I think DonBond hit a right nail. That totally drew me to AM and to Lotus.

I feel that in several ways, what AM is facing parallels to Lotus. Same "look" throughout the years, niche market, somewhat lackluster performance numbers. While AM has secured a deal with AMG as a supplier, I just hope Lotus can do a little better with their power plant sourcing.

Still they are very special marques in each of their own ways.

 

In the last Bond movie that used a modern AM, 9 were wrecked. Okay, they're not 9 you would see in the showroom but still a sizable investment indeed. The Broccoli family generally doesn't want to kick in too much for production, hell, they only paid Craig about $225,000 for his work and they will generally put so many restrictions and obligations onto a vendor/supplier that only the healthy can afford it. Ford had the resources to do this but I don't think the current owners do, even though they realize the Bond link is the best marketing going. Let's hope that Aston retains the link.

 

I agree. At the end of the day, despite its struggles, Aston Martin has still been around significantly longer than most of its competitors. 100 years is nothing to scoff at.

I'm sure they'll figure it out.

 

Yes, the 993… I love it. It’s a standard Carrera – rear-drive – and I’ve had it 13+ years. I’ve done a number of track days in it, and it’s great fun, and a great way to learn about driving I really enjoy the challenge, the way the car talks to you. Yes, it’s work, but I like that you have to DRIVE it and that it rewards you for learning its characteristics. I’ve gotten to a point at which I can use its “interesting” weight distribution and make it work for me, but that doesn’t mean I can get the last drop of performance out of it – I’ve ridden with some pro drivers and, well, they’re better than I am…

I haven’t had the Vantage on track yet, but I’ve spoken to many who have and whose driving ability I respect. They say that for a road car it’s really very good on track -- a lot of fun and very well balanced. Chris Harris, who clearly can drive, has said very complimentary things about The V8V's behavior on track. It may not be the fastest but, as Harris said, it’s fast, balanced exploitable and fun.

 

I don’t think that Aston should stay where it is today in terms of tech (or performance, even it that’s only due to marketing realities). I do think that the current cars are underrated and that they continue to offer a unique and ultra-desirable driving and ownership experience. Much as I love the AM niche, I fully recognize that while many people like me buy their cars, there aren’t enough people like me. I do fear that if they try to appeal to a broader range of people they will appeal less to me – that’s what happened with Porsche. That does NOT mean that I don’t want them to get up to date with tech – they need to because the market demands it. Hopefully, the AMG deal will address that without diluting/destroying the Aston Martin-ness.

FWIW, that “great” tech in my wife’s Mercedes continues to go wrong with infuriating frequency. My V8V has been FAR more reliable. Even though I personally can’t imagine caring more about a higher-feature NAV or cooled seats (nice though they are) than the car itself, most buyers aren’t enthusiasts and they want the bells and whistles. As a crude example, years ago I bought a 3-Series BMW. When I chose its options, I spent the limited amount I could on the sports suspension rather than on a fancier infotainment system. Most people do it the other way around. Priorities…

RossL, when I said I care more about “the car itself,” why do you think that means I should be offended by ABS and sound insulation It’s an Aston Martin, not a Caterham. My point is that I greatly prefer the Aston’s craftsmanship and materials quality, its fairly heavy but feelsome hydraulic steering, the choice of a manual gearbox, and its analogue (rather than digital) feel, rather than radar-guided cruise control, cooled seats and the latest super-duper nav.

About the CAR video: No question that the F12 is an amazing thing. But, there is a large price difference between F12 and Vanquish. Also, they’re different cars with different characters. Besides, the video’s credibility is questionable since the journo doesn’t even pronounce Porsche properly

Blue Skies said, “The fact is that there is a higher perception of ‘wealth’ associated with Bentley, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Rolls, etc than Aston Martin.” I completely disagree. I never thought this before I bought my Aston, and perhaps more tellingly my experience as an owner very strongly suggests that this is not true. People frequently ask if my car is a Bentley, and upon learning that it’s an Aston at least two have replied “Oh, that’s much better.” Many completely swoon (including those who didn’t know it’s an Aston and those who knew and are amazed to see one). People always think the car cost much more money than it does, nearly always assuming my “mere” V8V is at least a $200K car. Many people – both people who like cars and those who have no knowledge whatsoever -- have told me that they think Astons are more expensive than Ferraris. The “associated with wealth” thing is NOT Aston’s problem. That said, I agree that AM’s marketing needs to be better.

The new Vanquish is a great car, but within the current lineup it may be in the most difficult position because the F12 hurts it (fairly or not, especially in view of the price difference). AM should strap on a couple of superchargers ala V600, sort the transmission, charge an F12 price and go F12 hunting. The new DB9, IMO, offers a compelling ownership proposition because it’s much more of a sports car than, for example, the Conti GT. The DB9 is a better drive IMO (certainly a more sporting drive), is better looking, has 12 cylinders at the Conti’s 8 cyl price point, and isn’t based on a VW underneath (however evolved it may be). The V8V offers looks, craftsmanship, build and materials quality that are simply a league (or several) above anything else available at a similar price. Plus, the performance holds its own on the road.

Yes, AM needs to catch up with the tech (and their marketing), but I don’t find it difficult at all to remain impressed by their current offerings.

 

Most people around here tend to assume my DB9 is priced about the same as a Merc or BMW. I have had it confused for a Bentley, though.

Keep in mind that my context for "social perception" is that of the 20-something generation, which is clueless on approximately everything.

 

I don't want Astons to be as common as Porsches, but continually being in financial trouble is no way to run a business. Aston needs to sell more cars than they do now, period.

 

I am thankful bean counters haven't run amuck yet at AM. Is a company nearly broke, but not in crisis mode, a bad thing?

 

1000% agree

 

I wish I had this confidence.
Sadly, as is oft repeated in the investing sphere, "past performance is no assurance of future returns"

At Aston's price point(s), they have to nail one thing or another. Yes, the cars are fast and qualify as "performance" machines. But, you have to excel in order to sell.

The Vanquish is such a perfect summary of the problem(s): It's fast, but not faster than it's peers, so it doesn't stand out. It has cool comfort features (haptic touch interface) but they aren't all well sorted so rather than focusing on the cool, reviews find faults. It's a brand new, flagship vehicle. It should crush its peers on at least one front. If not faster in a straight line, it should have better corner manners. If not fast and nimble, it should be tech filled and brilliant inside. Instead, when matched side by side with peers, it's just OK.

On the other hand, I really enjoyed a recent drive report in one of the mags. Four adult men rode in a Rapide S for a two day road trip. Not a word in the entire piece suggested that the interior space and seats were anything but fine for a long haul trip. I wish more reviewers would take another look at the Rapide, especially now that it's faster. Then again, I wish AM would take another look at the Rapide and make it big enough to shame the Panamera and Quatroporte, it's already fast enough.

 

Here you go. Just what Aston needs to revive its fortunes...

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/ne...v-plan-revived

 

For a GT car, I'd much rather have a Jack of all trades and a master of none. This obsession with being the 'best' in one or more categories is not the Aston way.

To anyone contemplating a $300K car like the Vanquish, being the 'best', as measured by toys, gimmicks, and meaningless performance numbers, is irrelevant. You either want a Vanquish or you don't, and none of the other stuff matters.

I could care less how good a Ferrari or Lamborghini is as compared to the Vanquish. I would never buy either one as they simply are the wrong image (for me). So Vanquish would be the one and only choice for a sporting machine.

 

As much as I think this is a stupid idea - I was in that camp originally about Porsche making Cayennes... The concept was revolutionary, and I still somewhat hate how some other lines have 'diluted' the 911 flagship line, but it worked out better for everyone (more models sold = more money for R&D = better 911's). Now we have alternative Porsches to drive to work, while avoiding pot holes, etc...

With this 'Lagonda' (or whatever it will end up being called), there are now alternatives, with great standards that may open the door to markets that weren't looking for - just another coupe that can't be driven every day (not me, but I'd speculate a large portion).

The golden nugget in whole article is the co-development with Mercedes. If this happens, I think we may be seeing a LOT more of Aston in years to come... (except for that damned Cygnet - that can stay gone)

 

This won't surprise anyone here... To me, Porsche is a completely different company post-Cayenne than it used to be. I liked it much better when it was an engineering company first, and a marketing company second. Now it's the other way around. Yes, it makes a lot of money, but that grow-at-all-costs plan also resulted in its being swallowed by VW, and no doubt more platform and other component sharing lies ahead. I used to be a major fan, but I've largely lost interest.

To me, an Aston Martin SUV sounds horrible. I had hoped they'd call it a Lagonda -- that would be more tolerable and if they made a truly special thing it could work -- but Bez (creator of the Cygnet, let's not forget) has made it clear that's not what he plans.

Don't get me wrong, I fully understand that AM needs to make some changes, but much of its appeal lies with rarity -- that they are not sold in big numbers. Porsches are everywhere now, and they are inarguably (IMNSHO) nowhere near as special as they used to be. An Aston is an event that a Porsche simply isn't, and that's central to AM's appeal.

An AM-Lagonda that is a M-B underneath -- that's a major step toward the end. Regarding this and the pending AMG-based engines (please let them be bespoke to the degree that the current V8's is!), David Brown is quoted in October's Octane, "Many, many times we mulled over the idea of putting in a big American engine and it would have reduced our costs. But the argument was, well, this won't be an Aston Martin."

Exactly.

 

Eh... Sounds like excuses to me. Anyone could say this, and 'stick to their guns', but those who adapt - survive.