PCCB's durability
 

hi track junkies and GT purist i need your help and experience!
i own a 2007 997 tt with PCCB with 15 000 miles mostly highways but also 5 DE events (so around 15 trackdays) and have already ask this question on the tt forum of 6speed but not a lot of people answered so i figured you guys know tt owners who track with you or by your own personal experience on the durability of those PCCBs
i do love them as far as overall feeling on track and resistance to fading but i started to notice wear indicators showing on the surface of my rear disc since my last track event and people on my regional club told me it means it's already time to replace them:confused::confused::confused: I was sure those second gen ceramics were so much more durable than that !! if that's true they are less durable than the pads!! the replacement cost is so prohibitive that i don't se myself changing them every summer!
2 guys on 997 gt3s on my club had supposedly been replacing them after 2000 track miles is it representative of your personal experience?
they do still feel perfect though do you think they can last for a while before actually be dead??
thanks for your insight

I have never heard of PCCBs going south after 5 DEs unless it was a complete total
failure. I had about the same amount of DEs on my 996 GT3 and only had cracks due to aging. I had the Gen II PCCBs on my 997 GT3 with not any visable wear issues.
Have them inspected by some one in your area (lots of Canadians on Rennlist)
before you do anything else.

PCCBs should not be used on the track. End of story.

If you're worried about them not lasting, well, there's your answer. Convert over to steel if you're going to track. There are many steel options. I switched mine over to performance friction two piece rotors with 997 GT3 Cup rotors in the rear.

PCCBs are the biggest marketing scam ever. Sorry.

What a waste of cyber space thanks for not adding anything.
Again if you use the proper pads you will not any problem Make sure
you have a good fluid too. the problems on Gen Is were the fluid got too
hot and the ABS couldnt handle the differnt viscosity and would eat the rotors
over braking a bazillion times. If you use Porsche motorsport green pad
your fine.
On Gen IIs its not even a problem. I know guys including myslelf that tracked the PCCBS with no issues unlike 40 milligrams up there
if it is a makerting scam then Ferrari Lamborghini, Porsche and Mercedes benz are all guilty.

Whilst improvements have been made to the PCCB rotors over the various iterations, these discs will not last with prolonged track exposure. I have a 2004 Carrera GT and the PCCB's are showing the early stages of 'carbon burn' or friction surface de-lamination at 17k miles and around 25 track days.

All the PCCB rotors, and in addition the rotors for Ferrari, Bentley, Audi, Aston Martin are manufactured by SGL Carbon in Germany. The rotors in all these cases feature a laminated friction surface that is bonded to the body of the rotor. This friction surface is only around 1.00mm thick, and with prolonged track use it starts to de-laminated from the body of the disc. I've sent detailed images of my rotors to SGL Carbon and they've stated that the wear I have is not unusual for the mileage on track I've done - they even commented the rotors were not designed for the track!

The reason the friction surface is laminated to the rotor body is two fold, cost and manufacturing turn around time. I am having a set of Carbon Ceramic discs produced by System ST in the UK. These rotors are fully carbon ceramic, i.e the whole disc is friction material so the PCCB/SGL Carbon issues of wearing the thin friction surface will not occur. Also the length and orientation of the fibres in the System ST rotor is different which also increases the heat dissipation.

The reality is that whatever peoples expectations of the PCCB/SGL Carbon rotor may be, at some time dependent on use the very thin friction layer will be compromised.

http://www.systemst.com/

So, you think any steel disc would last longer???

I've not suggested that, or even made any reference to steel discs.

Even if they don't the steel rotors are a fraction of the cost.

steel
 

why do folks in lots of places (not just here) talk about steel rotors? to the best of my knowledge, steel is a terrible rotor material and most rotors are made of cast iron.

Of course they are cast iron, but steel is like a slang term for non PCCB, or should I say Porsche Composite Ceramic Brakes

Are Gen II rotors also laminated?
What's the difference between Gen I and Gen II?


How much are System ST rotors?

I just replaced the PCCBs in my RS with steel rotors (using AP racing rotors). After about 20 track days I was spending way too much in new pads (plus you know how much new carbon rotors cost!).

I must say I do have to work on my braking technique though, as I have a tendency to over-brake so I'm pretty sure that better and more experienced drivers can make them last longer.

I have been a huge supporter of PCCBs but I must say that if you are planning to track the car more regularly, you should think about replacing them with cheaper steel.

Hey old fart, PCCBs are not meant for track use. How many times do you have be told that before it sticks in that thick head of yours? Just because you're driving mrs. daisy on the track and your rotors aren't toast doesn't mean PCCBs are bullet proof. Ask ANYONE who's serious about tracking their car. NONE of them will recommend them. If one of them does, smack 'em because they don't know about them.

Hmmmm, i wonder why no one gets their PCCBs covered under warranty?
Hmmmm, i wonder why GT3 cup cars don't come with PCCBs?
Hmmmmm

https://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/e...smiley-007.gif

and begin........