Hi all:

I have a 2009 Flying Spur (standard ed, not speed ed) with 70,000 miles and am having intermittent transmission problems. When cold, it doesn't seem to want to go from 2nd-3rd-ish, and often I find myself FLOORING it, with no REVS or shifts. No warning lights or codes. It only does it when it's cold and it's been happening for maybe 2 months, every couple of days.

I'm "hoping" it's something simple like low or dirty fluid. You guys know where the dipstick is for the tranny fluid? Do you think a drain and fill might help? Or a flush? Or is my transmission on it's last leg? Any known issues?

Thanks in advance!

 

Hi cduluk1.

There is no dipstick as you would have found on cars of yesteryear. The filling process is a little complicated, up on ramps, correct trans temperature, etc.
I had my trans fluid changed last year at around 70k and it works fine.
There is a known problem re shifts, my Indie actually asked me if mine was OK, fortunately it was.

I'm not sure if a fluid change would cure the problem, or even a flash of the gearbox parameters with the latest updates.

Having said that, maybe as it's a cold temp problem, it may be a sticky solenoid in the Mechatronics unit inside the trans.

Hope you get it sorted.

Les.

 

Hello Chris,
I hope this reaches you before you dive into her, the vehicle should be on a lift with all four wheels off the ground, the transmission should be at operating temperature, and the vehicle should be taken through reverse and then into drive while in the air, you can NOT use ramps, unless you use ramps on all 4 corners, BUT then you would not be able to run through the gears, also a lift would be safer and level, BUT what ever you do, DO NOT OPEN the transmission filler/level plug with out the engine RUNNING, if you open it WITHOUT the engine RUNNING you will be covered in transmission fluid, and risk injury by HOT trannie fluid !!!
PLEASE be safe !

Also if you check Ross-Tech site or AW for the Audi A8L for transmission service you will find what you need for information on the 6hp26a trans the the Bentley and A8L W12 use, there are 6hp19, 6hp26, 6hp28, and 6hp32, but all have the same procedure for checking level, and the relearning (adaptation) process.

I will be on the dozer all day, but if you need you can call me tonight.

 

....Johnny...why the Hell you tearing up your back yard....now they'll know where Jimmy is...

 

Chris,
Be sure that your suspension IS in LIFT MODE before being placed on the lift and lifted.

OT,
Hi Jim,
No I did not find Jimmy, I think he's somewhere in the Meadowlands..... or possibly alive and well hanging out the Tangiers Casino....
I am cutting and filling the road at my 132 unit development.
.

 

Thanks for the responses guys.

This transmission is getting worse each day. It's especially worse in the morning. When I turn the car on and put it into reverse, applying the gas just results in it revving as it were in neutral.

Driving in D vs S makes a slight difference. The car is violent between some gears in S and is "better" in D.

Based on your responses, I won't touch anything with the fluid. I suppose I have to take this to a dealer or mechanic.

Is there any "reset" I can do myself? Running it through a cycle or unplugging the battery for a period of time?

This thing is BAD.

 

Bear in mind that the box isn't strictly a Bentley item, it's a ZF, so any competent auto gearbox repair shop should be able to diagnose the problem. BMW's for instance have a similar box.
Here's a bit of info for you; http://www.bmwlogicseven.com/?p=3738

The only issue would be if Vagcom was needed for programming.

Les.

 

So I have a quick update. I "think" this is good news, but need your analysis.

Last night i performed the only potential "reset" I knew I could do myself. I unplugged the (-) battery terminals of both batteries in the trunk, and let it sit for a few hours. After re-installing the batteries, I gave it a test drive.

What an improvement!!

I would say it's 90% back to normal. It still "doesn't like" going into REVERSE after being in PARK (there's a delay), and for the first 5 minutes of driving it was a little "jolty" in 2nd/3rd, but other than that, it felt pretty normal. This is a significant contrast to how it was behaving hours earlier. This morning, the results seem to have held. Much better, but still not 100% there.

Could this be a good sign?

My fear is that there's mechanical failure of gears/components inside the transmission. Does the fact (that it's behaving much better after unplugging the battery) a good indicator that this is more of a computer issue than a mechanical one? What are your thoughts?

ExSF, is there anything "unique" to the Bentley transmission? How much "the same" is this transmission be used on other cars? Are they compatible swaps?

 

Good morning Chris,
You should take it to have the transmission fluid level checked, what you are describing is exactly what happened with my Audi A8L W12 a while back, the transmission on the Audi developed a very small leak on the transmission cooler o-rings, it would not go into reverse immediately, and gave bad shifting in other gears until the oil heated up and expanded, turned out to be less than a liter low, that was every bit of 3 years ago, all has been fine since, and she has 190k on her, you should use the VAG (Ross-Tech) to check that the transmission fluid is at proper operating temperature, or you could wing it and say warm it up going for a 40 minute drive and pull it right onto the lift and check it while the engine is running.
as always, you can call me if you need too.

 

Hi.

The boxes in other cars can't be swapped as far as I'm aware as the Conti' is 4 wheel drive. The Mechatronics also have different parameters from what I have learned.

I would agree with Johnny re; low fluid, that would cause a similar symptom for any auto box.

Start with the easy stuff and go from there.

Les.

 

We have the 6HP26A, the "A" meaning all wheel drive, as is the Audi A8/S8 and others, here is what it is used in, BUT as exsf stated I am sure there are different programmings for the different models, ALSO by disconnecting the batteries you somewhat put the transmission into the relearning process, it learns your driving style or habits of shifting, like how hard you drive or easy, there is a "transmission adaptation" process that can be activated (reset) with the Ross Tech cable.

Also the 6HP26A and 6HP19A did have some problems that can be seen on AW, where as the transmission would develop a "HOOT" in 2-3 or 3-4 gears, most in downshift, but some in upshift, that called for a 3 time flush of transmission fluid and a software update, I was ready to bring the A8L W12 into the dealership 3 years ago, but was met with opposition from the service writer whom stated that the transmission never needs service and it would cost about $1400 , so I picked up 12 liters of (BLUE) ZF Lifeguard 6PLUS along with the filter and pan gasket, I purchased all of this because while I was at a trans shop a few days earlier whom I just had rebuild my son's 4.2 A6 transmission, I asked the owner to put it on the lift to check it out, they swore it was the front seal and not the pan or cooler, but I just could not see that being the case as the fluid buildup was further forward then what he was saying, so I put it on my friends lift and sprayed the whole area clean with Brake Kleen, and watched for the drip, it was the cooler O-rings.... So I replaced them and I did as I stated earlier, it only needed about 1 liter, BUT be sure to search which oil Bentley uses, the Audi A8L V8 with the 6hp19a used ZF Lifeguard 6 gold oil, the W12 setup with the 6hp26a used ZF Lifeguard 6PLUS blue oil, when the 4.2 V8's developed this trans problem they would switch from gold 6 to blue 6+ and have the dealership preform the update, now there is green oil, ZF Lifeguard 8......6HP26AEdit

The 6HP26A is a variation of the 6HP26 for four-wheel drive applications. It was used by the Volkswagen Group for some permanent four-wheel drive models.ApplicationsEdit

• 2002–present Volkswagen Phaeton (Typ 3D)
• 2003–2009 Audi A8 (D3, Typ 4E)
• 2006–2009 Audi S8 (D3, Typ 4E)
• 2003–present Bentley Continental GT
• 2005–present Bentley Continental Flying Spur
• 2006–2011 Audi S6 (C6, Typ 4F)
• 2008–2010 Audi RS6 (C6, Typ 4F)

 

Thanks for the info guys. I took your advice and had it looked at. I took it to Bentley and they found something. My service advisor called and said there was a leak at the filter on the transmission. I couldn't spend much time on the phone, but he did say that the filter needed replacement (not sure why it needs replacement) and that with parts and labor it would come to $2,200 to fix. I asked how much fluid was lost, and he said he wasn't sure. He did say, however, that there was a "fault" for the leak (not sure what this means, though) and that i have a 50/50 chance of this resolving the issue. He seemed to suggest that there may be mechanical damage as well and may need to replace the transmission at $21,000 (which is NEVER going to happen!!!!).

Could replacement of the filter and fresh fluid resolve this issue? Or do you guys think i should prepare myself for the pessimistic side of the 50/50?

 

Hello Chris,
The "filter" is inside the transmission, so it is not leaking, what the service adviser most likely meant is that the transmission pan is leaking, now you could look at this a few ways, you could just have the pan bolts snugged up and top off the tranny fluid at the proper fluid temperature of 30-35 Celsius, 40 Celsius max, but never allow the fluid temperature to reach 50 Celsius, see attached link for proper checking and filling instructions, and wait to see if the seepage stops, who knows how long it took to get to the low level it is at now, ALSO by going this route you would be just topping off the trans to the proper level and the see how she behaves, meaning if all is now shifting fine after top off you can then see if the leakage stopped and leave it alone, OR because you are at 70K you may want to drop the pan and install the new filter and pan gasket, you will lose tranny fluid dropping the pan, so that is where some expense will come in, BUT not $2200.00, that is if you are comfortable doing it yourself..

In the pictures below you will see the parts I purchased at Audi, this is the same gasket for the Bentley 6HP26A, I just went outside and matched it up, it would be interesting to see how much B charges for the same gasket.....


NOTE: The ZF instructions although they do not mention Bentley, it is the procedure for checking the fluid level on the 6HP26A transmission, so I added it just as a guide.



http://www.vaglinks.com/Docs/Catalog...28_Catalog.pdf


http://www.flyingspares.com/shop/ben...nv862564a.html




https://www.automaticchoice.com/uplo...zf_filters.pdf


https://www.car-parts24.com/Oil-chan...sion-6HP26-A61


http://www.americanpowertrainwarehou...n-aftermarket/

 

Hmm. I called Bentley again to inquire further about what's wrong with it. My advisor talked to the tech again and said that he hasn't dropped the pan yet--but somehow knows that there's something wrong with the filter within. That somehow there's a leak "at" the filter. He said he won't know further until he replaces the filter. Not sure how he knows it needs replacement, but that's what he said. He said he's not sure if that will fix the issue until he gets the part which won't be here for a few more days. Cost of this with labor is ~$2200usd.

do you know how they could say this is a "leak" if no fluid ever left the car? I'm assuming fluid is entering the filter, but somehow "internally" leaking so that fluid isn't recirculating. My advisor doesn't think fluid was leaking from the car. Where is the fluid going?

 

Well I got the car back. It's 99% back to normal, but I'm still getting one or two "jolty" shifts in a 20min drive.

Attached is the Bentley paperwork. I can't make heads or tails of it. Can you guys figure out what they did??

The narrative states that, "the transmission filter suction seal was torn allowing internal fluid leak."

The part itself was only $183. The ATF FLUID, all 9 units (qts or liters) totaled $834, $92 EACH. And 6 hours labor came to $1021. Ridiculous if you ask me.