Does anyone know how does the F77 package compete with the X51?

 

One is favtory and the other aftermarket . Both are high quality .

There really is only so much one can gain with a normally aspirated engine . Debating one over the other is somewhat like splitting hairs .

 

Was curious I now have the F77 package, had a chance of purchasing a C4S cab with the X51 and all the bells, I mean fully loaded with every option available, but was sold from under me litterally, I was working on buying the car and wifey got in the way and when I convinced her and went back the following afternoon is had been sold. I took wife with, she felt bad and said for me to get the turbo, but was set on the C4S cab and got a good deal on my second choice. Have sice been trying to get all the mods. Thanks for the reply.

 

Baby -- You are following in my footsteps .

Unlike you though the X51 wasn't in my game plan because i jumped right up to the Turbo one month after I installed F77 and only 5 months after i bought that car .

What the F77 did was give me just enough power to re examine what car I REALLY wanted .

I rationalized by selecting a relatively low optioned Turbo . I figured that if I didn't choose the ceramic brakes for intance that it would absorb my loss in trade in .

Once I got the Turbo I realized that it had this component of luxury combined with the power . The stock car had some lag but still creamed the F77 car in acceleration .

Then came the mods . I am now at 700 and the face smearing acceleration is everything that I ever wanted in this car . With Turbo's priced reasonably on the used market .. it may not be a bad idea .

It will cost you about 50K plus your car to get into a stock Turbo (same model year) and then the rest is up to you.

 

This **** is addictive isn't it! Looks like I may be headed there, but not ready for that just yet, but who knows....Funny isn't it.

 

I hear ya . You buy the car, then the goodies , then you drive it ... then post here . It's a cycle which begins with ideas in youth and culminates with creating a dream come true . Only thing .. I have done it 8 times (8th Porsche) .

With ones wallet as his only boundary where does it end ?

It never ends .

 

incredible.... and the fun continues until the wallet dries up!

 

Ahh the race for more power.....

Jason

 

I don't know about the F77 being better than X51. I may be biased having X51 on my car but, as far as I know, the F77 is not as extensive as the X51. By this I mean that it doesn't have the revised cylinder heads, bigger throttle body and aluminum intake manifold. I mean, Porsche includes a lot more than just a carbon fiber intake, headers and a reflash to give the power of the X51. I am just a little sceptic about the F77 specially after reading the article on Excellence about it. Just my $0.02. The again, the F77 is a lot less than the X51.

 

The x51 is only 25 Hp above stock . My first post stated that both are quality and comparing them is splitting hairs .

So lets split them if you wish .

Let's say the person plunks down the extra 20 K to retrofit the X51 . He's in Gt3 price territory and instead of 380Hp (997S x51) he gets 415 and a dry sump engine (with the Gt3) ,

Well 415 sounds a lot better ? So let's see a rolling start of a gt3 with a stock Turbo . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BVhWlpGlE0

Now that's just a stock (boring) Turbo . Imagine what another 200Hp can add .

So let's go back to the F77 vs X51 -- each will give a nice midrange punch and great growl on an awesome car BUT if the 997S buyer has that 20K to spend why not jump up all the way?

 

X51 was $16k upgrade. A X51 engine make 381hp BUT it rev's faster and more freely. There are internal changes to a X51 engine such as ported heads and so forth. A stock 997S with X51 listed $93-96k. Much less than a $134k GT3 or even a Turbo.

 

There's a French review of the X51 back in 2005 where they could not explain how a stock 997S actually beat one with an X51. I wasn't able to fiind it but see it was discussed here . http://www.theautobahn.com/forum/sho...2&start=&pp=10

We can dispute the logic of the article . What stands is the 16K price as an upgrade OR the approx 20K it would cost with labor to retrofit it.

A 96K 997S with X51 does not sund heavily optioned . The base price of a Gt3 is 106K and with options costs less than a base Turbo. Given that options are expensive to me the Gt3 and 997S X51 are close enough in price but far off in performance .

The X51 is a quality package but is it worth the price ticket to get when the alternative choices exist ?

That's up to the individual . I opted for the F77 at that time and realized the car I really wanted was a Turbo .

With used pricing in a soft market of present ... the choices get even closer and the decision more complex .

One can't lose no matter what he gets .

 

I have a 997 S with F77 and am happy with the mods. I can't confirm that it adds more power, but when I drive other 997 S without F77 upgrade, I feel like the car is missing something.

 

I believe, as others have said, that the two big differences are;

1. The X51 provides proven power.

2. The X51 is ridiculous expensive, especially if purchased after the fact. Yet, it might just be the only way to drag extra power out of these engines while keeping NA.

That being said, is it really believed that exhaust, headers, cats do not add extra power? While I do not believe these modifications provide 30+ HP, I do believe the HP increases exist. Based on what I have seen these engines really benefit from a set of headers and high flow cats. An increase of 15-20HP does not appear to be outside the realm of possibility.

Furthermore, the 3.8L engine has a noted breathing problem in the higher revs which apparently is easily remedied with a simple intake and exhaust mod.

Thoughts...

Jason

 

1) Re the X51 price . That 20K would place me in a Gt3 without a second thought . It has all the X51 along with a dry sump engine . It prices out the 997S X51 IMO. .

2) The F77 --Exhaust weighs less and combined with intake gives "breathing" . The flash helps the mid range . It's minimal in comparison to more extraodinary mods (like a supercharger) but it does give a simplicy to the base engine upgrade.

The gains which can be made with the Turbo are much more extreme in contrast . If a normally aspirated car is on the plate and we speak of 05 -08 models the Gt3 = that 20K .