997 TT beats GT-R at Ring. Nissan accused of cheating.
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Nissan lies, but a full 10% is just ignorance on your part.
You would be the only idiot to think that Nissan would claim a drivetrain loss 10% off what it actually does.
Originally Posted by Heavychevy
20% loss???? Other than completely ignoring Nissans claim of only ~10% loss, 20% loss is rediculous for todays sports cars.
Explain then why the GT-R cant trap much if any higher than a GT3 and M6 which have similar power to weight ratios as a GT-R at 480-500 hp.
This mythical hp hasnt shown up anywhere. So there is NO support for the GT-R losing 20% through the drivetrain whatsoever given that the DSG tranny, from the VW to the Veyron etc, have all proved to lose less through the drivetrain than a normal manual.
Like I said, Motortrend are morons. THE GT-R DOES NOT LOSE 20% THROUGH THE DRIVETRAIN.
20% loss???? Other than completely ignoring Nissans claim of only ~10% loss, 20% loss is rediculous for todays sports cars.
Explain then why the GT-R cant trap much if any higher than a GT3 and M6 which have similar power to weight ratios as a GT-R at 480-500 hp.
This mythical hp hasnt shown up anywhere. So there is NO support for the GT-R losing 20% through the drivetrain whatsoever given that the DSG tranny, from the VW to the Veyron etc, have all proved to lose less through the drivetrain than a normal manual.
Like I said, Motortrend are morons. THE GT-R DOES NOT LOSE 20% THROUGH THE DRIVETRAIN.
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JaeS4, please tell me your comprehension is better than that.
The hooked on phonics version of what I said is that for you to think a manufacturer would claim a drivetrain loss thats 10% OFF (meaning higher, or amiss) of what it actually is would be ignorant.
A WHOLE 10% different than what they said. That's what I meant when I said a full 10% DIFFERENCE from what they said.
And that is only combined with everything else that doesnt support it.
The hooked on phonics version of what I said is that for you to think a manufacturer would claim a drivetrain loss thats 10% OFF (meaning higher, or amiss) of what it actually is would be ignorant.
A WHOLE 10% different than what they said. That's what I meant when I said a full 10% DIFFERENCE from what they said.
And that is only combined with everything else that doesnt support it.
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120+ pages of bickering with kids who's experience with racing and cars comes from video games and car magazines and what they read on the internet. They live for a number, a stat, a faster time because that's all they have. They then run that and cram it in everyone's face, especially the real owner devotees that drive a car that Nissan tried to best in one way or another with a meaningless stat. Their new generic wonder has better numbers than a turbo pcar and it has a ps3 dashboard. Oh joyfull day let's run to every pcar board and tell them about this new slayer. They want to rub your nose in the numbers. They get kicked off and come back on as a new name from a different country. Remarkably they are taken to some extent seriously. Are any of these remarks and quotes and lets not forget the name calling, coming from anyone with real world experience or understanding of true quality and refinement?
Yes Nissan claimed a number for the ring and they knew it would draw this type of crowd. Anyone can lie about a number on the ring there is no real official sanctioned ring times except when they are part of a real race. So the number means nothing.
Most of the people who argue for the Nissan do not have one and probably never will. But dammit it has a number that beats your proven car that has taken more records than any other. Best of all it's cheap, well initially anyway.
Let them believe in their new found wonder and as soon as a "new shiny"
comes along they will drop the Nissan banner and fly the new one.
Because they have, ""no buy in"" with anything in reality.
To me Nissan has bad Karma and a crap load of juvenile trolls to go with it. Nothing more than a bunch of nintendo racer wannabes.
Yes Nissan claimed a number for the ring and they knew it would draw this type of crowd. Anyone can lie about a number on the ring there is no real official sanctioned ring times except when they are part of a real race. So the number means nothing.
Most of the people who argue for the Nissan do not have one and probably never will. But dammit it has a number that beats your proven car that has taken more records than any other. Best of all it's cheap, well initially anyway.
Let them believe in their new found wonder and as soon as a "new shiny"
comes along they will drop the Nissan banner and fly the new one.
Because they have, ""no buy in"" with anything in reality.
To me Nissan has bad Karma and a crap load of juvenile trolls to go with it. Nothing more than a bunch of nintendo racer wannabes.
Tis a good point. As far as I know, not one of us Porsche guys have gone over to NAGTROC to say "the GTR's a good car, but hey, it can't hold a candle to a Porsche" and ramble on with endless statistics about how great the Porsche is. That is because we are confident in our car of choice, we have nothing to prove, and we know they ain't gonna like it, so what's the point.
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JaeS4, please tell me your comprehension is better than that.
The hooked on phonics version of what I said is that for you to think a manufacturer would claim a drivetrain loss thats 10% OFF (meaning higher, or amiss) of what it actually is would be ignorant.
A WHOLE 10% different than what they said. That's what I meant when I said a full 10% DIFFERENCE from what they said.
And that is only combined with everything else that doesnt support it.
The hooked on phonics version of what I said is that for you to think a manufacturer would claim a drivetrain loss thats 10% OFF (meaning higher, or amiss) of what it actually is would be ignorant.
A WHOLE 10% different than what they said. That's what I meant when I said a full 10% DIFFERENCE from what they said.
And that is only combined with everything else that doesnt support it.
I have to admit that's pretty funny. I got it now, my bad, i misunderstood you.
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UK deliveries don't start until April '09 - mine is due June/July.
I've driven two different GT-Rs and been in a couple of others.
To theromulus - I have read these boards for some time, being interested in Porsches (very close to buying a Mk I GT3 a couple of years ago, recently looking at 997 Turbos). I only chose to comment on this thread because of the rabid nonsense spouted by people (I'm sure I don't need to name any names) who had never even been near a GT-R. As has repeatedly been said, don't judge a car until you have driven it. You may be surprised.
The PS3 rubbish just degrades the value of the arguments of those who drive a Porsche for the wrong reasons. The endless churning out of made-up estimates and irrelevant calculations has nothing to do with liking cars. Fractions of seconds in quarter mile times, 0-60 times and 'Ring lap times are entirely irrelevant in the real world.
There will inevitably be something better along soon, but I think the GT-R has moved the game forward. That isn't insulting the revered and glorious Porsche marque, it's just an observation which is shared by many other people who have actually driven the car. The badge on the front is irrelevant.
I've driven two different GT-Rs and been in a couple of others.
To theromulus - I have read these boards for some time, being interested in Porsches (very close to buying a Mk I GT3 a couple of years ago, recently looking at 997 Turbos). I only chose to comment on this thread because of the rabid nonsense spouted by people (I'm sure I don't need to name any names) who had never even been near a GT-R. As has repeatedly been said, don't judge a car until you have driven it. You may be surprised.
The PS3 rubbish just degrades the value of the arguments of those who drive a Porsche for the wrong reasons. The endless churning out of made-up estimates and irrelevant calculations has nothing to do with liking cars. Fractions of seconds in quarter mile times, 0-60 times and 'Ring lap times are entirely irrelevant in the real world.
There will inevitably be something better along soon, but I think the GT-R has moved the game forward. That isn't insulting the revered and glorious Porsche marque, it's just an observation which is shared by many other people who have actually driven the car. The badge on the front is irrelevant.
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ok, lets seriously do an apples to apples comparison of two cars...The GTR and the BMW M5/6. The BMW has 500 hp and weighs about the same as the GTR, and aerodynamically cannot be much different. What is the BMW's time around the ring.....? The GTR will not be much of an improvement.
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What did I say? All the trolls enter with the same line.
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Who is the one who has posted all across the internet, interminably criticising a car he hasn't even sat in?
I have no agenda and am not loyal to, or hostile towards, any particular brand.
I have posted facts and first-hand information - you have posted conjecture, fabrication and nonsense.
Who's the troll?
I have no agenda and am not loyal to, or hostile towards, any particular brand.
I have posted facts and first-hand information - you have posted conjecture, fabrication and nonsense.
Who's the troll?
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ok, lets seriously do an apples to apples comparison of two cars...The GTR and the BMW M5/6. The BMW has 500 hp and weighs about the same as the GTR, and aerodynamically cannot be much different. What is the BMW's time around the ring.....? The GTR will not be much of an improvement.
EDIT: Correction on the times. And also if the GTR is actually making 485hp, which i really doubt.
Last edited by jaeS4; Nov 19, 2008 at 06:55 AM.
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actually, the beemer is probably faster. But around the track they should be close. They are both big fat behemoths, which may be good for straight line but around curves,.....no. I guess you can make anything handle, but man the forces that you put on a suspension at that weight level is sure to destroy it after only a short time. We'll see how long on a track before things start to break due to weight.....
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The weight difference between GT-R and Turbo is less than the difference between Turbo and GT3.
Does the Turbo's extra weight mean that it can't go around corners?
With a typical American in the passenger seat, you're not far off equal.
Does the Turbo's extra weight mean that it can't go around corners?
With a typical American in the passenger seat, you're not far off equal.
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Who is the one who has posted all across the internet, interminably criticising a car he hasn't even sat in?
I have no agenda and am not loyal to, or hostile towards, any particular brand.
I have posted facts and first-hand information - you have posted conjecture, fabrication and nonsense.
Who's the troll?
I have no agenda and am not loyal to, or hostile towards, any particular brand.
I have posted facts and first-hand information - you have posted conjecture, fabrication and nonsense.
Who's the troll?
I havent critisized the car much, moreso Nissan and the media. And certainly havent done as much trolling as you have.
I havent joined site after site to promote or bash any car, can you say the same? You call yourself a Porsche enthusiast and join a Porsche site and have not one post outside of a GT-R thread. On top of that not even one remotely suggestive post of being a Porsche fan.
The car forums I post on, I've followed and been a member of, and at some point owned a car from the make, or at least followed prior to anything concerning the GT-R (other than nagtroc) can you say the same?
How many sites in which you are a newbie member and havent posted about anything but the GT-R? Dont even try to compare you and I.
I'm an enthusiast. YOU, are a troll
Last edited by heavychevy; Nov 19, 2008 at 07:14 AM.