I did, it was a very interesting read. The steps in order, I agree with totally. However, the nano coatings have been out for some time already, they aren't that new. I had my old M3 coupe done using a ceramic nano coat back in 2011, and 5+ years later, no issues with paint what so ever.

Granted, that was a less expensive car, and maybe I benefit from my climate in Northern California being very mild (50 - 80 all year round where I am), but I've seen no ill effects from the paint/body panels reacting to temperature and the coating.

The place i have lined up to do my car specializes in this type of thing and works on primarily Ferrari, Porsches, Lambo, etc.

I should probably also point out that I'm looking at this car as a 3 year ownership proposition, so if your concerns are in thinking about what could happen 10-15 years down the line, I agree there isn't enough info to say for sure. But for 3-5 years, the evidence is out there.

 

Every time I went out, I'd wonder why my car never looked as shiny and brilliant as others. When someone introduced mento these forums I often heard people taking about paint correction, but never really understood how different it was from a normal high end detail.

After much research, I found a guy to perform a proper paint correction on my car. Minimum 40 hours of hard labor.

The results were unimaginable! My car finally looked like an exotic should look!

After the correction, the next logical step was a full body custom XPel wrap. (No cutting on the car, and custom edge to edge to prevent the unsightly lines.

Last step, simply to preserve that unmistakeable shine was to do a Modesta coating on the car and wheels.

After one year, I was rinsing the car off in the middle of a long drive up highway 1. Everyone I was with laughed at how little effort I put into the wash... Then, one by one they approached me to ask how my car could shine so bright and look so flawless with such little effort....

Two of the 5 cars have been dropped off at the shop to get a full paint correction, wrap, and ceramic coating.

Trust me! It is worth every penny!!

Next step, replace the windshield, and get a protective film in it because I'm tired of the chips and cracks from all the ticks these guys kick up!

 

You are correct the coatings have been out for a bit of time. I personally have not seen any ill effects on my AMG after two years.


This is the issue----Scientifically there can or could be issues we don't see. This is the unknown for me, with other professionals agreeing. However the coating industry brings a wealth of financial gain to companies, especially selling the gloss/longevity specifics. (I am on board except for the paint) The AMMONYC products produce the same level of gloss and protectant, however will never cause a possible issue. But, yes there is slightly more effort due to amount of applications over a 2-3 year time period. I also cannot keep my hands off the cars, so like the part where I have to work with the paint a bit every now and then.


But I can sell you all day long on a product that lasts 1-3 years, makes your car scream with gloss levels and you don't have to touch it and it will look that way still more than a year later. Its only $300-500 cost. Rather than you applying wax every 4-6 months, possible less gloss levels and spending the time and money to have those products. OH by the way, the get the best results, we need to do a 2 step correction that's $1k-1.5k. However that will be locked in. NOW I just sold 2k worth of work plus a PPF job. All I am explaining is how as a professional I see the industry and how I personally am reacting to it. Spreading this knowledge so others can decide themselves. There are reasons whey the top detailers in the country don't push the coatings (ie... ceramic/glass). Mike Phillips w/ Autogeek, Larry kosilla w/ AMMONYC, Mike Brown, Buffdaddy Kevin Brown etc...... They all tend to stay within the non semi-permanent sector. I have only spoken with 2 of them, so still learning the WHY factor.


" I also have specialized on F cars, P cars, B cars, two AMs, and M cars along with normal Mercs and BMW's" Having someone who does specialize in these cars usually tends to indicate the job will be done right.


I typically think down the road for what is being done, to include how much clear coat is being taken off to accomplish the goal. The more that is taken now, will prevent a paint correction being done at some point down the road. AM can or could be a possible legacy car/collector car, even a plain Vantage as long as its is the perfect condition. So I want to still allow for work down the road.




You are taking the right path to take care of the car regardless if the process varies from my suggestions. That I comment you of. I want to actually write a Thread going over each and every aspect of High End detailing and the processes for it. So members can learn about each product so they can make their decisions. If you would like to start that thread, we can cover a topic a week or so. I can only write so much, I am in Afghanistan now.

 

AmmoNYC does sound interesting (just reading their page). You bring up a good point as far as future longevity, even for the next owner. My particular car is the Centenary edition Vantage V8S, so that paint job in particular is pretty special. Even if I move on to a new Vantage a few years from now, someone will probably appreciate the special edition paint job to be pristine.

And I don't mind 'recharging' a finish every once in a while. I enjoy being hands on with the car as well. What I'm really after is a product that makes it easy to clean the car on a regular basis and will help protect the clear coat and paint without a monthly 2 1/2 hour session of apply and buff.

 

My suggestion-------
First buy one of the Master Blaster products. Sidekick is just fine for about $90 from several online detailing companies. I use the 8hp MB Revolution with a 30ft hose. I do not like the Vac'n'blo machines. Not that its a huge issue, but I don't want the possibility of dust being drawn into the machine from the vac part then blown on the car. Not seen complaints, but didnt want to take the chance. BLOW dry the car. IF not, then use the AMMO Hydrate product you spray on the MF towel to help lubricate the surface when removing water to lessen the possibility of swirls or marks. Its the only one on the market for this.

IF you use the AMMO Reflex, at least followed by the Skin, it will just blow off nice and easy and you only need to re-apply once per 4-6 months. IF you want you can top with Creme for that special deep gloss hue but it only lasts about 4 weeks or so pending usage of the car. ANY Carnauba wax only lasts that long.

You will get the same gloss levels as a coating using this combination and the same level of protection. Cost is about the same if you apply yourself too. The Reflex I would put 2 coats maybe 3 just to make sure its the highest gloss. Coatings I use 2 coats if I do them and a Modesta Primer before that is a $250 cost per bottle. Still think AMMO is equal to them, so I am happy with preserving the finish if anything ever went wrong. I would still use a coating on your wheels and trim pieces. Although the reflex can go there too, I prefer the coatings on those parts. No worries of future issues, rims are replaceable at some point.

Bad part is the paint will still scratch, and swirl, even with a coating. So a perfectionist will need to remove the coating to correct it, and that takes more clear off than you would without it. Some of the ceramic coatings really really are difficult to remove.

 

Wow, I read my earlier today post and the english was horrible. Tired I guess from 15hr days. Paint Correction is NOT my day job by any means. When I learn something I must know everything possible to know about it. Even waxes I studied to make sure I am using the best possible one for my personal cars. Then providing to acquaintances. I learned the Paint Correction process, then refined it, and along the way made contacts within the industry trying to perfect my work. Yes I have done some profit makers, however most have just been people I know and after they see my car, then they want theirs done also. Luckily I have owned some nice cars which brings their own attention, but the paint increases that attention. Amazing when you can take a 2006 Maserati that looks normal and make it better than when new 9 years later. So this type of work is a passion of mine, therapy also when home. If I could do this work daily on only high end cars I would likely change jobs.

I will be trying some of the higher end waxes when I get back home. I would like to see if there is differences with SwissVax Concorso, Pinnacle Souveran. There are nano glass particle Fusion types also, but I just want to stick with toppers.

I apply them by hand, literally by my hands. I rub some into the palm of my one hand then work that into both hands, then apply to the vehicle. This (as long as your hands are smooth) provides the best possible interaction between the paint and wax, and prevents marring of the surface which any foam applicator can do. I only do this on my car it is a pain so to speak to remove the wax from my hands later. I actually dislike the feeling.

 

The installer I have been talking with said with the Expel software they can add extra to each pre-cut part. For example, on the hood they would add 1.5" of material to each side so they can wrap it around. Hopefully this will be the best of both worlds as it will prevent them from having to cut the PPF with a blade in most areas.

I actually bought one the same day I bought the car. Originally I bought because I really hate water marks but the other huge benefit is no additional swirls added to the paint.

Thanks everyone for all the detailed write-ups. I am going to talk to a few local shops, check out there operations, and go from there.

Sounds like the most important part is to find a shop that is willing to put the elbow grease into the work and not cut any corners.

 

Yes the Xpel cutting extra is perfect, and they are likely doing that to keep the blade work to a minimum. I have NEVER applied the product myself, however watched several times and from experts realized the issues that can happen.


Paint Correction--- Do you want to learn yourself? Do you have the time?
You can easily buy everything you need for less than the cost of a company. However, time is always the concern. You can also not mess up if your careful either. Just take you a bit to learn. AMMONYC, Autogeek both have excellent videos to learn from. They teach you pretty much all you need to provide excellent results. I can provide the knowledge of what to buy to create that perfection. That way you don't waste money in learning.


One thing I learned is that there is a point where I have to tell the owner of the car that I cannot get a mark out, or can't go further than whats been done. I walk the car and give advice to what and what CANNOT be done. Most people over promise. ALOT of detailers don't know when to stop trying either. Those are the worst kind too.

Also, ask what products they use, what they will be using, and what machinery also. Ask if you can watch work being done on another customers car if possible. You are making a several thousand dollar decision for the before PPF process. A 2-step is likely going to run 800-1500 pending detailer and hrs worked. I would be maybe around 1k or so with about 20hrs in it. But I do this for fun. Most of the ones I have done are 3-step processes, coatings on wheels (wheels off the car), and then a protectant on top, spending 30-40 hrs. I did 60hrs on a Ferrari and 55hrs on a Black Maserati (mine). So all depends on processes and time spent for perfection. There is so much more to it than just the paint.

 

Hi JohnWilliamsJW,

You're right in that there are many films that last only 3-5 years. I just wanted to point out that 3M's NEW Pro Series PPF is warrantied for 10 years. If you would like to learn more, please visit www.ppffilm.com.


Regards,
Manny

 

John,

There is much more to coatings. They do NOT last 4-5 yrs easily. They require just as much care and attention as does the historic way of a sealant and carnauba. Some may last that long, but the jury is out for how long they truly do. They haven't been in the market long enough. Within the past year or so they have finally come out and said the coatings should be washed with specific coating type shampoo (for best results) and coatings need to be rejuvenated such as CarPro Reload. But, in coatings you get what you pay for also. I refuse to use a coating on a Aston Martin or any other exotic. I can get the same gloss out of other non semi permanent products that don't have issues such as water spots.


But, using a coating or PPF you need to do a paint correction for best results, or the process is a waste of time. PPF made these days does last 5yrs easily, unless heavy track use or other harsh environment.

Just my professional two cents on the subject.

 

Manny, you will need to email me. I am traveling and do not have phone access. thanks
Sheriffdep

 

SheriffDep, I'm in meetings the rest of the week so email works or if you prefer, just call me when you can next week or the week after. I know it's hard for you to connect with your location so feel free to take your time.

My email is mhondroulis@epdwindowfilm.com.


Regards,
Manny

 

Check Email sir