i enjoyed the bonus of an IMS failure with my C4S so was pretty sensative to the issue of Porsche motors. in fact the history of porsche motors is raft with examples of various minor & major failure issues.

they certainly engineered the hell out of that turbo and it has one of the cleanest pasts for the marque.

 

"Complete overkill" based on what evidence? Or whose opinion?

Have you ever driven a 911 with PCCB, back to back to one with iron brake? Not just a few minute test drive, but a long term session at speed?
If yes, did you feel **any** difference?
Really asking as it will affect how detailed I am going to be with my answer.

 

Can, agree with everything you've said except the PCCB's...really not a very good set up for much track use due to replacement costs. Great for street use!

 

Makes me want to get the 991 in red....lol

 

Agreed w/ you completely - and it seems you read my mind! I realized I needed to add a modification to my post and that was planned in my next reply: The "strange" thing about PCCB is that as much as it is supposed to help at the track, it's not recommended if you are going to track the car. There have been reports of damage for track use and the cost of replacement is simply too much.

PCCB for this reason is not only NOT overkill for the street - it is best used for street! The answer for anyone interested, briefly, has to do with 35 lbs less unsprung weight and the "initial bite." It's like being stopped by the hands of God.

rvhpno80 - thanks. LOL.

 

All good points... So as a week-end warrior who has been driving Porsches for about 10 years and started with the 1999 C2, I chickened out and sold that car because of the potential imploding engine due to the variety of seals that Porsche did not seem to be able to repair or redesign. I looked at a variety of high-end Italian iron and found major defects with everyone one of them. All those cars really are just a serious liability to your bank account with nothing but some bragging rights to show for it. So, there is very little out there that has the pure sports car feel and experience in a package that is pretty complete, can be driven daily and is affordable at the same time except a Porsche. That is, except for the horrible exploding engines and seals that -frankly - still seem to pop up even in very recent built cars. But then, there is the Mezger engine and now Porsche had a package that I was prepared to invest my money in. My search therefor got limited to a few Porsche car models and production years. I actually started to look for the appropriate drive train (gear box, engine and tracking components) and the body year was not that important any longer. In talking with Porsche mechanics and Indies that work on Porsches, unanimously the story came back that said that any Porsche Turbo 2002 and later would be worthwhile to own ( if condition etc would be up to par).
I really don't care about the quality of the Radio, or the entertainment PCM system and a classic interior Porsche design (as outdated as it might be) makes me feel right at home. I do not long for a rearview camera, flick-flops to change gears and doing that through 7 built inc computers in 3 milliseconds. That is simply not why I want to drive a sports car. I want to be in charge, make the decisions and bully the car to where I want it to go.... And, all of that without braking down, costing an arm and a leg and an engine out every 5 years to change some belts at 15K dollars or a new belt housing and complete new transmission every 10K miles . That is not my idea of fun. As a week-end driver, I want to be able to mount my horse at anytime and put it back in the stables wet and hot after I am done. Just my view of fun and games I guess!! So a 2003 Turbo, unsophisticated with a loud Fabspeed exhaust and a old fashioned 6 speed gear box and a few extra horses easily extracted from that old 993 racing engine block seems to do be doing this rather nicely!

 

I was saying it's complete overkill due to the fact that in street driving conditions, you will never get the temperatures of the standard brakes to the point where you're going to start experiencing brake fade. The standard brakes are fine for street duty. As for initial bite, you can change the characteristics of initial bite with different pads.

And on the track, while they are better than the standard brakes in terms of fade resistance, they still aren't up to snuff for severe track duty, so in the end you have to upgrade the brakes to a big rotor iron disc setup anyway.

You're free to disagree with me on this, but every track enthusiast I know feels the same way about them and choose iron rotor setups over PCCB.

 

Aside from no brake dust which is awesome (who wouldn't want that if you had a choice), pccbs are a LOT lighter than the reds. How about for feel and weight savings?

 

This is from my experience as well

 

No problem and I see what you mean. So you've not driven a PCCB car right? My recommendation of PCCB has to do with 2 parameters:
1. 35 lbs less un-sprung weight.
2. The "initial bite."

Unsprung weight: While it's debatable whether any particular driver could feel the difference, it's fact that increased unsprung weight affects every important parameter of motorsport performance. This has to do with increased linear momentum (affecting the suspension system), and increased angular/rotation momentum (affecting acceleration and braking). There is an additional parameter called gyroscopic effect, aka precession. These last 2 affect steering effort and precession could result in vibration. If you want to understand precession, take 2 aspirins and I'll refer you to the Wikipedia site :-). I barely understand the concept myself (didn't stop me from talking about it though LOL).

Initial bite: This is rarely discussed and you'll see what I mean if/when you test drive one. The initial bite is about both subjective feel and the stopping power that you feel when you first step on the brake pedal. This is what people refer too when they talk about being stopped by the hands of God. It is also why I would wager 90% of owners who don't track cars will never return to iron brake.

Note that there has NEVER been any proof that PCCB has shorter stopping distance. That said, my humble opinion is that PCCB is one of those finer things in life that you may not need, but you do want. If you have the $ (I understand if you don't) and don't track the car, for fun, for enjoyment, once in your life, you want a taste of PCCB. I recommend it for used cars because I feel original owner have taken a big hit for current buyer already, and at the discounted price, there is now no question that it's worth it. Good luck and have fun with your search!

 

Don't get me wrong, if money was no object PCCB all the way. But for many of us picking up the 997.1 now, money is a decently important factor, at which point the first thing for me to go is the PCCB.

 

I have driven several cars with PCCBs, GT3 and TT. I've also driven a 430 Scuderia with ceramic brakes as well.

I guess I'm not really enamored with initial bite and brake torque as I have tracked cars where you feel like your eye ***** are going to pop out when you get on the brakes.

I do agree that reducing unsprung weight is nice though.

 

PCCB was a non-factor in buying my TT.

If I got them I'd sell the rotors and swap to steel.

Stock brakes are perfectly fine and if you are doing any track days you do not want to deal with PCCB.

You get high initial bite with PCCB sure, this was the first thing I noticed when I drove a PCCB TT. Great, if I want that I can find an aftermarket street pad with a lot of high initial bite and replicate the effect.

The unsprung weight reduction is certainly a plus, but I don't see it being worth it unless you only plan on driving your car strictly on the street without ever running a DE where you risk breaking your super expensive brakes.

Now that I think about it, I'd like PCCB calipers just so they match my car

I think everything else mentioned here is spot on.

 

To many onwers, just like you, other options like adaptive seats, CF interior, Leather stitching etc etc don't mean much either.

But having some nice exclusive options not only makes the interior more warmer but it makes the car feel special too

The PCCB and the steel calipers are the same it's just the color which you can easily paint yours too.

 

enough talk.. someone find me one! lol