Turning slowly and nit deep on each pass is what they say. It might be easier getting new rotors... Several vendors have OEM and others for cheap. Or do I upgrade all together...

Etchhead and myself dropping down a wet cork screw...

http://www.vizualid.com/6speed/102_029_LS_LZ.jpg

Ruf_Turbo, any luck getting those Sebring videos up yet? We have another LS event on the 20th hoping for warm and dry conditions so I can test out the new R6’s on the GT2 wheels with 7mm’s all the way around. I’ll be sure to snap a few pic’s for you BH.

I was really referring to my NEXT session (May 7) when I have the 2 camera setup...and I can find and learn some cheap video edit program that will let me do PIP.

I can cobble together a couple of laps from the last session, and maybe mix the front and rear camera view, if that is any interest.

^ No worries...wait until you figure out your new stuff. I like the rear cams if you can figure it all out and overlay Harry’s Lap Timer muy bien to you!

RE: Etchead’s Rotors

So I checked with a few different sources (shops) today and they basically all said the same thing.

Critical error made: Putting NEW pads on rotors 10 years old. A groved, ridged, and lipped surface trying to mate up with the perfectly smooth and flat surface of the pads. The two do not mesh, thus creating unnecessary binding and heat resulting in warping the rotos. Unfortunately the pads are now toast as well due to improper bedding-in and glazing. If you were sand down or file off the glazing the pads would then have a rough surface and get chewed up very quickly once you install them on the rotors.

Tough lesson...on the plus side you only wasted cash on the pads. I am really surprised the shop you had the work done at would do this...they should know better.

In the last two years (not counting you) I know of three guys who didn’t bedded their new pads and rotors in properly and wasted both by the beginning of the third session of the day.

Bedding-in new pads and rotors: I found this info below which seems consistent with what I was told after installing my AP Racing CUP rotors.

Bedding allows your brakes to reach their full potential. Until they are bedded, your brakes simply do not work as well as they can. If you've installed a big brake kit, changed your pads and rotors, or even purchased a brand new car, you should set aside time to bed the brakes according to the instructions below. Proper bedding improves pedal feel, reduces or eliminates brake squeal, prevents (and often cures) brake judder, reduces brake dust, and extends the life of your pads and rotors.
Immediately after installing new pads, rotors or a big brake kit, the first few applications of the brakes will result in very little braking power. Gently use the brakes a few times at low speed in order to build up some grip before blasting down the road at high speed. Otherwise, you may be in for a nasty surprise the first time you hit the brakes at 60 mph.

If you have just installed rotors with zinc or cadmium plating, or if the rotors have an anti-corrosion phosphate coating, you should postpone the bedding process until normal driving has allowed your brake pads to polish the rotors clean and removed all traces of the plating or coating. If your new brake rotors have an oily anti-corrosion coating, you should clean this off thoroughly with brake cleaning spray and/or hot soapy water.

Read and understand these bedding instructions completely before starting. Do not substitute higher speeds for the 60mph called for in these instructions. The heat in your brakes goes up exponentially as you increase the speed from which you brake. If you make repeated stops from 80 or 90mph with street pads, you will overheat the brakes and may end up having to replace pads and/or rotors.

1) From 60mph, gently apply the brakes a couple of times to bring them up to operating temperature. This prevents you from thermally shocking the rotors and pads in the next steps.

2) Make eight to ten near-stops from 60mph to about 10-15 mph. Do it HARD by pressing the brakes firmly, but do not lock the wheels or engage ABS. At the end of each slowdown, immediately accelerate back to 60mph and then apply the brakes again. DO NOT COME TO A COMPLETE STOP! If you stop completely and sit with your foot on the brake pedal, you will imprint pad material onto the hot rotors, which could lead to vibration and uneven braking.

3) The brakes may begin to fade after the 7th or 8th near-stop. This fade will stabilize, but not completely go away until the brakes have fully cooled. A strong smell from the brakes, and even some smoke, is normal.

4) After the last near-stop, accelerate back up to speed and cruise for a while, using the brakes as little as possible. The brakes need only a few minutes to cool down. Try not to become trapped in traffic or come to a complete stop while the brakes are still very hot.

5) If full race pads, such as Hawk DTC-70 or Performance Friction PFC01 are being used, add four near-stops from 80 to 10 mph.

After the break-in cycle, there should be a slight blue tint and a light gray film on the rotor face. The blue tint tells you the rotor has reached break-in temperature and the gray film is pad material starting to transfer onto the rotor face. This is what you are looking for. The best braking occurs when there is an even layer of of pad material deposited across the rotors. This minimizes squealing, increases braking torque, and maximizes pad and rotor life.

After the first break in cycle shown above, the brakes may still not be fully broken in. A second bed-in cycle, AFTER the brakes have cooled down fully from the first cycle, may be necessary before the brakes really start to perform well. This is especially true if you have installed new pads on old rotors, since the pads need time to conform to the old rotor wear pattern. If you've just installed a big brake kit, the pedal travel may not feel as firm as you expected. After the second cycle, the pedal will become noticeably firmer.

I would like to add after doing the above, once you get to your first track event its equally important to allow your rotors to slowly cool down after each session. This will be the first time they actually really get used, so proper cooling down is essential. Also once you have circled the pits or parking lot a few times and feel its time to park your car, roll it a few inches backwards every three to five minutes (3 or 4 times after each session). Your pads will retain heat and will not allow your rotos to cool evenly. Therefore may warp or pick-up some small vibrations that will worsen over time.

See attached photo were I left my car sit longer then five minutes after parking it from a session (first track day with them). However, I just took this picture today and that heat sync happen in early September!

http://www.vizualid.com/6speed/Pad_Heat_Sync_MZ.jpg

^ Nice writeup! Reps for you! ^

Another bedding technique is to simply drive around town for a few miles @ 35 -40 mph and apply the brakes while still applying the throttle. The 997's (and perhaps other models) tolerate this dual application for a few seconds and then the motor loses power (safety feature). Release the brake, power is restored, accelerate and repeat a dozen times or so. Then drive around to allow the brakes to cool. Also, at the track in particular, allow the car to coast to a final stop in the paddock (say from 2 mph or so) and never set the hand brake. Best,

PS Great images too!

^ I agree with the hand brake (old school) although on the turbos (and others, not sure???) the hand brake actives a drum brake shoe set-up located inside the rear hats. I still don’t like using it and chalk the car with a 2x4 at track in conjunction with leaving the car in neutral. Actually this is how I park my car in the garage as well...all loosey-goosey.

Thanks for the REPs!

Thanks guys- so picked up new OEM rotors yesterday, GT3 air ducts, and will order new MPS Cups later tonight. Then hope I can grind down my Cool Carbon pads as they are new other than my LS cooking party.

ONE MONTH LATER & ITS STILL RAINING!

Wednesday at LS: 04/20/2011

Well is wasn’t the best day for playing. Overcast and wet almost the entire day, even a shower or two, never saw the sun. I was able to mount up the Hoosiers R6’s after lunch and 17 minutes into the session it poured down on us.

I must say the first thing I noticed with HR6s is how much smoother and compliant they are over street tires. They seem to take a lot of the harshness and edginess out of the ride and made the car feel like one integrated package. Everyone always raves about the grip...and yes the grip in amazing...but the overall ride and increased breaking performance is what struck me first. It was apparent to me within just the first 3 turns...incredable. Coupled with the R6’s mounted to GT2 wheels I added 7mm spacer to all four corners which Shiraaz at Champion Motorsports was able to supply for me (thanks again CMS!). It seemed like these really helped alleviate the inherent understeer of TT’s. Although hard to say with the R6’s now up front. Ended up going with 235/35‘s and 315/30’s in the rear. So far so good.

Within that 17 minutes was able to get a few laps in to get a feel for them and build my confidence. I pulled in, checked the pressure and lugs, went back out and got one warm-up and one pseudo hot lap..wet curbs, traffic, and lifting for sound...but I did manage a 1:44...then the rain came and the magic was gone.

I was able to take advantage of two run groups/classes which was nice because these groups ran back to back. Therefore I logged 106 laps for the day. I tried to make the most of it.

Etchhead had a disappointing day. New MPSC’s, rotors, pads, and GT3 brake ducts, and got a session and a half in. First one damp and trying to bed his brakes in properly, and the second session less then half way through and he had a sidewall failure (rear rt, inside). Had to mount up the spare donut wheel and call it a day. I felt for him...totally sucked...he took it well though.

80 schillings gave me some pointers for T2 which really helped smooth out my line and therefore was able to take the turn much more consistently lap after lap.

Sorry no pictures, the weather just wasn’t cooperating and I didn’t feel much like shooting a filthy car. I did have an opportunity to shoot the spacers before installing them.

Oh yeah, the check engine light came twice OBDII CODE: P1096. I cleared it with my reader once in between sessions and once again at the end of the day for the drive home. It has yet to re-appear???

http://www.vizualid.com/6speed/CMS_Spacers_LZ.jpg

I was with him on the 1:44 lap so add another 185#s to the things working against his time. Nice job, and WOW can those R6s hold in the dry... Little sprinkle and it changed quickly.

My new MPS Cup gets installed Mon latest. No more Laguna events till later this fall. Will have to head back to Sears or try one of the others.

Thanks for the ride!

Below is a quick and dirty snap shot of a black 7mm spacer up against a stock rear hat and with a CMS RS171 rim mounted. The OD is a perfect fit with the OEM hat. Looks great and the fit is very clean. I couldn’t get a sharp shot of the front...I’ll try again when I have more time.

http://www.vizualid.com/6speed/Rear_CMS_7mm_LZ.jpg

05.03.2011

Had some time to shoot the fronts today.

Front rotors are AP Racing 380mm with AP Racing aluminum hats, Pads: Pagid RS19, and ATE Super Blue Brake Fluid.

Rims: Champion RS 171’s, 8.5x19 ET 53, Satin Black, Champion 7mm Spacers with Champion bright silver longer lugs.

I hope you enjoy the photos.


http://www.vizualid.com/SPACERS/03_Front_Spacer_LZ.jpg

http://www.vizualid.com/SPACERS/05_Front_Spacer_LZ.jpg

http://www.vizualid.com/SPACERS/06_Front_Spacer_LZ.jpg

^ This shot really turned out nice...can’t really see the spacer but its still a nice image.


http://www.vizualid.com/SPACERS/04_Front_Spacer_LZ.jpg

^ I like the sidewall tire wear indicator on this one. Used what the tire had to offer.

Darin, you WERE working those tires. :D

^ Hey B-ruf-tee,

When is your Sebring date? Got the dual cameras and video software dialed in yet?

I was able the get the Hoosiers R6’s out for the second half of the day. Overcast, damp and 66º, they were still pretty amazing. Can’t wait for a warm dry event day.

Be sure to post your vids.

http://www.vizualid.com/SPACERS/07_Front_Hoosier_LZ.jpg

http://www.vizualid.com/SPACERS/08_Front_Hoosier_LZ.jpg

This weekend baby! Well Saturday anyway.

I think I am all set with the video s/w so I will post some vids early next week.