dont get me started on that. The guys at Land Rover are probably rolling on the floor. At the same time, the 1st production year is already sold out. And yes, it will sell well despite the fact that it's a rebadged Q7. Every sheikh and athlete player will want one. Behold the 26" rims! (yikes!). Regardless, it will be a great revenue source for Bentley, just like the Cayenne is for Porsche. Because they sell a boatload of Cayennes, they can still make cars like the GT3-RS. It's a compromise.
Comparing Bentley to the RR....there is no comparison. RR is overpriced for what it delivers, cannot be driven year around in cold climates and handles like crap. I had a 2015 Ghost loaner a month ago and the suspension on it was so soft that the car was rocking side to side when going over bumps. A Spur drives much better, costs less, attracts less attention, has AWD and can be optioned with the same luxury items as the Ghost.
I wonder what you mean about Bentley's choice of dealers. My dealer treats me like family and I value that relationship. If you had a bad experience with yours, go to another dealer and report the original dealer to Bentley headquarters. They do care. There are always bad apples and you don't have to deal with anyone's crap.
* This car looks like the Chinese copy of it...
* dude is gesturing like a 1996 rap album
* What an eyesore. God it's ugly
* just UGLY!! can't beat range rover...just lame
* UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY! UGLY!
* Somebody strap his hands to his sides please, so I can concentrate on how ugly this thing is.
* Who in the world would pay $250,000 for this ****.
* All VW/Audi switches!!
The Tesla Model X has more hp/tq, so Bentley has a very small window to claim best SUV power. Model X will also have far higher tech and overall more modern. BTW, what an eyesore the rear display screens are on the Bentley and the lack of rear legroom is embarrassing. Think I'll wait for the Bentley F350 Superduty truck or their new compact BentClio.
''The Speed version of the car is a must because the base car has a suspension that is too soft, which introduces way more body roll than some people like. Also, some people are perfectly fine with the base engine and some others want more power. Having both choices helps a car company appeal to a broader customer base (i.e. sell more cars). This is the same reason they introduced a V8-based car. It helped them reach customers shopping for a sub-$200K car''
yes, you're right but, in my opinion, this marketing strategy is perfectly understandable for, let say, Mercedes, Audi, BMW but not for Bentley.they should reach an acceptable compromise for their customers target and sell one model only.I think that, allowing someone, even an idiot, to say ''my Bentley is better than yours" or "the V8 is a poor's man Bentley" is already damaging the brand image.
"The Supersports was and remains my favorite Bentley and I hope they will make a new one. It was not really meant for a track and none of the Bentley marketing materials stated that. It was basically "the sportiest Bentley" and everything about it was perfect as far as I am concerned. If you have more money and want more performance out of your Bentley, get a Supersports. If you don't care about performance and just want luxury and/or status, the base car is for you. "
OK, after thinking about it twice they can base their decision on the Bentley heritage like the 3.5l ''blower''so I agree that I stand corrected.
but on the GT3-R I stand on my ground, what the hell is a ''tribute to a track car'', the Mc Laren is a ''tribute to a track car'' since its also a track car in itself, not so for the GT3-R. and forget about drag race, any half assed engineer can do that with almost ANY CAR, at the first curve, the laws of physics will take over.the GT3 was more than enough to show that Bentley has kept its ''roots''.
everything has been said on the, infamous, BENTYAGA and, unfortunately for bentley most of it is true.... but I don't think that this car will be to Bentley what the Cayenne was, and still is, to Porsche. their potential client base is to narrow.....when every sheikh and soccer player will have one what then?
I bet that you will soon see Bentyaga for sale at 10k$ below a RR autobiography supercharged. excellent for the brand exclusive image!
I agree on what you wrote about the RR, except that is not 'overpriced'' since their sales are increasing every year. My point of view was that RR has managed to kept their image perfectly clear, until now, not so for Bentley.
having said that the WRAITH might be their first mistake, or maybe not future will tell, and if they go ahead with their SUV then
well, regarding the dealers, I guess that you have a much better service in the US, we have a grand total of 3, yes 3 dealers in France, one in Monaco/Cannes (same company) one in Lyon (300 miles from my place) and one in Paris (650 miles from my place).Clearly the French market is so small that they are not really interested.
let's be clear about what I wrote above, none of it will stand a proper financial analysis on a short/mid term but on the long, maybe very long regarding Bentley, no brand can stand such an image modification and remain untouched.The VAG group has enough resources to apply a long term strategy to their two luxury brands, Bentley and Bugatti, they are, almost, doing it for Bugatti and not for Bentley. look to what happened to JAGUAR under Ford management and you can foresee what will happen to Bentley under the VAG management.
Regarding the V8 model: In the end of the day, Bentley, just like any other car company, is in a business of selling cars. It may sound strange to you, but a lot of people that shop for a Bentley are asking how/why it is better than a top of the line MB S63 AMG or a Panamera Turbo S, etc and since all those cars are below $200K (apparently a psychological barrier for some people), Bentley needed a model to be below $200K, so they made a V8. There will always be idiots and snobs, but in contrast in today's world someone may say "my Bentley is more fuel efficient than yours" or "I got the same car exact car with a smaller engine and saved $25K". Although I would not go for the V8 model because it has less of everything in the performance department, I can fully understand someone who does not care about 0 to 60 times and firm suspension, buys a V8 car and saves $25K.
Regarding the GT3-R, I still think i's awesome. Maybe not $339K awesome, but awesome. Bentley bills it as a road-going version of the Bentley GT3 race car, hence it's a "tribute" car. It's a part of "Race on Sunday, sell on Monday" strategy and it works well - they will sell every single one of them, just like they sold every single one of the Ice Speed Record cards. The GT3-R sounds like a race car and looks a little bit like one. You really need to experience it to know what I mean. If your dealership has one, go see it and ask them to start the engine. I guarantee you will like what you see and hear.
Regarding the Bentayga, it will still sell well, despite the looks. When every sheikh and athlete has one, all the other people with $225K to spend on the car will get one. Don't forget China (a.k.a. the largest car market in the world) where Bentley sold 2,160 cars in 2014. Once sales start dropping, they will come out with a Speed version with 630hp, blacked out chrome trim and carbon fiber interior, which will spur sales for a while until a facelift comes out. You will NEVER see it sold for $10K below a Range Rover (apples to apples). The most expensive Rover (SV Autobiography) retails for $209K and will depreciate like a rock because in the end of the day its not that much different from a $100K Range Rover. There are a few of them on EVERY block in NYC. If you are a badge/attention/prestige person, Rover and Bentley are not on the same planet. Bentayga will depreciate same as other Bentleys, which means a 3-yr old car with around $7K miles will sell for $120K-$140K.
Regarding the RR, their sales are increasing, but look by how much:
2011 3,538
2012 3,575
2013 3,630
2014 4,063
So yes, they sold 433 cars more in 2014 than in 2013. And yes, its overpriced when you consider the fact a fully loaded Ghost EWB costs about the same as the Mulsanne (much better looking car that drives much better). Anyway, drive one for a day and you will see what I mean. And yes, there will be an RR SUV, which will be a jacked up Ghost riding on a BMW X5 platform. Maybe they will call it iGhost Xdrive or something.
As far as VAG ownership/investment is concerned, I don't think Bentley would exist without VAG today. Bentley was too small to be sustainable in today's economy where the cost of developing a car with modern safety standards and requirements goes into billions. Bentley would never be able to afford that. Thanks to VW, they had a Q7 platform to build an SUV on and now they have a Panamera platform to build the next CGT on. It will be lighter, faster and better looking. Dont forget VAG's 3rd luxury brand - Lamborghini. It borrows heavily from Audi. In the end of the day, VAG's long term strategy for all of it's luxury brands is sharing platforms/engines/technology, while diversifying experiences/materials/design philosophy.
Ford and Jaguar are a different story altogether. One day Ford decided it will turn itself into a luxury car company by buying a few luxury car brands and creating Premier Auto Group. Only problem was they forgot to change their mentality, so ultimately it was a failure. But VAG practices a totally different strategy when it comes to it's luxury brands, so their treatment of Bentley, Bugatti and Lamborghini is totally different from Ford's treatment of PAG brands.
Well, thanks God that we are not part of the same marketing ThinkTank!
we will be fighting each other to death
Regarding the GT3-R let's agree that we disagree. I have seen the GT3-R in Monaco and I fail to understand the use of that car.
when I want to have some fun, It happens that I own also an AUDI R8, I drive a proper sport car...
Yes, the Chinese market, let's hope that they will buy ALL the Bentyaga production.
regarding the RR, you're wrong, the most expensive Range Rover is the Range Rover LWB Holland and Holland supercharged: +/- 280 K$.
I'm not a RR fan and I have no intention to buy one, I used to own a Silver Seraph some 12 years ago, it was a mistake.
having said so RR has a very clear 3E strategy, Extraordinary thus Exclusive thus Expensive. and it works.
regarding VAG, it is obvious that Bentley, like RR, could not survive without the support of a global company but they are giving a very different treatment to Bentley compared to Bugatti or even to Lamborghini it looks to me that Bugatti and Lamborghini are used to enhance their technological supremacy whether they want to transform Bentley into a ''cash cow''...
and don't forget that they borrow the Lamborghini Gallardo engine for the R8 not the other way around...
anyway, let's be realistic about all this, Bentley main target is China then the USA then Europe "Demand was strong across all regions, especially in China and the Middle East, where sales increased by 61% and 27% respectively."
so what, we Europeans think about their strategy is certainly not their main concern.
....Very intelligent and knowledgeable discussion...let me add this little nugget of information...Here in San Francisco the Bentayga is struggling...sent one out on a truck to one of the richest person in the world (who regularly buys his cars thusly)...he sat in back of Bentayga (being chauffer+bodyguard driven)...sent it right back...far too small...
Again...appreciate your perceptive comments...JimB
10-08-2015, 10:45 PM
. Think about it. The Corvette has 78 more horsepower, 134 more lb-ft of torque and weighs 1,316 lbs. less than the GT3-R.
