Wait...wait...wait...

I am building my engine right now and have a lame A28 and some mild mods - nothing that you don't have (a crank, some rods, pistons - the necessary stuff, you know).

Can I come, too, please? I need these 10 grand

Andreas

 

TO AMS ,,this repeat question,
AMS,,Not to get off of this hot topic,,LOL,,
BUT do you guys still work with Tony/EPL on tuning 996Turbos OR do you do it yourselves now?
Thanks..

 

Hi John,

Yes we still work with Tony. We can physically tune the Porsche ourselves but we don't have the hardware/software package that Tony offers to easily flash these cars. We use EPL software/hardware and we've been involved in the logging/tuning process for all the tunes made for our packages. Tony knows what he's doing tuning wise and is also a smart software guy.

Hopefully that answers your question.

Best regards,

Martin

 

The A28 is not lame, at all. I'm assuming you're referring to our 997tt? The car's motor was never opened up when it ran 9.97 at 144mph, made all those dyo pulls, or ran many standing mile pulls. Same goes for the customers 997tt we built that has been running around for the last 9,500 miles at over 700whp on pump gas. He is on a stock engine also.

You don't have to build the motor when doing an A28 build but you will be safer and can push it harder if you do.

Sure you are welcome to come out to our shop anytime.

Do you have a 996 or 997? The 997 engine has a higher volumetric efficiency at higher RPM's than the 996, meaning it makes more horsepower up top. The 997 engine with the same turbo's will make more horsepower than the 996.

-Martin

 

Martin,

I was just joking aorund - I know that the A28 is not lame. Thought I can make some easy 10 grand quickly

I am located in Germany, so a trip to your shop needs some preparation

Andreas

 

HI,,Thanks...Just asking because at on time ,I believe someone told me from your shop in the recent past, that you guys are doing all your own tuning in house now..I know he developed the 16 billet package with you guys..

 

What kind of boost and gas was he running in the car to get the 5.87? I have asked that numerous times but no one has been able or willing to answer that question. Is that some sort of a secret as it seems that is pretty relevant in the big scheme of things? 91, 93, 100, 109 octane, what? 1.2, 1.3, 1.5, 1.7 bar?? Not trying to stir the pot, just curious because without knowing that, the 5.87 number doesn't tell a lot.

I also just looked at the AMS ad for the billets and for anyone that can read English, it should be pretty clear cut that they advertise about 550whp on pump. Seems pretty realistic to me so I don't know what the hoopla is about. Maybe 800 crank (what is that 680whp?) would be attainable on a one time hero shot but common sense would dictate that would not be on a streetable repeatable set up. Don't all tuners advertise the big hero number (pretty much always a crank HP for obvious reasons) at the top to get your attention (basic marketing 101) and then you see the real numbers (generally WHP) in the smaller print? As long as one can read and comprehend the English language, one can generally weed through the bs. I certainly have no dog in the hunt nor am I taking any sides. It's just an observation after reading a thread that has turned out to be pretty embarrassing for some of the participants. Some of what has been said or stated make me cringe..

 

I believe he openly discussed the boost and gas used. I think 101 and or ms109. Boost for sure wasn't more then 1.5 because he wasn't making anymore power on dyno just blowing hot air. Look up his thread it's all there I believe. And he did it on cheap street tires If my memory serves me right.
Mind you i spent a week on it going over some drama from previous installs. Missing check valves, major boost leaks, etc. We spent slot of time getting it 100%. I harp on that often because members buy kits and think they will automatically go fast.
There was no magic here. None.

 

Ok, thank you for the reply. I didn't read his thread (didn't know there was one) but directly asked the question earlier in this thread and received no reply so I thought maybe he didn't want to share that info for some reason. It seems that when people start quoting numbers they should always include boost and gas type used as that is key in the whole equation. I'd be curious what his set up would have run on pump at a normal 1.2 or 1.3 bar of boost as that is what 99% of people run and thus would probably be most relevant. Once again, this goes back to tuners and people posting one time super numbers on high boost race gas set ups. When the 5.87 was run, was it done on a road that was verified perfectly flat? As you know even a 1 or 2% gradient will wildly skew the numbers one way or the other. Was headwind/tailwind taken into account? Ideally you'd want to run the car in one direction and then immediately run it in the opposite direction and average the two figures to arrive at a factual number.

Also, doesn't the ECU do a throttle body shutdown at 1.4 bar? I always thought that was a built in feature by Porsche. Are people bypassing this safety device in order to run glory boost?

 

as a psychotherapist i've always said Porsche owners are a personality type, not just car owners.. this tread shows that is not about the data, its about being right. i question the longevity of any high HP engine and everyone is entitled to their own opinion. thank buddha that i've had a lifetime love affair with Porsche from the age of eight, otherwise my ego maybe driving the car... peace and love to you all!!

 

Yes of course It was verified. He ran 6.3 and 6.4 I believe at 1.3 bar. Again you can ask him. But I do have some files he sent somewhere.
1.5 bar is not considered glory boost. Most guys run .35 bar on pump gas which I disagree with. I run 1.25 bar max. On race gas ( depending which grade ) I tune for 1.4 to 1.55 max. That's my limit. I've seen others run 1.7 bar on stock motors. There are plenty of those members that had done it. The has a ebc too. Most guys that want to control boost do that - nothing new.
Randy did many 60 to 130s. His numbers match and wasn't one lucky run.
Ecu doesn't shut the TB down if you know how to let the limit off. That's easy.

 

No, you misunderstood me. I wasn't running 900 ft lbs torque with K16s!
I was referring to my current build. Is it even possible to make 900 tq on
K16s? I don't know but I wouldn't think so.

I was making 600 wheel torque and 550 wheel hp on ms109 @ 1.5 bar on
K16s.

I'm making 1000 hp crank and about a 1000 crank tq on 3073s on e85
and 28 lbs boost.

 

I am making..... more popcorn..

 

How is this virus of a thread still going days later? Martin, honestly you have nothing less to prove to anyone. People are trolling trying to get a reaction, clearly there's no one here who has had a bad experience with AMS work.

All of this discussion is about the ad so let's actually look at the two components:

"Bolt-on turbo's capable of 800 hp while retaining stock spool up! Quicker spool and power on par or exceeding the K24/18G"

Note it says capable of, not "producing 800 hp". This is similar to Nissan saying the car GT-R is capable of 0-60 in 2.7s. If you go out on any given day, the time will vary depending on temperature, traction surface, quality of the tires, life in the cars fluids etc etc.

Are we expecting Nissan to produce an add saying "0-60 in 2.7 seconds if you're lucky but probably more consistently in the low threes!". Nope cause damn it all I want to tell people my car can do it in the mid to high twos, that's part of what I'm paying for.

The second part is the clarification portion:

"Estimated horsepower output
550-580 hp / 570-600 lb/ft of torque on pump gas
600-630 hp / 660-690 lb/ft of torque with optional AMS Fuel Upgrade Kit
660-690 hp / 750-780 lb/ft of torque on race gas.
800 hp Capable with supporting modifications (AMS intake pipes, AMS intercooler upgrade, etc...)"

Clearly the power output is Estimated. It also leads with 550-580 on pump gas, then if you purchase more you can get up into the 600-630 range. Now if you're ready to throw in some race gas you can get it up to 660-690 hp, not bad. Now assuming you would like to cause your accountant more stress you can then build up further to a car capable of 800 hp. Capable of again is not stating a guarantee every day.

I love 6SpeedOnline, I stop by a dozen times a day to read things see what people are doing etc. I've been impressed with the community. I only recently became a Porsche owner, previously I owned an Evo X then an e46 M3. Those forums were filled with people name calling, trolling, bad mouthing respected vendors and making up BS stories about making tens of thousands of dollars a day and being to cool for school etc etc. It's disturbing that such a great community is degrading like this for no reason than they intentionally or unintentionally misinterpreted an ad.

Martin / Markski,

I get that you guys have had issues in the past. And for whatever reason it keeps coming up in different threads (I've seen it a few times now). Remember Pepsi compares themselves to Coke because Coke is the big boy. Coke doesn't compare itself to Pepsi.

As a potential buyer with some assemblance of financial wherewithal and a love burning the liquid dinos this is turning me off both companies. Can we not just let this issue die and focus on business? The points have all been made.

 

Mike, I was very clear, early on in this thread regarding AMS's reputation in the
Japanese tuning arena. My use of the term "Jap tuner" wasn't meant to be racist.
I was under the assumption that the term was innocuous when used in the context
of tuning. I am not a racist.

I did not discount ANY of their previous achievements. Love 'em or hate 'em, these
fellows have built some of the fastest street cars in the world. I'm saying that
I suspect that they're using their previous achievements to make exaggerated
horsepower claims in the Porsche world. I am also saying that they don't know
Porsche cars.

I have said it in this thread and I will say it again, I DON'T MIND BEING SOLD!!!
I don't mind folks stretching the facts.........that's part of sales sometimes. I
don't think that this board is comprised of predators and victims. I do however
believe that a lot of bs goes unchecked here. The back and forth about flying
me up to shy town and all of that...........I was giving him a hard time. It was
already a ridiculous situation and I was being ridiculous.

But 800 hp on a k16? 900 hp on a alpha 28? I'm sorry Mike, do YOU believe that?