Have questions regarding lowering the car. Can't seem to find answer
 

So, I recently purchased an 04 996TT Cab with 7,700 miles. I just purchased a set of 19" Techart Formulas for the car and would like to lower it an inch. This is where my questions start. Before I start I need to tell you how the car will be driven/used. This will be a pleasure cruiser that will not see track time except the windy roads on the weekends and occasional highway speeds above 100. With that being said... here we go.

I have researched a lot regarding using springs to lower vs. purchasing coil overs (PSS9's, 10's, or KW's 1, 2 or 3). I have heard about ride quality and limits of lowering with 19's while still keeping camber in check, bouncing over bumps, etc. etc...

When I owned my 930 we always spoke about "European ride height or ROW cars" which were always about an inch or just less than that lower than our USA cars. Question: How do the ROW cars achieve this? Do they use a completely different coil over set-up or do they just use a different spring? If it is just a different set of springs and they are not complaining then why is lowering cars with springs here so frowned upon?

Just trying to justify why I need to pay $3,000 instead of paying $500+ and alignment if I can lower the car and not lose the ride quality for my pleasure mobile.

Thoughts? Thanks for the help/advice in advance.

Regards,
Bryan

i think the ROW cars use the x73 suspension, which is a new shock and spring setup non adjustable but lower and a bit diffferent. pss9 is an upgrade over this and pss10 above that.

there have been a few happy customers with just springs, bmoores and adam here in houston like their setups but they are no match for a full coilover.

I'm in the same boat as X98. Will just changing the springs eventually blow out the struts like most springs on other cars requiring a strut change anyway? I've seen a lot of cars on just H&R springs and I think it is the perfect height. However, saving $2000 to shortly later have to change shocks, labor, and alignment all over again may not be worth the savings.

Some vendors here are selling PSS9/10 kits for about 2400$. I think it's great value for money.
There are some used GT2 stock suspension for sale (I saw them yesterday) here, WheelDynamics is selling them.

BTW, even ROW cars on stock susp. look a bit high...I wouldn't consider the option of buying an X73 suspension kit.

Here's mine

Attachment 133125

Attachment 133131

Thanks
 

I appreciate all the feedback. In my research I never came across people who's shocks went bad due to lowering springs... maybe I just missed it.

Some thoughts,

1) What exactly is the x73 suspension... can someone tell me the exact differences?
2) $2,000 for coilovers still seems like a far cry from $500. Can someone confirm from their own personal memory/experience that springs ruin shocks?

Just trying to get to the bottom of the spring debate based on what I will be using the car for.

Thanks for all the input thus far.

Bryan

Just to clarify...I haven't heard of any complaints about springs killing stock struts either on a Porsche. However, my experience with other makes (Infiniti, BMW, Honda) have proven that springs only will kill the stock shocks after about 6mos to 1 year. I wonder if this is true with Porsches? Or are Porsche struts so well made that they can handle the more aggressive spring?

X98 you should ask to F1crazydriver, he's had RUF springs in his car for quite some time and he was very happy with them.

As for X73, they are simply a set of firmer shocks/springs, and are a bit lower, but don't take them into your equation, IMO they are not worth the hassle. They are not very comfortable too, quite bumpy I would say. A set of coilovers (I tried my bud's TT with PSS10) is surprisingly more comfortable.

I had Ruf springs on my car and I was extremely happy. Frankly I was more happy driving on the street with them then I'm with my KW clupsports ( I expected this) I also had a chance to drive a car with pss9's and they were set way to soft imo, they felt mushier then stock. Yes I know, it can be adjusted but honestly, i couldn't tell the difference nor understood why the owner set it so mushy and soft and spend the $3500 after all is set and done for something he dosen't plan to use.

Dollar for dollar, my ruf springs were amazing. Cornered amazing, looked great, at the track even with other Porkas around with their motons etc. had a hard time keeping up with me. My best memory with the ruf springs ( besides beating the GTR's with Ramiez behind the wheel and Adam ;) ) was having a gt3 on slicks/motons the whole 9yards - spin out trying to keep up with me at the track. :D

I loved the ruf springs because I didn't have to worry about 'adjustments' it was just get on and go. It was rough enough that made you feel like your driving a sports car, but not rough enough that it was disturbing for me. I live in Bay Area, with very nice backroads about a mile away from me so handling to me was a priority. A few members here have driven my car and they loved the way it felt with ruf springs. Porka and 80shillings are two of them. 80shillings has JRZs pros 3 way adjustable on his gt2, and he concluded that my car felt 90% like his gt2. I had them for 30,000 miles or so on my car, and i dont have blown shocks or anything of that sort. Lapping 1:58's at our local thunderhill track where our cars stock lapped 2:10's according to Car and Driver, not to bad if you ask me ( they qouted a gt2 running 2:00 )

Anyways, you can see in this video, even though I'm taking the offline because i'm lapping these guys (fast forward to the 3 minute marker) you can see the car behaves very nice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBSOPLwGEb0

F1crazydriver
 

Thanks, that is the info I was looking for. Just to clarify, you only had RUF springs with stock twin turbo shocks? I wanted to make sure you didn't change the shocks as well or started with something different.

Also, can you or someone explain if there is much difference between RUF springs and someone like, HRE or another brand?

I feel pretty confident that springs will work fine for me at this point.

Bryan

IMO the suspension setup has much to do with the driver. I'm just a so so driver, I need a good suspension to save my butt... and it happened many times. bmoores and f1crazydriver are good drivers (from what I've read before), they are probably safer drivers driving a high power Geo Metro with stock suspension than I'm driving a 996TT.

Believe me, with a 996TT, you will drive over 100 more than "occasional highway speeds". MO is... do the right thing! That extra $1500 may be the best investment you ever made.

I haven't gone really really fast on my H&R springs that I installed a month ago, but I can say this- I am totally enjoying the ride around town and love the look.

X98, it sounds like a good set of lowering springs are just what you need. Although I'm normally a pretty strong advocate of coilovers simply because of their adjustability and firmer ride, I would say that if you're never going to see the track, and you're mainly concerned with looks....you can't go wrong.

We use H&R springs and have not had a problem with them. The drop is 1 inch at all four corners. Because it's not an extreme lowering, the effect it has on your factory struts is negligible. I don't think they'll wear out any faster then normal. The ride is very much like stock, just a little bit firmer.

But I will say this...if you're going to the track, or even in some of the twisties, the downside to springs alone is that the car still has a bit of that floaty front end feel. Less then stock, but it's still there slightly.

Hope this helps. :)

I've had H&R Springs on my 996 C4S for 3 1/2 years and am still on my stock shocks. While the rear of the car is a little depressed, the camber is not that far off. She does get a little squirrely at high speeds, but I'm thinking there is an element of issues with the roads around here in Northern VA. My tuner (who installs C/O's a lot) said the car rides FINE. We're upgrading the stabilizer bars and I put a Tequipment Roll Bar with Cross Brace to firm up the ride on corners. Not the best of the best, but you know what, I'm happy with it. I was in the same boat as you.....opted to go for H&R Springs......was considering C/O's.....but now reading this thread, will probably stick with springs. But, if I am going to track the car more.....I will have to upgrade to coilovers, but at $2500+ install, that's not the end of the "BILLS" for starting to track the car on a regular basis.

STICK WITH SPRINGS!!!!

You will be unhappy with the results and end up paying later...get the coilovers. Don't believe the hype, the Ksports work just fine.