Q: C2S brakes a factory option on 2008 C2?
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Mods are fun. Some people like them, some - not. I like them. I wish my garage would be bigger and had a lift.
911 is built relatively easy to work on, much better than nissan or toyota, IMHO. I can actually sneak my hands in most places on this car. It is a shame not to get benefit of that.
911 is built relatively easy to work on, much better than nissan or toyota, IMHO. I can actually sneak my hands in most places on this car. It is a shame not to get benefit of that.
Although its back to stock now!
Jason
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Jellis - I am not debating the performance and emotional merrit of thecar you designed nor am I saying that you or I am suggesting anything outher than opinion with his suggested purchase.
What I am debating is the cost of creating this 104K C2 and its value in the market to a buyer who is factoring in cost in enough detail to be considering used cars too. I am also poining out that in the used market search ir was not found . A Boxter was found specd like this in Germany but that owner now faces selling it.
I also don't know why one auto journalist test in road and track constitutes a fact . If one qualifies all taht he reads in a profit driven article as fact the Gtr , M3 would have been chosen above the 911 Turbo and I see no reason not to question all the assertions .
Porsche backs up their claims to sell the C2S for a higher base price and included peformance data on their site but even they leave those numbers up to personal interpretation . Then they sell both cars.
What I am debating is the cost of creating this 104K C2 and its value in the market to a buyer who is factoring in cost in enough detail to be considering used cars too. I am also poining out that in the used market search ir was not found . A Boxter was found specd like this in Germany but that owner now faces selling it.
I also don't know why one auto journalist test in road and track constitutes a fact . If one qualifies all taht he reads in a profit driven article as fact the Gtr , M3 would have been chosen above the 911 Turbo and I see no reason not to question all the assertions .
Porsche backs up their claims to sell the C2S for a higher base price and included peformance data on their site but even they leave those numbers up to personal interpretation . Then they sell both cars.
Last edited by yrralis1; Aug 12, 2009 at 01:01 PM.
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Jellis - I am not debating the performance and emotional merrit of thecar you designed nor am I saying that you or I am suggesting anything outher than opinion with his suggested purchase.
What I am debating is the cost of creating this 104K C2 and its value in the market to a buyer who is factoring in cost in enough detail to be considering used cars too. I am also poining out that in the used market search ir was not found . A Boxter was found specd like this in Germany but that owner now faces selling it.
I also don't know why one auto journalist test in road and track constitutes a fact . If one qualifies all taht he reads in a profit driven article as fact the Gtr , M3 would have been chosen above the 911 Turbo and I see no reason not to question all the assertions .
Porsche backs up their claims to sell the C2S for a higher base price and included peformance data on their site but even they leave those numbers up to personal interpretation . Then they sell both cars.
What I am debating is the cost of creating this 104K C2 and its value in the market to a buyer who is factoring in cost in enough detail to be considering used cars too. I am also poining out that in the used market search ir was not found . A Boxter was found specd like this in Germany but that owner now faces selling it.
I also don't know why one auto journalist test in road and track constitutes a fact . If one qualifies all taht he reads in a profit driven article as fact the Gtr , M3 would have been chosen above the 911 Turbo and I see no reason not to question all the assertions .
Porsche backs up their claims to sell the C2S for a higher base price and included peformance data on their site but even they leave those numbers up to personal interpretation . Then they sell both cars.
As far as re-sale and market value.... your talking to a guy who drives a 140,000mi 11yr old M3 to work everyday... ( I drive my vehicles until they turn to dust-only real way to get your investment back-Ugh unless we are talking about a M3 DCT-I did get my money back on that [got a screaming deal when I bought it] )... and a guy that has dropped obscene amounts of money on a 997S so the rest of the stuff is just subjective I guess.
If I had a 104K, I would spec out my 997.2 as stated earlier... although I might opt for the 6spd
It might be silly but if I bought a GT3 or TT I would still want PCCB, Sport Buckets, Nav, Audio, Ipod, and some aftermarket exhaust mods. In which case we are talking about a 997.2 at about 104k and a GT3 at 136K and I shudder to think what the TT would be. So, in that sense the 997.2 is the bargain and since I am not a huge track junky, I really dont need the GT3. Yeah re-sale is for ****e, but I dont give a rip about re-sale....Jason
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To be honest I am not sure what we are debating. I thought you were saying you could not get PCCB on a 3.6. Which is untrue since you can. Article just proves they exist. If the debate was about something else then I am not following.
As far as re-sale and market value.... your talking to a guy who drives a 140,000mi 11yr old M3 to work everyday... ( I drive my vehicles until they turn to dust-only real way to get your investment back-Ugh unless we are talking about a M3 DCT-I did get my money back on that [got a screaming deal when I bought it] )... and a guy that has dropped obscene amounts of money on a 997S so the rest of the stuff is just subjective I guess.
If I had a 104K, I would spec out my 997.2 as stated earlier... although I might opt for the 6spd It might be silly but if I bought a GT3 or TT I would still want PCCB, Sport Buckets, Nav, Audio, Ipod, and some aftermarket exhaust mods. In which case we are talking about a 997.2 at about 104k and a GT3 at 136K and I shudder to think what the TT would be. So, in that sense the 997.2 is the bargain and since I am not a huge track junky, I really dont need the GT3. Yeah re-sale is for ****e, but I dont give a rip about re-sale....
Jason
As far as re-sale and market value.... your talking to a guy who drives a 140,000mi 11yr old M3 to work everyday... ( I drive my vehicles until they turn to dust-only real way to get your investment back-Ugh unless we are talking about a M3 DCT-I did get my money back on that [got a screaming deal when I bought it] )... and a guy that has dropped obscene amounts of money on a 997S so the rest of the stuff is just subjective I guess.
If I had a 104K, I would spec out my 997.2 as stated earlier... although I might opt for the 6spd
It might be silly but if I bought a GT3 or TT I would still want PCCB, Sport Buckets, Nav, Audio, Ipod, and some aftermarket exhaust mods. In which case we are talking about a 997.2 at about 104k and a GT3 at 136K and I shudder to think what the TT would be. So, in that sense the 997.2 is the bargain and since I am not a huge track junky, I really dont need the GT3. Yeah re-sale is for ****e, but I dont give a rip about re-sale....Jason
2) All he was asking was if the actual C2S brakes are on the C2 . My reply was that if the calipers are red they coiuld have been painted but that they are not the actual brakes.
3) You suggested a dream car C2 . It's no where near the price level of a guy looking at certified pre owned cars . It makes little sense even to me if its priced so high that it would cost nearly as much as a Gt3 and could even buy a used Turbo . In fact that 104K could buy this car. I remember when he picked it up and barely drove it . I remember how he specd it to the tee , added the Tubi exhaust and to me this is the car to buy in that price range. But this is not where the Op is looking. https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...tt-has-go.html
4) I considered the fact that he's trying to save money and how the dream C2 is priced so high that it can not hold its value in the market . That even if he could afford it .. it's a resale and financial disaster . There are just too many other Porsches with more to offer at that price level to have that car make sense .. and that's why its so rare.
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1) The Op's post has him searching for a certified pre owned 08 car . A search showed none on auto trader in the entire country with PCCB brakes available .
2) All he was asking was if the actual C2S brakes are on the C2 . My reply was that if the calipers are red they coiuld have been painted but that they are not the actual brakes.
3) You suggested a dream car C2 . It's no where near the price level of a guy looking at certified pre owned cars . It makes little sense even to me if its priced so high that it would cost nearly as much as a Gt3 and could even buy a used Turbo . In fact that 104K could buy this car. I remember when he picked it up and barely drove it . I remember how he specd it to the tee , added the Tubi exhaust and to me this is the car to buy in that price range. But this is not where the Op is looking. https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...tt-has-go.html
4) I considered the fact that he's trying to save money and how the dream C2 is priced so high that it can not hold its value in the market . That even if he could afford it .. it's a resale and financial disaster . There are just too many other Porsches with more to offer at that price level to have that car make sense .. and that's why its so rare.
2) All he was asking was if the actual C2S brakes are on the C2 . My reply was that if the calipers are red they coiuld have been painted but that they are not the actual brakes.
3) You suggested a dream car C2 . It's no where near the price level of a guy looking at certified pre owned cars . It makes little sense even to me if its priced so high that it would cost nearly as much as a Gt3 and could even buy a used Turbo . In fact that 104K could buy this car. I remember when he picked it up and barely drove it . I remember how he specd it to the tee , added the Tubi exhaust and to me this is the car to buy in that price range. But this is not where the Op is looking. https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...tt-has-go.html
4) I considered the fact that he's trying to save money and how the dream C2 is priced so high that it can not hold its value in the market . That even if he could afford it .. it's a resale and financial disaster . There are just too many other Porsches with more to offer at that price level to have that car make sense .. and that's why its so rare.
Come on, we are on a forum with guys that spend thousands in the aftermarket on Porsche's..... PORSCHE's
Jason
Last edited by JEllis; Aug 13, 2009 at 07:05 AM.
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Where did you get lettering for calipers?
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I love to dive into the debate here. Knowing Porsche, you can send in a lady's handbag and they'll paint the car that color. IF you have the MONEY, I would not be surprised as a Porsche Individual option, you could order a C2 with S brakes. The point of such an order would be beyond me. I think it is easy to order the OEM stencils for the brakes.
On the OPs car, it would be simple for the dealer to verify if they are S brakes. We could probably verify here too simply with a close up of the calipers. Keep in mind that the rotors on the S brakes are 13", although it's pretty hard to get a tape measure in there.
On the OPs car, it would be simple for the dealer to verify if they are S brakes. We could probably verify here too simply with a close up of the calipers. Keep in mind that the rotors on the S brakes are 13", although it's pretty hard to get a tape measure in there.
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Thanks yrralis,
and thanks to everone elso who chimed in to produce a lively discussion (even if it got carried a little away...)
I was very busy with patent filings so that I did not find time to answer/comment earlier. Sorry about that.
Rusnak Porsche called me and appologized for "an honest mistake". The calipers are power-coated in red (at Rusnak?) with new Porsche lettering. Therefore, yrralis was right and some others too. Bigger and red C2S brakes were probably optional on 997.1 C2s, but the ones in question are 100-% C2 brakes.
As I mentioned, I'm unfortunately very undecisive about my first Porsche ever. I apologize in advance but I believe that some others esperienced that too. I'm a scientist (chemistry) and, unfortunately, used to look at every detail before deciding on the next step. This may be good for my profession but naturally is in the way of many day-to-day decisions like what Porsche to buy and so on.
While I may have the funds to go for a 2009 997.2 C2S or a fully optioned C2 or the like, I believe that this is not the right thing to do for me personally, at least not now. I'll be probably ok with a used yet technically ok and cosmetically appealing Carrera like the black 2008 Rusnak/Pasadena CA Certified pre-owned, even if it is "only" a 3.6L C2. The DME report of the Rusnak Porsche had 62 entries in range 1, 6 in rage 2 and none in ranges 3-6. I think the price is still too high (asking price ~ $ 62 K) and I could get weak @ < $ 55 K (or < $ 60 K out of the door incl. all fees and taxes). There are several nice ones out there which could fit my bill of getting my feet wet with a first Porsche experience. I'll probably will not mod the car, not track the car but I want to enjoy the car just for its mere aestetics. Plus, I have a 9-year old boy, albeit well-behaved, who needs to be able to join me in the car without me getting a cardiac arrest if there some unavoidable things happen.
Probably, I'll do some more "homework" (need to haves, nice to haves, not need to haves, etc.) and will address the audience with some future questions because I believe this forum/on-line community suits not only the tech expert, the track guru, the mod champion but also the beginner, wonna-be (or future owner).
Thanks again to everyone for your kind input.
~ Bernd
and thanks to everone elso who chimed in to produce a lively discussion (even if it got carried a little away...)
I was very busy with patent filings so that I did not find time to answer/comment earlier. Sorry about that.
Rusnak Porsche called me and appologized for "an honest mistake". The calipers are power-coated in red (at Rusnak?) with new Porsche lettering. Therefore, yrralis was right and some others too. Bigger and red C2S brakes were probably optional on 997.1 C2s, but the ones in question are 100-% C2 brakes.
As I mentioned, I'm unfortunately very undecisive about my first Porsche ever. I apologize in advance but I believe that some others esperienced that too. I'm a scientist (chemistry) and, unfortunately, used to look at every detail before deciding on the next step. This may be good for my profession but naturally is in the way of many day-to-day decisions like what Porsche to buy and so on.
While I may have the funds to go for a 2009 997.2 C2S or a fully optioned C2 or the like, I believe that this is not the right thing to do for me personally, at least not now. I'll be probably ok with a used yet technically ok and cosmetically appealing Carrera like the black 2008 Rusnak/Pasadena CA Certified pre-owned, even if it is "only" a 3.6L C2. The DME report of the Rusnak Porsche had 62 entries in range 1, 6 in rage 2 and none in ranges 3-6. I think the price is still too high (asking price ~ $ 62 K) and I could get weak @ < $ 55 K (or < $ 60 K out of the door incl. all fees and taxes). There are several nice ones out there which could fit my bill of getting my feet wet with a first Porsche experience. I'll probably will not mod the car, not track the car but I want to enjoy the car just for its mere aestetics. Plus, I have a 9-year old boy, albeit well-behaved, who needs to be able to join me in the car without me getting a cardiac arrest if there some unavoidable things happen.
Probably, I'll do some more "homework" (need to haves, nice to haves, not need to haves, etc.) and will address the audience with some future questions because I believe this forum/on-line community suits not only the tech expert, the track guru, the mod champion but also the beginner, wonna-be (or future owner).
Thanks again to everyone for your kind input.
~ Bernd
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Bernd -
The problem with getting the 08 is that the pricing is high enough to be in direct competition with the huge discounts on the 09 cars. In your region someone (forum member Jersey 1977) did post that he got 20 percent . He dod not buy the car at Rusnak but he did shop several dealerships .
Many of those 20 percent deals are hard to find (I got mine at 20 percent too) and were morte isolated to the month of July . However it wouild be fair to say taht if you called up 10 dealerrships you would get anywhere from 15 to 20 percent at the end of the day . That places a modestly optioned 09 in the upper 70's NEW. Used it will go in the low to mid 70's . http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...standard=false
In contrast the 08 C2S cars will sell in the 60's . 07 cars in the 50's . 06 cars in the low 50's .
The 7 -10K extra spent to get a new 2009 car discounted gets 30 more HP and no previous driver history . That's quite a difference . If saving money is the focus the sweet spot year is 2007 cars . It has taken the biggest depreciation hit but still has warranty.
Good luck.
The problem with getting the 08 is that the pricing is high enough to be in direct competition with the huge discounts on the 09 cars. In your region someone (forum member Jersey 1977) did post that he got 20 percent . He dod not buy the car at Rusnak but he did shop several dealerships .
Many of those 20 percent deals are hard to find (I got mine at 20 percent too) and were morte isolated to the month of July . However it wouild be fair to say taht if you called up 10 dealerrships you would get anywhere from 15 to 20 percent at the end of the day . That places a modestly optioned 09 in the upper 70's NEW. Used it will go in the low to mid 70's . http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...standard=false
In contrast the 08 C2S cars will sell in the 60's . 07 cars in the 50's . 06 cars in the low 50's .
The 7 -10K extra spent to get a new 2009 car discounted gets 30 more HP and no previous driver history . That's quite a difference . If saving money is the focus the sweet spot year is 2007 cars . It has taken the biggest depreciation hit but still has warranty.
Good luck.
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Thanks yrralis,
and thanks to everone elso who chimed in to produce a lively discussion (even if it got carried a little away...)
I was very busy with patent filings so that I did not find time to answer/comment earlier. Sorry about that.
Rusnak Porsche called me and appologized for "an honest mistake". The calipers are power-coated in red (at Rusnak?) with new Porsche lettering. Therefore, yrralis was right and some others too. Bigger and red C2S brakes were probably optional on 997.1 C2s, but the ones in question are 100-% C2 brakes.
As I mentioned, I'm unfortunately very undecisive about my first Porsche ever. I apologize in advance but I believe that some others esperienced that too. I'm a scientist (chemistry) and, unfortunately, used to look at every detail before deciding on the next step. This may be good for my profession but naturally is in the way of many day-to-day decisions like what Porsche to buy and so on.
While I may have the funds to go for a 2009 997.2 C2S or a fully optioned C2 or the like, I believe that this is not the right thing to do for me personally, at least not now. I'll be probably ok with a used yet technically ok and cosmetically appealing Carrera like the black 2008 Rusnak/Pasadena CA Certified pre-owned, even if it is "only" a 3.6L C2. The DME report of the Rusnak Porsche had 62 entries in range 1, 6 in rage 2 and none in ranges 3-6. I think the price is still too high (asking price ~ $ 62 K) and I could get weak @ < $ 55 K (or < $ 60 K out of the door incl. all fees and taxes). There are several nice ones out there which could fit my bill of getting my feet wet with a first Porsche experience. I'll probably will not mod the car, not track the car but I want to enjoy the car just for its mere aestetics. Plus, I have a 9-year old boy, albeit well-behaved, who needs to be able to join me in the car without me getting a cardiac arrest if there some unavoidable things happen.
Probably, I'll do some more "homework" (need to haves, nice to haves, not need to haves, etc.) and will address the audience with some future questions because I believe this forum/on-line community suits not only the tech expert, the track guru, the mod champion but also the beginner, wonna-be (or future owner).
Thanks again to everyone for your kind input.
~ Bernd
and thanks to everone elso who chimed in to produce a lively discussion (even if it got carried a little away...)
I was very busy with patent filings so that I did not find time to answer/comment earlier. Sorry about that.
Rusnak Porsche called me and appologized for "an honest mistake". The calipers are power-coated in red (at Rusnak?) with new Porsche lettering. Therefore, yrralis was right and some others too. Bigger and red C2S brakes were probably optional on 997.1 C2s, but the ones in question are 100-% C2 brakes.
As I mentioned, I'm unfortunately very undecisive about my first Porsche ever. I apologize in advance but I believe that some others esperienced that too. I'm a scientist (chemistry) and, unfortunately, used to look at every detail before deciding on the next step. This may be good for my profession but naturally is in the way of many day-to-day decisions like what Porsche to buy and so on.
While I may have the funds to go for a 2009 997.2 C2S or a fully optioned C2 or the like, I believe that this is not the right thing to do for me personally, at least not now. I'll be probably ok with a used yet technically ok and cosmetically appealing Carrera like the black 2008 Rusnak/Pasadena CA Certified pre-owned, even if it is "only" a 3.6L C2. The DME report of the Rusnak Porsche had 62 entries in range 1, 6 in rage 2 and none in ranges 3-6. I think the price is still too high (asking price ~ $ 62 K) and I could get weak @ < $ 55 K (or < $ 60 K out of the door incl. all fees and taxes). There are several nice ones out there which could fit my bill of getting my feet wet with a first Porsche experience. I'll probably will not mod the car, not track the car but I want to enjoy the car just for its mere aestetics. Plus, I have a 9-year old boy, albeit well-behaved, who needs to be able to join me in the car without me getting a cardiac arrest if there some unavoidable things happen.
Probably, I'll do some more "homework" (need to haves, nice to haves, not need to haves, etc.) and will address the audience with some future questions because I believe this forum/on-line community suits not only the tech expert, the track guru, the mod champion but also the beginner, wonna-be (or future owner).
Thanks again to everyone for your kind input.
~ Bernd
I realize I am little more of cowboy when it comes to my opinion on purchasing a Porsche. But, watching people try to make a financially sound Porsche purchase is kinda like watching someone order a Big Mac Extra Value Meal Supersized but with a Diet Coke. My point, buying a Porsche makes no sense other than it is what we "want" to drive, so spec it the way you want, buy the one you want. If you are buying a car you need then there are way better options for about 1/4 of the price. If you want a super reliable sporty car then buy a CPO'd BMW E46 330i ZHP! They are going for the 18K range with less than 50K miles and it will last and be reliable for another 200K miles. However, my guess is you want a Porsche... which means you are driven by want and not need. Dont feel bad.... you are surrounded by a brotherhood.
Best thing you can do is hang around here. You are surrounded by guys that have 80K Porsche's with 100K worth of mods, tracked prepped Porsche's that never see the track, $6K wraps on cars that never get driven, guys with four cars (all sports cars)......etc etc etc
Jason
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I think prices on used cars jumped up, plus just from looking at same saved links I still have I simply do not see much offering anymore. 2006 CPO C2S at Porsche dealer goes now for almost $60K. 2 months ago I could get one for $54K. 07 is usually $5K-6K more.
Again, I got my CPO C2 from private party for $40K. That sort of prices are practically gone now, I do not see anything like this at all in 200 miles area around me, everything seems to sit in $48K+ area. May be it`s just a typical end of summer thing.
Again, I got my CPO C2 from private party for $40K. That sort of prices are practically gone now, I do not see anything like this at all in 200 miles area around me, everything seems to sit in $48K+ area. May be it`s just a typical end of summer thing.
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