Can your Turbo be made to handle like a GT3?
 

Hey all, I came from an 08 C2S and love the power the turbo has but am so uncomfortable with the sloppy handling (when compared to the S model). So I know many of you have done PSS10's, sway bars, bushings, etc..... from those who actually have technical knowledge in the field, what is the best way to get our Turbos to handle (if its even possible) about as good as a GT3.

*please do me a favor, no bs posts about "get a GT2", etc etc...

Im truly in love with my Turbo, just want it to be more aggressive when entering/ exiting turns. Im sure Im gonna get alot of answers, but just would like to get some info from the professionals in the field as to which mods are the real change makers. Thanks in advance to all.

We always recommend Sway Bars to start... We have an article coming out in excellence in the next issue(may) outlining our 775 Car and our DampHR Coilovers which will be a good read. Here is a link to our modded damptronic coils...

http://www.tpcracing.com/products/TP...nic-Coilovers/

Would be happy to answer any more questions for you but the best place to start is a nice set of adjustable hollow swaybars and then work up from there...

We also offer proprietary swaybars coupled with the appropriate springs and adjustable links. Definitely a great way to tighten your car up on a budget.

http://tpcracing.net/cms/store/image...ew/42_73_p.jpg

http://www.tpcracing.com/products/99...-2-Suspension/

Let me know what else I can answer for you!

!
 

Hi Casey,
I am very interested in the review. And why do I have this feeling it's going to be quite a rave? :)
If so, let me be the first one to congratulate you on the excellent work!

dinorocz,
I am not a pro, but do have plenty of experience with C2, C2S, Turbo Stock, and Turbo with Bilstein, so maybe I could be of help. Yes I agree with you, the dirty little secret is that the stock 997.1 Turbo is the most sloppy of all 997 and feels more "loose" than either C2 or C2S (a huge surprise to me when I first switched from my C2 to Turbo -- first I thought I was imagining things).

If your question is whether the Turbo could be made to handle like or slightly better than a C2S: Yes, very easily. Bilstein, or TPC modified Bilstein, or KW.
If your question is whether the Turbo could be made to handle like a GT3: My first question is, is it really what you want? If still yes, then IMHO: More difficult, because first, it's AWD (more grip in corner) versus RWD (more "tossable" in corner, better for track), second, there is a 300 lbs or so weight difference between the 2 cars, and third, will need more stiffening. Now you are looking at Moton, JRZ, KW, TPC Bilstein system, etc., and changing other suspension components (toe link, drop link, rear upper control links, etc.) as well. From what I read so far, I really like the integrated suspension work of TPC and if you are close to their shop, I would MOST DEFINITELY arrange to take a test drive in the TPC Turbo.

Thanks Can. Let me know when you want a set of those intercoolers :)

The above system is very similar to the gmg setup I used. It is very good,will transform the car. The gmg/eilbach springs are not your typical softer than stock lowering sprigs, they work very well. The damptronics would give you gt3 style handling with adjustability.

Lots of people comment on why our swaybars cost twice or more than the competition... here is the answer.

Our bars are designed in house, through trial and error, adjusting rates, picking the specific materials to make the bars work. After they are trialed we then get prototypes in, and run them again... after we find them to be perfect we send the design to our bender and then they are bent one at a time until we have a set of 25.

The bars are run in PCA and Grand am. Our links are made with the finest pieces available including rod ends made by aurora.

Our parts are built to be raced and that is what we do with them.

i am waiting to do what TT surgeon originally did: GMG sways and springs...apparently transforms the car into a much better machine

spring time is comin!

It really is not possible to make a turbo handle like a GT3 for a variety of reasons. I gave up on that quest after swapping out many suspension components many times. Having said that, you can definately make your turbo handle better. Starting with a set of coilovers I think is key. You have to make a decision though on how much stiffness you are willing to put up with in your quest for better handling. If stiffness is not an issue, then go with either Motons or JRZ's. Nothing better out there for our cars for pure handling performance. If you want something that is less stiff, but still give you great track performance, then KW V3 is your choice. I found this to be perfect for me after trying the JRZ route. Most people go with the PSS10 due to it's OE like quality and characterisics, but with much improved overall handling. TPC has a new modified Bilstein setup customized by them that I think might be a great alternative too. They do know a lot about suspenstion tuning. Afterall, they have won a few races over the years...:)

Then comes the solid upper mounts, drop links, sway bars, toe links, upper dog bones, and maybe even better lower control arms. Now keep in mind, all of these great parts mean nothing in a hands of a local self proclaimed street tuner. Just because they can install it doesn't mean they can actually make the parts do what you want it to do. Getting a really knowledgeable tuner to properly tune, corner weight, and align your car is the most critical part to the suspension equation. Once all that is done and done properly, the turbo will handle and feel WAY WAY better than what came stock. The car will feel much more neutral and a lot of the understeer and sloppiness in the stock form will be gone. You can dive into corners with a lot more confidence.:D:D These are just my opinions, but there are some really great tuners and vendors (the experts) on this forum that can give you some good guidance. I wish you luck with your project..

I drove with Mike Levitas/TPC in their shop 997tt with their full Bilstein setup. Wow, car handles like a monster - and if you ask me on our test drive I got all 4 wheels of the road - I swear. TPCs Damptronic gets custom heads and revalved for stiffer spring rates. The setup is awesome.

I just did GMG sways and Springs. Have not driven my car much since...a lot of ice and snow.

TT surgeon: How do you have your sways set? Mine are set on the middle setting both front and back. My plan is to track it and see how I want to adjust it from there. Any advise?

Danny - As you stated the Turbo won't even outhandle a 997S . I've plunked thousands into both of my cars with suspension and things do improve but the car really is made more for straight line more than curves. It's not a wimp in the corners but the 997S and Gt3 are far superior.

In my opinion the Turbo's best race is the rolling start from about 40 MPH up . I have yet to see another car with the traction and boost capable of a modded Turbo.

You can make the Turbo handle "better", but it will never be a GT3 , there are just too many differences. Having said that a Turbo with springs/coilovers handles pretty damn well. I saw a post the other day that was intriguing, a stock 997 with GT3 lower control arms and toe links for track use, never thought of that but why not.
Before I did anything, I would get a good alignment as they are all over the place from the factory, 1 deg neg camber is achievable. Also tires and air pressure make a huge difference.

As I've started in the past, it depends on use. On the street, at US possible street speeds, can the Turbo made to handle like the GT3, well close. Even it you put a full GT3 suspension under a Turbo, it wouldn't feel be the same at the limit, as you have more weight, turbo lag, etc. As the throttle is a big part of handling/rotation at the limit, NA versus turbos will always feel different. If your goal is track use, I'd say get a GT3, not a real debate. For street use, a lightly modified TT can be very satisfying, and handle extremely well, but it will always feel different than a GT3.

The lightly modified 997.1 turbo feels better than an S, but will be different than a GT3.
I did back to back tests with a new 997.2 S with the sport package, and the 997.1 Turbo with stock suspension. The TT felt soft, and loose on center. The 997.1 TT with the H&R swaybars, and B16 suspension, and GT3 alignment, felt great, yet still streetable.

good info so far guys, much appreciated, I was wondering when you all say get an alignment, are you referring to a special set of alignment specs? if so what are the specs and where can I get them? also with an aggressive alignment are the tires gonna last what is considered normal for a Porsche? Lastly I am not looking to be a track star, just looking to get the handling I had in the S on this turbo so when Im going around some twisty roads I can push the car with the feeling that it will take it.

As far as suspension replacements, has anybody replaced sways, links, bushings, to GT3 ones? If so is there a significant difference? Or should I just go aftermarket on those items? Thanks again for the terrific replies, it is greatly appreciated