I mean like if you are just taking a nice 60 mph turn quickly and you decide to "punch" the throttle, what is next, ....

Are the older single turbo Porsches still crazier?

And I would like to hear how many of you GT2 owners have had any close calls.

Thanks!

 

there was one mechanic that destroyed a GT2 here. I remember the pics.

 

Ouch!!

 

I'd expect it would be no different than driving any other high HP non-driver aid laiden car.

And I'm not sure why anyone would take a hard turn at 60MPH and "stab" the throttle on any of these cars... I know with my car on slicks and with PSM off, I'm able to drift four wheels spinning thru the uphill esses at VIR at well over 125mph.

Stabbing the throttle there will get you a trip to the hospital!

Mike

 

Wow Mike, that is crazy!!

Are you still running AWD? How much HP does your Turbo put out?

-Alex

 

The uphill esses at VIR are awesome but since they built those condos and moved the tire wall it has become a very dangerous place to go off.

 

My car hasn't been dyno'ed with the newer software, upgraded fuel and wastegates. But on the old software and in the previous configuration the previous owner turned 510WHP and 532#ft. torque. It is a lot faster now, and I break traction at those speeds on the 100 Octane racegas file.

I'm still running AWD for the moment.

AtomicZ, I don't disagree. They really changed the dynamic of carrying speed into the climbing esses. I've actually gone thru that section a fair amount faster, and I've got data from others showing that I'm leaving a LOT of time on the table... I know several of the "hot shoes" are bumping 140MPH entering the esses at T7.

Mike

 

I think if I were pushing a good bit of power with no electronic aids and RWD I'd give a quick call to RaceLogic. I know for a fact that their stuff will hold traction both in a straight line and assist in curves when you begin to lose traction. I was sliding around a turn in my Supra where I'd lost it once before with a new RaceLogic installed, heard it kicking in, and HIT THE GAS. Car held all the way around with the little box cutting power as needed to maintain traction - impressed the heck out of me.

Fully adjustable laptop programmable traction control - yes sir I'd want it! I turned it off once on the highway with a tank of race gas, forgot and stepped down in it to pass an idiot at speed - lost traction when the turbo spooled. Data logs showed my wheels went from 70 to 90+ to 70 a bunch of times before I caught it. If the RL had been on I wouldn't have lost traction and needed to change my underwear.

I and several other owners used to trade stories. We'd get used to having the system installed, convince ourselves it wasn't all that, turn it off, and then VERY quickly find out just how often it was saving our bacon. Rain was the worst, the traction control was real good at giving you traction and could be adjusted for more or less slip on the fly. Still have the system in what's left of my Supra, if this car didn't already have nannies that's one I'd be looking to install... Easy to turn off, easy to adjust, not so many wires that a mortal would have trouble installing it. It only needs to save your car or your life once to be worth it....

 

Mike -

Not to hijack this thread but I was there in June with some guys running Cups cars and they were blasting through at 140+. I know I am leaving some time on the table there but I am ok with that for now.

Eric

 

Thanks for the info ^, very interesting to hear about those "stand-alone" TC systems.

How much HP is your Supra putting down? Sounds like a very Evil car...

-Alex

 

WAS putting down, trashed by a Sears E350 van and a 3+year tooth and nail legal fight after took a great deal out of me. The Supra made 720RWHP on race gas and was a cam swap away from an easy 800RWHP. Ported head and cams gathering dust in the garage never made it on the car. <sigh> Supras have a pretty violent power curve, you can see well over a hundred HP in just a short span - vertical power gains. The OEM traction control was as likely to kill you as keep you alive so everyone dumps it first thing. RaceLogic wasn't cheap but after driving a car equipped with it I knew it would save my life.

When I decided to get back to playing with cars after settling with Sears my requirements were AWD, at LEAST 3liters, and expensive enough that if some jackass totaled it I wouldn't have to listen to some schmuck try to tell me the car wasn't worth but 16K and that work I did made no difference in it's value. EVO and WRX were briefly considered and discarded as they would be worth even less than a Supra after an accident. The Porsche fits all of my criteria though! Sadly it's a a PITA to work on and I cannot do my own tuning. Depending upon who you talk to the rods may be weak for the power levels I may want someday too. However the car is lighter, handles\brakes better, is AWD, and looks sharp. I do not need to make as much power as my Supra did to be faster and it's been long enough that I need to work back into that kind of power anyway. On pump my Supra made 590, a bit more on meth. Making that in a 3.6Liter Porsche isn't a problem with turbos, fuel, and tuning - it should also be way less violent....

 

It all depends on the situation and weather.

I'm not sure about everyone else here, but I rather enjoy the feeling of a non-electrically assisted driving experience.

Sure it can "help" if things happen your not expecting. However when I am driving my GT2 or SC M3 with 500HP + at the wheels, on both cars, everytime I get in the cars I need to be careful (if I am out enjoying the car) however, even in a car with PSM or something similar with the added HP from a modified car you should always give it the respect it deserves, at all times.

My brother for example only drives the GT2, or any car for that matter 2-3 times a year. He is in no way an awesome driver but he still manages to control the car and has alot of fun at all the track days he visits for, yet his times are very well placed amongst the other drivers who drive year round, his method for control, one rule......drive to his ability, not anyone elses and most of all RESPECT the car.

As for a 60mph turn then punching it, I don't need PSM to tell me this is not a good idea . I have enough fun drifting/racing/and the occasional experiments in both cars, but on the track and in places with plenty of run off, as I have witnessed even the professional race car driver cannot get it right 100% of the time.

 

The old single turbo Porsche were a handful to control. The single turbo had lots of lag and power wasn't very linear. Stabbing it in a corner was a sure way to swap ends. Add to this a somewhat archane suspension (pre 964) and trouble was easy to find. I think a GT2 even with almost twice the power would still be somewhat more manageable in the hands of a competent driver.

 

Close call? Hum...... pic below. Apprently RESPECT alone wasn't enough for me. I now drive my 2 with RESPECT, a little Fear and with 100% concentration! Oh, No more driving on wet or frosted over road.

 

I bet it's not a far stretch to add Turbo software to a GT2 to get PSM...

I'll take some flack here, but the reason behind people wanting to drive cars with no driver aids at all on the street defies all logic. Like motorsports R said all you need is a a wet road or some gravel and you're toast.

Alex, you should try a day at Willow Springs if you haven't yet. Start with the streets and then work your way to the big track. The streets is like driving on topanga. You can't really go past 80 MPH ever due to the sharp turns, but because of the lower speeds you will feel more comfortable pushing it and can end the day sliding it around some turns if you're so inclined. I drive with PSM off, but have been comforted to know that PSM is still there under braking. We're not all race car drivers. We may be better than 99% of the people on the street, but at the track we're only average at best.