Need opinions and advice on potential 997S purchase
#1
10-09-2017, 03:20 AM
Need opinions and advice on potential 997S purchase
Hello everyone. Im in the market for my second 911. Found one that I want to pull the trigger on, but I want to hear some opinions.
It's a 2007 997 S. Black on Beige. Manual. Sports Chrono package/sport exhaust/PASM/PSM. Sports seats. Test drive was very pleasant. This one the color combo and options that I am looking for.
The negatives; 65k miles, small dent on quarter panel, rebuilt motor last year (LN Enginering IMS upgrade was done, and water pump was replaced as well). BUT it comes with bumper to bumper warranty til 100k.
So the question is, is this a good buy? And for how much?
It's a 2007 997 S. Black on Beige. Manual. Sports Chrono package/sport exhaust/PASM/PSM. Sports seats. Test drive was very pleasant. This one the color combo and options that I am looking for.
The negatives; 65k miles, small dent on quarter panel, rebuilt motor last year (LN Enginering IMS upgrade was done, and water pump was replaced as well). BUT it comes with bumper to bumper warranty til 100k.
So the question is, is this a good buy? And for how much?
Last edited by rednerrus; 10-09-2017 at 03:30 AM.
#3
10-09-2017, 10:04 AM
i just bought a 2007 911S same color combo with all those options and more with 25k miles on it for $45k.
my insurance paid me out on my 2006 911s with same color combo and without sports chrono with 85k miles on it for $38k.
i would say somewhere between those two figures.
the 65k miles would not bother me at all but the 2007 did not have IMS and i would not buy a rebuilt engine. probably fine but all the questions on resale, etc. would not be worth it. I would keep looking if i were you
my insurance paid me out on my 2006 911s with same color combo and without sports chrono with 85k miles on it for $38k.
i would say somewhere between those two figures.
the 65k miles would not bother me at all but the 2007 did not have IMS and i would not buy a rebuilt engine. probably fine but all the questions on resale, etc. would not be worth it. I would keep looking if i were you
#4
10-09-2017, 02:49 PM
Engine rebuilt and an IMSB upgraded fitted at the same time? Or is someone attempting to spin an IMSB upgrade as an "engine" rebuild?
Even if the engine was rebuilt this brings with it more questions: Who did the rebuild? What was done? Why did the engine need rebuilding in the first place?
The "bumper to bumper" warranty I believe comes with a lot of fine print. Not unusual but you need to be sure to read and know what the fine print says particularly about what is covered and what is not covered. Also, you need to go to the place you will have the car serviced and repaired if necessary and speak to the shop about the warranty company, what it is like to deal with.
My usual advice, and I see no reason to deviate in this case, is to recommend you keep looking. There's a car out there for you with color and options you want and at a price you can agree upon and without the "story" of a rebuilt engine and IMSB upgrade.
Even if the engine was rebuilt this brings with it more questions: Who did the rebuild? What was done? Why did the engine need rebuilding in the first place?
The "bumper to bumper" warranty I believe comes with a lot of fine print. Not unusual but you need to be sure to read and know what the fine print says particularly about what is covered and what is not covered. Also, you need to go to the place you will have the car serviced and repaired if necessary and speak to the shop about the warranty company, what it is like to deal with.
My usual advice, and I see no reason to deviate in this case, is to recommend you keep looking. There's a car out there for you with color and options you want and at a price you can agree upon and without the "story" of a rebuilt engine and IMSB upgrade.
#5
10-09-2017, 05:08 PM
Here is the maintenance record. The owner said he heard some rattling, so he pulled over and sent it to the shop. They rebuilt the motor, and the record says "Replace IMS Bearing with L&N IMS Bearing upgrade kit.
My thinking was that if the IMS Bearing was replaced, I wouldnt have that looming over my head anymore. And the warranty (which supposedly paid for the rebuilding of the motor), gives me even more confidence that I wont have to shell out money for those unexpected repairs.
What do you guys mean by "the 2007 did not have the small IMS bearing"? Does this mean that the IMS bearing failing wouldnt lead to a catastrophic repair if it does fail?
Last edited by rednerrus; 10-09-2017 at 05:17 PM.
#6
10-09-2017, 11:11 PM
Since the motor was coming apart for the rebuild the IMS bearing can be replaced.
What I don’t like is when they say “replace if needed” or words like that....completely subjective. If needed by whom? You’re standing there with the motor apart and rebuilding it....replace all the parts, what’s another $1k when you’re spending $20k or more?
Did they say what was replaced because of wear?
What I don’t like is when they say “replace if needed” or words like that....completely subjective. If needed by whom? You’re standing there with the motor apart and rebuilding it....replace all the parts, what’s another $1k when you’re spending $20k or more?
Did they say what was replaced because of wear?
#7
10-10-2017, 08:46 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Long Island, New York
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I thought that after '06 there was a different IMS design. Didn't think LN made a kit (or that one was needed) for 06 and on engines.
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#8
10-10-2017, 05:57 PM
"Here is the maintenance record. The owner said he heard some rattling, so he pulled over and sent it to the shop. They rebuilt the motor, and the record says "Replace IMS Bearing with L&N IMS Bearing upgrade kit.
My thinking was that if the IMS Bearing was replaced, I wouldnt have that looming over my head anymore. And the warranty (which supposedly paid for the rebuilding of the motor), gives me even more confidence that I wont have to shell out money for those unexpected repairs.
What do you guys mean by "the 2007 did not have the small IMS bearing"? Does this mean that the IMS bearing failing wouldnt lead to a catastrophic repair if it does fail?"
On the surface that looks like a rebuild. But SoCal C2S asks the right question. What was replaced?
Chances are you'll never know at this point unless other paperwork is available that lists what was replaced.
To be balanced not everything needs to be replaced. As I have mentioned before I came up a 996 with a bad ISMB. The engine was out and apart on the tech's bench(es).
He replaced the IMS and its bearing, a couple of chain guide/rails which had some of the composite plastic broken loose from the excessive chain slack.
But the cams, lifters, valves, head seats, block deck, head surfaces, cylinders, piston rings, pistons, main and rod bearings, chains, tensioners, sprockets, etc. were all looking ok and no machine work or other items were replaced.
However the engine was running fine before the IMSB failed the failure was caught in time (as it appears to be the case with this 997) and collateral damage was minimal and the engine was a suitable candidate for an IMSB repair.
The Porsche tech had considerable experience in this area and was also working from guidelines provided by Porsche.
If you have confidence in the shop that did the rebuild and if there is any warranty on the rebuild that is transferrable to you that can possibly remove some of the risk. Personally I'm very leery of an engine that has been rebuilt and I would search for a car with no rebuild story. I would probably not bother with and IMSB upgrade but that is a decision every buyer of a used 997 that has the problematic IMSB has to make for himself.
I'm no aftermarket IMSB replacement expert and I can't really add anything of value to the question about small vs. large or whatever regarding the IMSB in 997 engines.
There might be some info at the LN web site.
My thinking was that if the IMS Bearing was replaced, I wouldnt have that looming over my head anymore. And the warranty (which supposedly paid for the rebuilding of the motor), gives me even more confidence that I wont have to shell out money for those unexpected repairs.
What do you guys mean by "the 2007 did not have the small IMS bearing"? Does this mean that the IMS bearing failing wouldnt lead to a catastrophic repair if it does fail?"
On the surface that looks like a rebuild. But SoCal C2S asks the right question. What was replaced?
Chances are you'll never know at this point unless other paperwork is available that lists what was replaced.
To be balanced not everything needs to be replaced. As I have mentioned before I came up a 996 with a bad ISMB. The engine was out and apart on the tech's bench(es).
He replaced the IMS and its bearing, a couple of chain guide/rails which had some of the composite plastic broken loose from the excessive chain slack.
But the cams, lifters, valves, head seats, block deck, head surfaces, cylinders, piston rings, pistons, main and rod bearings, chains, tensioners, sprockets, etc. were all looking ok and no machine work or other items were replaced.
However the engine was running fine before the IMSB failed the failure was caught in time (as it appears to be the case with this 997) and collateral damage was minimal and the engine was a suitable candidate for an IMSB repair.
The Porsche tech had considerable experience in this area and was also working from guidelines provided by Porsche.
If you have confidence in the shop that did the rebuild and if there is any warranty on the rebuild that is transferrable to you that can possibly remove some of the risk. Personally I'm very leery of an engine that has been rebuilt and I would search for a car with no rebuild story. I would probably not bother with and IMSB upgrade but that is a decision every buyer of a used 997 that has the problematic IMSB has to make for himself.
I'm no aftermarket IMSB replacement expert and I can't really add anything of value to the question about small vs. large or whatever regarding the IMSB in 997 engines.
There might be some info at the LN web site.
Last edited by Macster; 10-10-2017 at 06:00 PM.
#9
10-10-2017, 06:46 PM
"Here is the maintenance record. The owner said he heard some rattling, so he pulled over and sent it to the shop. They rebuilt the motor, and the record says "Replace IMS Bearing with L&N IMS Bearing upgrade kit.
My thinking was that if the IMS Bearing was replaced, I wouldnt have that looming over my head anymore. And the warranty (which supposedly paid for the rebuilding of the motor), gives me even more confidence that I wont have to shell out money for those unexpected repairs.
What do you guys mean by "the 2007 did not have the small IMS bearing"? Does this mean that the IMS bearing failing wouldnt lead to a catastrophic repair if it does fail?"
On the surface that looks like a rebuild. But SoCal C2S asks the right question. What was replaced?
Chances are you'll never know at this point unless other paperwork is available that lists what was replaced.
To be balanced not everything needs to be replaced. As I have mentioned before I came up a 996 with a bad ISMB. The engine was out and apart on the tech's bench(es).
He replaced the IMS and its bearing, a couple of chain guide/rails which had some of the composite plastic broken loose from the excessive chain slack.
But the cams, lifters, valves, head seats, block deck, head surfaces, cylinders, piston rings, pistons, main and rod bearings, chains, tensioners, sprockets, etc. were all looking ok and no machine work or other items were replaced.
However the engine was running fine before the IMSB failed the failure was caught in time (as it appears to be the case with this 997) and collateral damage was minimal and the engine was a suitable candidate for an IMSB repair.
The Porsche tech had considerable experience in this area and was also working from guidelines provided by Porsche.
If you have confidence in the shop that did the rebuild and if there is any warranty on the rebuild that is transferrable to you that can possibly remove some of the risk. Personally I'm very leery of an engine that has been rebuilt and I would search for a car with no rebuild story. I would probably not bother with and IMSB upgrade but that is a decision every buyer of a used 997 that has the problematic IMSB has to make for himself.
I'm no aftermarket IMSB replacement expert and I can't really add anything of value to the question about small vs. large or whatever regarding the IMSB in 997 engines.
There might be some info at the LN web site.
My thinking was that if the IMS Bearing was replaced, I wouldnt have that looming over my head anymore. And the warranty (which supposedly paid for the rebuilding of the motor), gives me even more confidence that I wont have to shell out money for those unexpected repairs.
What do you guys mean by "the 2007 did not have the small IMS bearing"? Does this mean that the IMS bearing failing wouldnt lead to a catastrophic repair if it does fail?"
On the surface that looks like a rebuild. But SoCal C2S asks the right question. What was replaced?
Chances are you'll never know at this point unless other paperwork is available that lists what was replaced.
To be balanced not everything needs to be replaced. As I have mentioned before I came up a 996 with a bad ISMB. The engine was out and apart on the tech's bench(es).
He replaced the IMS and its bearing, a couple of chain guide/rails which had some of the composite plastic broken loose from the excessive chain slack.
But the cams, lifters, valves, head seats, block deck, head surfaces, cylinders, piston rings, pistons, main and rod bearings, chains, tensioners, sprockets, etc. were all looking ok and no machine work or other items were replaced.
However the engine was running fine before the IMSB failed the failure was caught in time (as it appears to be the case with this 997) and collateral damage was minimal and the engine was a suitable candidate for an IMSB repair.
The Porsche tech had considerable experience in this area and was also working from guidelines provided by Porsche.
If you have confidence in the shop that did the rebuild and if there is any warranty on the rebuild that is transferrable to you that can possibly remove some of the risk. Personally I'm very leery of an engine that has been rebuilt and I would search for a car with no rebuild story. I would probably not bother with and IMSB upgrade but that is a decision every buyer of a used 997 that has the problematic IMSB has to make for himself.
I'm no aftermarket IMSB replacement expert and I can't really add anything of value to the question about small vs. large or whatever regarding the IMSB in 997 engines.
There might be some info at the LN web site.
Its interesting to me that LN didnt make an upgrade IMS kit for the 2007 and up, as some of the posters have said, because when I compare this car to the other 997s that Im looking at, I always tell my self that this one has the advantage of the IMS upgrade.
#14
10-12-2017, 10:23 AM
Thanks for all the replies guys. I'm probably gonna pass on this one. I will keep looking. I wanted something with lower mileage anyways. Since I will actually daily drive the 997 once I get it.
#15
10-12-2017, 10:46 PM
You made the right decision....half the fun is finding a car that ticks as many boxes on your list as possible. I think this one ticked a box not on your list which is the risk of things that don’t make sense.