A little more nimble the V8, the engine rev's different, and probably better suited for track days.

Yep. A well-specced V8V with sport pack suspension and a few very easy mods will be the superior car on the track, and you won't have to constantly sweat toasting your $10000 carbon ceramic rotors every few years. And the V12V hood is hideous, by the way--ruins the otherwise elegant lines of the car.

In terms of value for the money spent, the V8V is a far better bargain, too. Motor Trend got the 4.7L to 60mph in 4.1 seconds when the new engine first debuted, and thought it could do 3s with more practice... so the V12V is marginally faster to 60 (if you can get it to hook, which many people struggle with), and will accelerate harder on the highway, but what else do you get for the extra money? Nothing. For the price, there are at least a half-dozen other supercars, and even some non-supercars, that'd destroy the V12V, if all you care about is acceleration.

To me, the V12V is nothing more than bragging rights. And given how elitist many V12V owners seem to have become lately (there are exceptions), that opinion has only been reinforced; most of them think like you--"the only reason they didn't buy a V12V like I did is because they have less money than me." On the street, where the car will spend 95%+ of its life, the V12V offers nothing more than the V8V except the ability to say "it's a V12" when someone asks. (And yes, the sound is nice... I definitely don't hate my V8V with Fabspeed cat-delete X-pipe, though.)

I could afford either. I chose the V8V because it was better suited to what I wanted the car to be. And I'm not saying the V12V is unilaterally worse (though I do personally prefer lighter cars)--it's just not better enough to justify the price premium.

Speaking of "mindless sentences"...

If you don't buy the argument that the V12 imbues the Vantage with a special, exotic feeling not possible with the V8, that's fine. But please don't make daft blanket statements about the motives of V12 buyers.

"To me" declares that as an opinion, not as a fact. Language matters. To suggest that all people who buy V8Vs do so because they can't afford V12Vs is factually wrong, even if it might be the case for him.

And after just going for a drive in my V8, I'd say the only thing I'd want from it is a few hundred pounds of weight loss, not more power. Some people prefer the powerful luxurious grand tourers, and those people will prefer the V12V; I prefer the lightweight nimble sports cars, and love my V8V.

[QUOTE=Mathman85;4831514]Yep. V12V hood is hideous, by the way--ruins the otherwise elegant lines of the car.

Agree 100%, Never liked the hood of the V12 with those vents,

So davidm17 didn't explicitly state it was his opinion - therefore he believed his statement was a fact, which is clearly "mindless" and "wrong"? I actually agree with you on that, BTW, but it's the next part I take issue with: because you took care to use the phrase "to me", meaning your designation of V12 owners as braggarts and elitists is merely an opinion, it couldn't possibly be mindless or wrong (or a case of 'reverse' elitism)? Language matters, indeed. You don't have a successful career in politics, by any chance?

The statement that V12s are "luxurious grand tourers" and V8s are "lightweight nimble sports cars" is disingenuous at best, and at odds with "the only thing I'd want from it is a few hundred pounds of weight loss", and "the V12V offers nothing more than the V8V except the ability to say 'it's a V12' when someone asks". In fact, both cars are on the lardy side, certainly the V8 compared to contemporaries such as the 997 or Corvette. Curb weights of the 4.3L and 4.7L V8, V12 and V12S are all over 1600 kg and are remarkably close no matter what the engine: depending on which source you look at, all are within 50 kg of each other.

OK. Getting a little heated here :-)

Having driven multiple V8 Vantage flavors, multiple V12 Vantage flavors, tracked a V8, tracked multiple V12s, owned a V8 Vantage, now own a V12VS 7-speed dogleg, and having even driven a Vantage GT4 in anger... I can tell you they are all amazing cars and the differences between them are WAY fewer than the similarities.

Yes. V8 is lighter than V12. On track balance for V8 is more neutral and COM is a bit more forward in V12. Driving style needs to be adjusted just a little to get the most out of each car. But I would say if you are looking for a lightweight car or a real track day car... you should not buy a Vantage. Even the stripped out Vantage GT4 race car was heavy.

Doesn't mean it isn't fun though. Once you get used to the sight lines, the driving position so far back and the way the car pivots around its center, you could jump into ANY Vantage and immediately have a blast. Super forgivable, uses its tires well, solid chassis, glorious noise... just liked to be man-handled and instilled a ton of confidence. What was amazing was jumping out of a road car and into the GT4 and while everything was ratcheted up another couple of notches it felt like home. But it will never be a lightweight, nimble car that feels like it is up on its toes.

But those qualities translate so well to the road, I think it is one of the best road cars ever made. Special, beautiful, sonorous, elegant, and brutal when asked. Whether you like Sportshift or a Manual, V8 or V12 - it is an argument over the 10% that is different. Its like arguing between Petrus or Screaming Eagle (one may be more expensive but ultimately it comes down to your taste preference). It is a great car in any spec and if you have one "congrats", if not the entry price for an early V8 Vantage is a steal (and may be headed lower given current events).

I might be a little giddy because I just got back from a drive in my car. I replaced my original V8 Vantage with a Ferrari 430 Scuderia and have owned many special cars since. The Ferrari performance was a huge step up but I missed my Vantage. In fact, the Vantage is the only car I have missed after selling it... hence I bought a special one to keep forever.

^ Excellent post. But for clarification, I didn't buy my Vantage to be a track-only toy to run the fastest possible lap times (as you said, that'd be silly and people who want that should buy a Porsche)--but I did buy it to spend a decent amount of time on the track so the handling characteristics weighed heavily on my decision. Once I realized the V8V had plenty of acceleration for fun on the streets, I saw no reason to spend $20k+ more for more power that I'd almost never get to use.

Sounds like you're a little bit upset about what I said. Why are you taking it so personally? lol I will forever correct anybody who suggests that the only reason anybody would buy a V8V is if you can't afford a V12V... if that offends you, then I'm sorry, I guess. hilarious

The fact that the V8V isn't that lightweight is precisely why I wouldn't go about adding 100++ lbs to it. (Why is it always the V12V owners minimizing the extra weight? Weight matters. lol) I'd love to get my GT on a scale followed immediately by a V12V. I'll bet the difference is larger than the published figures not only because of the engine but because of all the extra bells and whistles that I didn't want in my car (you don't need 13 speakers in a Vantage, and not having that stuff is why I went with a GT instead of an S). But that also ignores where the weight is--my dry-sump V8 sits lower than your wet-sump V12, meaning the extra weight of the V12 is shifting the car's center of gravity both forward and up--neither of which are desirable for handling. And as I've said a few times, that matters to me (and some others, I'm sure).

I'm glad you're happy with your V12. I actually hope every Aston owners is happy with their cars, and I feel bad when people are having bad experiences because ownership for me has been fantastic. For me, my car sounds amazing, is able to accelerate beyond the grip of the PS4S tires I have on it even with its lowly V8, and handles wonderfully--I therefore don't actually desire a V12.

A V12 Vantage will be faster around any track than a V8 in the hands of a good driver. I'm talking stock for stock - you can make either one of them handle better or have more horsepower. You can tell me a v8 might be easier to drive, but it isn't going to be faster. Rotors on the v12 can be changed if you don't want the carbon ceramic so I call that a wash. I submit that "A well-specced V8V with sport pack suspension and a few very easy mods will be the superior car on the track" is a matter of opinion and not fact for the semantically challenged.

Hoods scoops and looks are objective so if you would buy a v8 because of how the v12 hood looks then ok. If you like the sound of the v8 better than the v12 then ok. Though I think (should I put "in my opinion" here so as to not offend) most people would go for the v12 sound.

I'm not going to quote the whole "In terms of value money spent" paragraph, but I said if money was not an issue so I'm ignoring that for this argument. Ironically, I do agree that the v8 is probably a better value.

I didn't realize I needed to put "in my opinion" before every sentence to make people feel better. I said I would have bought the v12 if I could. I never said all people would buy v12s. That was inferred by people who seem to have a complex about other people thinking the v12 is better. I love my v8 (as I said previously which seemed to be ignored) and aren't in the least bit concerned I couldn't afford a v12. However, if I could afford the extra $35K difference for a v12 when I was looking for a car I most certainly would have gotten a v12. In my opinion (make you feel better?) a lot of other people would as well.

And as someone said, if you're using a Vantage to go on track you may want to consider other cars. I would suggest getting a dedicated track car. These days you can get cars just as fast as a Vantage for cheap. That way if you ball it up it doesn't matter. I personally race with SCCA for my track fix. I guarantee you my little 240SX will out handle any street legal Vantage, except maybe the GT4. Of course, it's got Ohlins coilovers, spherical bearings for all suspension bushings, custom camber mounts, etc. Acceleration is another matter, but you don't have to go 150 to have fun.

So take deep breaths and go out for a drive in whatever car is in your garage.

V12 consumes too much gas!! :cool:

Get the V12 and never suffer from what if syndrome.

• V12 is more rare
• V12 sounds better
• V12 is a special engine
• V12 has a lot more pucker factor when you mash the peddle

The V8 is a great car, I owned 2 of them, but if you are looking at the V12, there is really no comparison. The only reason I didn't get a V12 was I bought a F430 Scud and by the time I was on the market the V12VS was SS only and I really wanted a manual. I'm also now looking at buying the V12VS but am waiting for the prices to drop from the recession we're in now. I'll most likely purchase around mid to late summer.

The prices have really come down. Here is a 2016 GTS for $80k

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...ff=share_other

That is a nice one. Wonder if it has any issues, and ultimately what will trade for?

Cheers

Matt

V12's don't seem to be much more expensive. Personally, I couldn't suffer the automated transmission.

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...3397/overview/

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...6728/overview/

The Carfax looks clean on that GTS.

I agree, for me, I had to get a manual and that was my requirement.

Now that I have been itching for a convertible, the F430 spiders look attractive. But I don’t think I could drive the F1 with paddle shifters. Manuals cost much more.