Tiptronic limits
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,530
From: Romania, Bucharest
Rep Power: 167
So I was right about the price of a very good clutch?!
Well we are talking about a clutch that will take all the power a 996TT motor will make basically. I've seen single disk used at 750rwhp on Justin's car with no problems and I think the clutch was $2k if that.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,364
From: houston, TX
Rep Power: 96
Lets clarify what is the term of "building" and "upgrade" the tip first.
Building - is when you destroy your gearbox?!
Upgrade - is when you change the weak points in the gearbox?!
MKB is selling the upgrade kit for ~3500euro
WhiteKnight for like 5000$
Switzer i think is more or the same as WhiteKnight.
9ff- i don't know...
I personally think that the biggest problem is the heating in the gearbox (from what i read) and the tq.
Building - is when you destroy your gearbox?!
Upgrade - is when you change the weak points in the gearbox?!
MKB is selling the upgrade kit for ~3500euro
WhiteKnight for like 5000$
Switzer i think is more or the same as WhiteKnight.
9ff- i don't know...
I personally think that the biggest problem is the heating in the gearbox (from what i read) and the tq.
Upgrading involving machining the tranny to hold more clutch packs and then replacing the clutch packs with a different material. They also modify the valve bodies for must quicker shifting.
If you are upgrading your tranny, i don't think it matters if its blown or not. In fact, I believe that White Knight prefers to have it broken so he knows which parts to focus on when strengthening them.
The torque converter helps with the stall to get better launches, not handle more power. Why else would MKB sell such an expensive kit and not even offer a TC upgrade?
Also, I only think temps matter on long runs...if you plan to do track events, i would definitely do something for additional cooling.
I only drive the car hard for 5-10 minutes at a time so I plan to just do the tranny upgrade and maybe the TC once my tranny blows...I don't plan on adding more cooling for now.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 256
From: McAllen, Texas
Rep Power: 33
Can more tuners chime in on this? I was JUST about to pull the trigger on converting my X50 K24s to 18gs with Akram in Houston when I started reading this post (I was going to get Markski to do the 18g conversion, but I live close to Houston and felt it better to get Akram involved in order to address any gremlins that show up with the conversion). I don't want to have to deal with a Tiptronic rebuild if that's what's going to be the inevitable outcome of converting to the 18gs.
BTW: I have Markski's ICs (EXCELLENT customer service with Markski!), Proto tune, 1 bar wastegates, 5 bar fpr, upgraded plugs, Miltek exhaust, Evoms diverter valves, Switzer hoses, PSS9, and Greddy EBC. As you can see, I was working my way up to the 18gs.
BTW: I have Markski's ICs (EXCELLENT customer service with Markski!), Proto tune, 1 bar wastegates, 5 bar fpr, upgraded plugs, Miltek exhaust, Evoms diverter valves, Switzer hoses, PSS9, and Greddy EBC. As you can see, I was working my way up to the 18gs.
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 739
From: NYC
Rep Power: 128
I trust my tuner to do that but, just in case, what is a high level of boost? I won't be adding any boost controllers or overriding any factory safeguards.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,530
From: Romania, Bucharest
Rep Power: 167
Well i realize this isnt a ford or chevy but typically the factory automatics are stronger than standards but lose a lot through auto drivetrain. And a lot of standard guys end up goin to the auto for durability. That was my thought process in getting the tip. I just dont want to miss a gear with 600 at crank!! I had a 6 speed in my wussy C2.
But again this is not a ford and i have very little experience with the tippy, particularly the practicle kind. Sux to hear cuz i was really lookin forward to high 10 second power!! Il take ur word for it Todd. I can barely afford to get to 600 crank. I dont care to get into 6000$ tranny build! Just to answer other guys question, if im not mistaken the tippy in the x50 is beefed up a bit more than mine?
Looks like iv got some more thinking to do. Blow the tranny with moderat boost on 24/18 or blow the engine on high boost with 16G? Tranny is cheaper, but so is neither. Crap
But again this is not a ford and i have very little experience with the tippy, particularly the practicle kind. Sux to hear cuz i was really lookin forward to high 10 second power!! Il take ur word for it Todd. I can barely afford to get to 600 crank. I dont care to get into 6000$ tranny build! Just to answer other guys question, if im not mistaken the tippy in the x50 is beefed up a bit more than mine?
Looks like iv got some more thinking to do. Blow the tranny with moderat boost on 24/18 or blow the engine on high boost with 16G? Tranny is cheaper, but so is neither. Crap
Second - I never heard about this!
Banned
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,144
From: Florida
Rep Power: 75
No, the tip is much weaker than the stock 6 speed.
I'm trying to save you a ton of money and wasted down time in a shop by just sticking with 16/16's, injectors, exhaust and tune. Edit: also, IC's, DV's and upgraded boost hoses.
I made 500whp/525tq on that set up. Plenty for a tip. Spend the other money on PSS10's, links and sway bars (front and back).
If you are power hungry, you'll be ultimately disappointed in the tips weakness.
I'm trying to save you a ton of money and wasted down time in a shop by just sticking with 16/16's, injectors, exhaust and tune. Edit: also, IC's, DV's and upgraded boost hoses.
I made 500whp/525tq on that set up. Plenty for a tip. Spend the other money on PSS10's, links and sway bars (front and back).
If you are power hungry, you'll be ultimately disappointed in the tips weakness.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Ninjaboy.../2/DaJxycZgmTo
Banned
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,144
From: Florida
Rep Power: 75
Can more tuners chime in on this? I was JUST about to pull the trigger on converting my X50 K24s to 18gs with Akram in Houston when I started reading this post (I was going to get Markski to do the 18g conversion, but I live close to Houston and felt it better to get Akram involved in order to address any gremlins that show up with the conversion). I don't want to have to deal with a Tiptronic rebuild if that's what's going to be the inevitable outcome of converting to the 18gs.
BTW: I have Markski's ICs (EXCELLENT customer service with Markski!), Proto tune, 1 bar wastegates, 5 bar fpr, upgraded plugs, Miltek exhaust, Evoms diverter valves, Switzer hoses, PSS9, and Greddy EBC. As you can see, I was working my way up to the 18gs.
BTW: I have Markski's ICs (EXCELLENT customer service with Markski!), Proto tune, 1 bar wastegates, 5 bar fpr, upgraded plugs, Miltek exhaust, Evoms diverter valves, Switzer hoses, PSS9, and Greddy EBC. As you can see, I was working my way up to the 18gs.
Akram can reinforce ur tranny for $7000
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 5,301
From: Houston
Rep Power: 607
I don't know of a single tip tranny that Akram has reinforced. Show me.
Banned
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,144
From: Florida
Rep Power: 75
Give Akram a call
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 239
From: Turkey
Rep Power: 36
I disagree...from what I understand, destroying your gearbox means eating up the clutches (usually in just one or two gears).
Upgrading involving machining the tranny to hold more clutch packs and then replacing the clutch packs with a different material. They also modify the valve bodies for must quicker shifting.
If you are upgrading your tranny, i don't think it matters if its blown or not. In fact, I believe that White Knight prefers to have it broken so he knows which parts to focus on when strengthening them.
The torque converter helps with the stall to get better launches, not handle more power. Why else would MKB sell such an expensive kit and not even offer a TC upgrade?
Also, I only think temps matter on long runs...if you plan to do track events, i would definitely do something for additional cooling.
I only drive the car hard for 5-10 minutes at a time so I plan to just do the tranny upgrade and maybe the TC once my tranny blows...I don't plan on adding more cooling for now.
Upgrading involving machining the tranny to hold more clutch packs and then replacing the clutch packs with a different material. They also modify the valve bodies for must quicker shifting.
If you are upgrading your tranny, i don't think it matters if its blown or not. In fact, I believe that White Knight prefers to have it broken so he knows which parts to focus on when strengthening them.
The torque converter helps with the stall to get better launches, not handle more power. Why else would MKB sell such an expensive kit and not even offer a TC upgrade?
Also, I only think temps matter on long runs...if you plan to do track events, i would definitely do something for additional cooling.
I only drive the car hard for 5-10 minutes at a time so I plan to just do the tranny upgrade and maybe the TC once my tranny blows...I don't plan on adding more cooling for now.
dear friends,
i have build six 997tt tiptronic till now all working with more than 600hp
without any problem.
most of them has 3076 turbos
i made also oil cooler which helps above 100km/h , it drops the heat about 10 degrees
torque converter don't touch it no needed
very soon i will make a 996 tip i will let you know the results
the gearbox of 997 and 996 are similar and the valvebody is same
changing the valvebody is making shifting very fast and sometimes very similar to Pdk but you have to upgrade also the tcu to get better results
P.S. don't forget to control the central differential oil because the weakest part of the car is center diff . if the oil is not red then problem starts.
997tt has different cental diff than 996tt . i have also reinforced 997tt center diff .
regards
emre
i
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 5,301
From: Houston
Rep Power: 607
Good for you mr knight. But you are in Turkey. Thats not very practical for us over here. Are you a 6 speed sponsor?
dear friends,
i have build six 997tt tiptronic till now all working with more than 600hp
without any problem.
most of them has 3076 turbos
i made also oil cooler which helps above 100km/h , it drops the heat about 10 degrees
torque converter don't touch it no needed
very soon i will make a 996 tip i will let you know the results
the gearbox of 997 and 996 are similar and the valvebody is same
changing the valvebody is making shifting very fast and sometimes very similar to Pdk but you have to upgrade also the tcu to get better results
P.S. don't forget to control the central differential oil because the weakest part of the car is center diff . if the oil is not red then problem starts.
997tt has different cental diff than 996tt . i have also reinforced 997tt center diff .
regards
emre
i
i have build six 997tt tiptronic till now all working with more than 600hp
without any problem.
most of them has 3076 turbos
i made also oil cooler which helps above 100km/h , it drops the heat about 10 degrees
torque converter don't touch it no needed
very soon i will make a 996 tip i will let you know the results
the gearbox of 997 and 996 are similar and the valvebody is same
changing the valvebody is making shifting very fast and sometimes very similar to Pdk but you have to upgrade also the tcu to get better results
P.S. don't forget to control the central differential oil because the weakest part of the car is center diff . if the oil is not red then problem starts.
997tt has different cental diff than 996tt . i have also reinforced 997tt center diff .
regards
emre
i
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 239
From: Turkey
Rep Power: 36
let's see first what i can do with this 996tt tip then we can find a way to ship to usa
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,184
From: Bentonville, AR
Rep Power: 89
K24/18G is Markski & Proto's ( Todd K ) forte. Get w/ either of them if you want the low down on that set up. You won't find any1 w/ more working and developing knowledge then these 2 guys on K24s.
Todd " BlackHorseTurbo " is a guy that knows Tips.
Todd " BlackHorseTurbo " is a guy that knows Tips.
