And your point was...?

 

"Like a humble world-class athlete, Porsche does its thing better than any other car in the world but never gets loud about it."

i think that sums it up very nicely!

P.S. best interior design brand should have been Audi or Porsche as well.

 

Connection?

Hmmmm. Merit? The man with the $50.00 plastic digital battery powered watch vs the man wearing the beautiful Patek or Roly. Hmm...OK. I'm tempted but I'm gonna stay right out of this one and just say well just go ask a women what the connection is....afterall women use things like shoes and watches to size up a man...and in a number of ways too. Nuff said? But i guess if your a guys' guy it won't matter huh...not directing this at you either OK.

Appreciate your thoughts manifold but maybe let's just stick to car talk and leave the metaphorical comparisons to cars alone heh? But your call of course....i'm always happy to play

 

Agree Catch!

And geez thanks manifold. Now why did ya have to go and point those links out? Don't you realise some of the Porsche guys are still picking up the leftover pieces of their charactors off the pavement after the last judgemental sermon from the masters of morals and charactor assessments...all tragically seeking the moral high ground over Porsche people. Sad....I must've been asleep missing that shameful behaviour.

I hope we wont be hearing a new "up to date" charactor assessment/assassination of Porsche owners for just buying their Porsches to look "cool" too?

So, is it "here come da charactor judge" again...or is it now accepted by the Nissan boys that Porsche is the official worlds best sportscar and, the coolest sportscar too?

Btw manifold I didn't see a mention anywhere of the GTR. Or, was that because they didnt pay the piper like Porsche did? I mean thats what Jasper reckons.....you gotta pay if you want nice things said by the reviewers and journo's..

 

I don't understand the point of this post. Making these comments isn't staying out of it. As far as the connection to watches, it was noted early in the thread by others, and generally the discussion has been wide ranging.

 

I haven't seen any sermons or character attacks. People evidently have different opinions on the topic and have expressed them. What's wrong with that? If people are sensitive about exploring motives for choosing cars, best for them to not participate in the discussion.

Also, you're right that the GT-R wasn't mentioned. Neither was Ferrari, Lambo, Aston, Rolls, Bentley, etc., so the GT-R is apparently in good company there.

 

What i was inferring too manifold was you can waffle on about watches, which i thought had been well and truly exhausted in a metaphorical sense, or, you can discuss cars. After all this is a car forum right? We can all have our individual takes on cars, watches, wine, women and song etc but isn't this a car forum?...and a Porsche car forum at that? Or am I missing something here?

And fwiw manifold, if you like your swatch that's perfectly fine by me, but just be very careful in siding with those that have chosen to resort to assassinating characters of persons here that have chosen something, (oooh...dare i say that is more exclusive or "better" and, better in the eyes of the majority including the aficionados that evaluate such products) by insinuating or asserting those people that have chosen those goods because they are snobs or suffering character defects simply because they happen to appreciate a fine piece of watch, jewellery, motor vehicle, wine or whatever, or, because they own something you don't or, can't. Thats all.

 

The digressions into watches, etc. often provide insights into cars and driving, so I personally have no problem with them. IMO, they're a big part of what's made this thread long and interesting. And after all, we're real people with real lives, not mere technocrats.

As far as 'siding' with anyone, I've previously expressed my own opinion. If you recall, I said that I don't fault people for considering status/image when choosing a car, but that's not a major factor for me, for various reasons.

I realize that the discussion has gotten a bit heated at times, but hopefully people benefit from hearing different viewpoints, including having their own viewpoints challenged. It's a way to learn and grow, if we have sufficient humility and openness.

 

Well given the very OP, and that we are discussing the pros and cons of both cars it is relevant to only mention only the two brands manifold. Why try and water the topic down for the sake of appeasement by mentioning other exotic brands that were not included either. Relevant as it may be it's irrelevant in the context of the topic and discussion. Nissan GTR did not get a mention regardless of its performance achievements ...end of story.

You say you haven't read any sermons or attacks? That's probably because it suits you to say that because you were siding with certain comments made against certian Porsche owners on this board....so you were part of it. I call that hypocritical to say the least. Sad manifold very sad.

I'd love to hear your story why you chose your slower porsche 911 (non turbo too) over the superior/faster performing Nissan....let's all hear it.

I'm not here to fight anyones battle, but after reading the level of condescending posts being directed at certain Porsche individuals, who were merely expressing an opinion (and on a Porsche forum too), instigated predominately by Nissan members, I thought it was more than just a bit rich, and incredibly hypocritical, especially coming for persons that were supposed to be doing a job here as well. This is not how i invisaged mods interacting with members on this board, yet such actions were being taken as a green light for other members to get in on the act for the sake of being part of those claiming the "high moral ground". Here it was, valued members were being condemned for essentially nothing more than choosing and appreciating a fine piece of automotive machinery that is globally recognised as such even going by your own recent links.

Suggesting they have charactor defects, or are snobs and the likes, in some bid to vent frustration or sooth ones own automotive/egotistical shortfalls, whilst claiming the high moral ground is down right disgraceful behaviour to say the least, and i am ashamed to be part of any such discussion which condemns the appreciation of such exclusive globally recognised products... least of all for the sake of appeasing a brand that has received no standing nor recognition in the respective areas these vehicles were ultimately judged upon. Talk about Political correctness on a car forum...It's a joke. Sad. None of this would have flown for a second if it was on a Nissan forum. It's not Porsche owners problem the Nissan car has not being recognised in the same light as Porsche, so why condemn owners of porsches for choosing a vehicle that has is in all ways been judged a far more exclusive piece of machinery in all soulful senses...in the same sense as your watch analogy i.e. the appreciation of a Rolex vs swatch. It honestly appears to me that there are a few Nissan owners here that can't stay away from the P car forums that are desperately seeking the approval of porsche owners to recognise their cars as equal in all facets and are dirty on Porsche owners because no one is really bothered nor paying any attention to their beloved car. Why can't people be happy with their choices and decisions?

 

Another preclusion i see. Jasper most of your retorts are reminiscent of my walking past a drunken bum on a park bench, hearing them shouting insults to the passers by. Who cares what you think. I don't.

Maybe one day when you finally get that recognition you are so desperately seeking over here you will be able to settle down Jasper. Doesn't it bother you that so many other Nissan Gtr owners are able to enjoy their cars without having to masquerade around the P car forums all the time pretending to like Porsches to get in on conversation....or slip in the thin end of the wedge?

Funny thing is I very very rarely post outside of the 997tt or 991 forum....don't have the need , time nor inclination. Is the GTR forum really boring or something?

 

IMO, you make some valid points, but I'll still suggest that you're being too sensitive about some things. Get a bunch of passionate car guys together in an online forum ... you have to expect some sparks to fly. It just comes with the territory, and I think most people realize that it's all meant to be in good fun, with some enlightenment along the way. We're not trying the solve the world's problems here.

Also, the thread is about GT-R vs 991, so I would fully expect GT-R owners to show up and advocate for their car (and at least one GT-R owner pointed out some negatives with it).

For myself, I chose Porsche because I like the feel and I've said many times that's not just about speed for me. But I also have an AMG, and if I could have ten cars at once the GT-R would certainly be one of them.

 

I ignored your other useless preclusions... And yes, the GT-R forums are getting boring, without any failures to report, all the races being won, and people blabbing on about the new 2013's... Gets repetitive.

If you think my posts in any way defend the GT-R as either a brand or a model, I suggest you remove your Porsche colored glasses and reread all of them. I'm sorry you feel threatened by a car I chose to purchase. I've went the Porsche route, and was not moved as emotionally as you were. I've moved on to another car. It is a shame where any thread that merely mentions the word GT-R, you feel it is an attack on Porsche, and must continue to add your $.02, REGARDLESS of its relevancy.
I believe every GT-R owner that has posted in here has already posted negatives about it. It's just that you won't see them reposted in every single thread. Things have already been stated - about 100 times. No need to rehash them. I just get tired of fake-enthusiasm when mixed with badge snobbery, as some sort of defense some feel is necessary, because they believe they are under attack for some reason.

It has been stated before, that people with money will buy a Porsche. True. These cars were compared because their relative price point.

So does that mean that people who can afford a GT-R can also afford a Porsche?

I've also heard the very same people complain about the GT-R being VERY expensive to maintain. Does this mean that the Porsche is cheaper to own, and therefor purchased because it is a relative bargain when compared to the GT-R?

speed - these are the stupid things I take issue with. The direct contradictions that you and others make. For the 23rd time - it makes little difference which car I own. No need to be a brain surgeon to see the flaws of some perspectives here.

I still recall some of the wild claims made about the GT-R over 4 years ago. Amusing, nevertheless.

 

Had image not been been a point i had raised amongst other comparative points I wouldn't be so outspoken about the nonsense that ensued. But when i know something is both true and factual i stand behind my convictions. After all isn't this what these discussions are about? Arriving at factual conclusions rather than whimsical fantasy?

It just strikes me odd that image is such a sore point with certain Nissan guys particularly when their cars are basically only recognised for their speed and track prowess amongst the other super-cars. Quality, image, depth of engineering, style, comfort and so on is something that has to date eluded the car and for obvious reasons, yet it seems every other exotic car owner is being held to blame for that predicament by the certain owners of the nissan brand. Surely it is not a sin to enjoy an image that has been bestowed upon a piece of fine engineering without becoming subjected to stupid remarks such as brand ***** and poser? Altho coming from owners of a branded vehicle that is in many ways synonymous amongst the general population as being a young rev heads or punks car...i suppose its to be expected. I guess the statements go with the territory and the mindset of the demographic one may say..

 

Will answer you tomorrow...gnight.

 

We're talking as much about opinions and preferences as facts, so I don't expect consensus or final conclusions. I think the value is in the discussion itself, with all of its manifold aspects.

Also, I think depth of engineering is one of the virtues of the GT-R. It may be as much high-tech electrical/computer engineering as mechanical engineering, but impressive nonetheless in its own way. As with quartz watches, the results don't lie. I don't really even think of the GT-R as being a Nissan, but rather a special car whose creation happens to be funded by Nissan, to show what they can do (as others have noted).