997 Turbo / GT2 2006–2012 Turbo discussion on the 997 model Porsche 911 Twin Turbo.
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Old Nov 8, 2010 | 03:29 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by GT-Silver
Casey thank you for your input im really interested in your package but i have a couple of Q's.

I just want to ask is every setup different, ie suited for every car or is it one setup for all? If so how will the suspension alignment setup determined for my car ?

Because im actually in Kuwait and not in the states so for me to send my front and rear shocks a couple times or bringing my car in to get the right setup isnt an option for me. How will i know that i will have the best setup for me ?
I know you were not asking me but your questions are so "loaded" that I can't resist jumping in. I'm sure Casey will give you his (excellent) professional opinion. Followed is my experience/opinion as an amateur and pardon me if you already know all of this.

The answer to the first part, is there a one-size-fit-all setting, is yes and no. No because each of us has different ability and uses the car differently, and yes, since because a majority of forum members are amateurs and have a narrow range of (limited) skill levels (there are always exceptions of course), a lot of the settings end up being somewhat similar. Check first page of the Bilstein link in my signature to see a typical setting.

The answer to the second part, how do you know you'll have the best set-up for you? There is no way around it: you will have to experiment and find out for yourself. Thankfully, the experimentation could be a very simple and fun process and TPC will be an excellent starting point and a source of help IMO.

I always divide suspension tuning to two components:
1. Hardware (coilover, sway bar, link, tire, etc.), and
2. Alignment settings
The alignment setting process *could* be simple because although there are numerous setting variables, for the amateurs it comes down to two essential parameters: camber settings and front/rear sway bar setting, and there ARE typical settings for these two parameters (again, click first page of Bilstein link in my signature). This part could easily done by your dealer and should not cost more than 200 each time (cost of alignment/camber change) or even cheaper (sway bar setting is a 5 minute procedure and should be done for nearly free).
The hardware is the tricky part. Here one has to remember that nothing comes free in suspension setup and it's nearly always handling (stiff suspension) versus ride (soft), corner speed (more neg. camber) versuse straiglthline speed (less camber, toe, etc.).
So.... my amateur level advice is:

1. If possible, change your suspension one step at a time. Start with coilover and sway bar, and add the solid links as your proceed. More solid links = very likely better handling, but worsening ride. By adding one piece at a time, if there is something not to your liking, you know exactly which component is the likely guilty party. "One step at a time" is an extremely educational and sometimes, eye-opening experience. To me, there is no other way.

2. Always keep in mind "nothing comes free." In general and very likely, as your car becomes stiffer and better at the track, it will become more intolerable on the streets. There is no way around this. Good luck, drive safely, and have fun.
 

Last edited by cannga; Nov 8, 2010 at 03:40 PM.
Old Nov 10, 2010 | 02:45 PM
  #17  
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Thanks cannga for your input, regarding coilover i think it may be soon and Im still undecided whether I will need the pasm or not. After our track season finishes I will decide. For now i think i will go with sway bars and solid links and go from there.

Will keep you posted throughout the track season.
 
Old Nov 10, 2010 | 03:36 PM
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Glad to hear that you liked the system. I ordered the same system yesterday for my street driven 997.2 turbo (EVO 650).

P.S. I'll spare you any additional comments about seat time as that's a given, and you've obviously already been on the track enough (25 days this year alone) to realize how important that is.

Originally Posted by vpmick
Guys, today was the end of the 2010 Track season in the Mid West and I just wanted to share my thoughts about my TPC Suspension Upgrade. This was my first year with the TPC Stage 3+ suspension on my 2007 TT and all I can say is it’s AWESOME( I had over over 25 track days this year at Putnam Park, Autobahn, Gingerman, VIR, Carolina Motorsports Park )! This mod has totally changed my my car into a truly fantastic sports car. I debated doing engine mods or suspension upgrades with my goal being to improving my track times and I believe I made the right decision. This year I was able to improve my time by over 4 seconds at our local road course ( Putnam Park 1.8 mile road course ). The car has significantly better cornering and handling and is totally different from stock...turn in is crisper, high speed corning is much more stable and the car is much more nimble...it’s like driving on rails. Now when you put the power down the suspension is able to handle it in a controlled and predictable manner. I know many of you are focused on 0-60, 1/4 mile or dyno numbers, but I’m a believer that a Porsche is meant to be driven on the track and with the TPC suspension I feel I have a car that is able to compete with most any “stock” vehicle at the track.

Not sure what I will do next to improve my times ( engine is stock but I have Spraco DTM seats, roll bar, harness , Hoosier R6’s, Padgid Yellow’s) but I think I have the basic platform to build on. Any input is appreciated. Thanks Mike, Casey and the TPC team and to EP Werks in Indianapolis for the outstanding install and ongoing service.
 
Old Nov 10, 2010 | 11:23 PM
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Originally Posted by GT-Silver
Thanks cannga for your input, regarding coilover i think it may be soon and Im still undecided whether I will need the pasm or not. After our track season finishes I will decide. For now i think i will go with sway bars and solid links and go from there.

Will keep you posted throughout the track season.
You're very welcome. When you "play around" with the sway bar, remember that in the 997.1 Turbo, *in general* (YMMV, etc.), the preferred setting is soft front, stiff rear. This is to reduce the tendency for this 4WD car to understeer (as opposed to 2WD). (BTW, it's been argued that Porsche over-compensated in the 997.1 and dialed out too much of the oversteer.)

It seems like you're doing it gradually and slowly, which is great, but also keep in mind the BIG transformation and improvement come more with the stiffer coilover and spring, not the stiffer links. When you are ready for the coilover, trust me that it will be a revelation. Stock 997.1 Turbo is tragically soft and leans too much. This is its most significant design flaw and Porsche admits that much with revision in 997.2's suspension system (which is still too soft for the track IMHO, btw).
 

Last edited by cannga; Nov 10, 2010 at 11:31 PM.
Old Nov 11, 2010 | 09:20 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by Racer_eX
Glad to hear that you liked the system. I ordered the same system yesterday for my street driven 997.2 turbo (EVO 650).

P.S. I'll spare you any additional comments about seat time as that's a given, and you've obviously already been on the track enough (25 days this year alone) to realize how important that is.
Tom mentioned that another 3+ was going out. Congrats! Look forward to your full review!

Casey
 
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