I'm sorry... I must have missed those facts... could you provide links or point me in the right direction?

Thanks
-dr_sharp

p.s. I did not mean to sound snide

 

The 599 is a two seater.

 

There have been numerous magazines that have tested the Carrera GT vs Enzo on the track with the GT always being quicker. I will see if I can find some links for you. The GT is also faster on the Nurburgring (sp?)

Actually I don't see the Enzo on the list maybe no one has run it but the GT is faster than anything but race cars and single purpose things like the Arial Atom.

 

Using the search function, I found this...

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...t=enzo+carrera

 

There is a new list kicking around. The current fastest time for the Carrera GT is 7:28 which is the current record for a factory street car. The new Zonda F is right behind it at 7:29.
Enzo 'Ring times are as elusive as finding dyno numbers for them. I wonder what the big secret is and why people have gone out of their way to keep that information under wraps.

 

The 7:28 'Ring time for the CGT was set by Walter Röhrl back in 2004 using a company test car. The time was reported by Autobild but no mention was made of the methodology (timing gear, etc.) or whether the car's in full production spec.

Definitive time (all set by Sportauto's von Saurma) has the Carrera GT at 7:32.44. The Zonda F is a bit slower at 7:33 while the Koenigsegg CCR is at 7:34. Overall score favored the Zonda F though, with Sportauto giving it a perfect 70/70. The CGT and the Koenigsegg CCR have the same score: 68/70.

Hockenheim:
CGT - 1:08.6
Koenigsegg CCR - 1:09.8
Zonda F - 1:10.8

According to Sportauto, the Zonda F was set up more for high speed performance and at a relatively slow track like Hockenheim, its handling was a bit compromised with the rear end tending to come loose on slow corners. I guess this shows how good Porsche engineers are at chassis and suspension tuning.

36 meter slalom:
Koenigsegg CCR - 138km/h
Zonda F - 137km/h
CGT - 135km/h

110 meter evasion test:
Zonda F - 159km/h
Koenigsegg CCR - 158km/h
CGT - 157km/h

Skidpad:
Zonda F - 1.4G
CGT - 1.35G
Koenigsegg CCR - 1.35G

I reckon the Zonda F Clubsport will be much faster still. Lighter and even more powerful. If I were given the opportunity, I'd pick the Zonda F Clubsport over the CGT. Bespoke build quality and exclusivity with performance equal or greater than what the established supercar heavyweights (with all their engineering and R&D might) can come up with. IMHO, Horacio Pagani's genius is right up there with Gordon Murray's.

As for the Enzo, Ferrari hasn't made any serious attempt at setting any sort of definitive time with it at the 'Ring (it does seem like Ferrari's making a conscious effort not to put out any official 'Ring times for its cars, unlike Porsche, Pagani, Koenigsegg and the likes). Same applies to Enzo owners, not one full-bore attempt yet, and with good reason. You'd have to be a very good driver driving a very fast car to get below 8:00. And you'd have to be a really brave and really excellent driver driving a super fast car to get a time below 7:40.

All reports I've seen has the Enzo being faster than the CGT on the streets and on the straights, but with the CGT handling better at the limit and having much better steering feel which may account for it having better track times than the Enzo.

What I'd really like to see is a definitive 'Ring time for the Bugatti Veyron. EVO demonstrated that not only is it much faster than the Enzo, CGT and Zonda S on the straights (as expected) but that it's also faster than all three on the twisties. Nowhere near as good a driver's car as the CGT or the Zonda (per EVO) but it is an engineering coup, with real-world performance to match.

 

Awesome, thanks for the info. The Club Sport Zonda sounds like it may be the overall car to beat for performance. Unfortunately, ownership of a Zonda in the US is not very realistic yet. I believe there are still no dealers and Koenigsegg only has one in Nevada. From a merely personal viewpoint, the Zonda styling does not appeal to me as much as other cars and I find the interior to be quite guady, though I imagine the Club Sport has most of that nonsense removed from it.
The Veyron is fast to say the least, but at over 4,000lbs I don't think it will be besting the handling of the other cars mentioned without its power being a major factor in making up time.

 

What i been wanting to see for years now is CGT vs LP640.

+1. Unfair battle, but the Ferrari still held its own.

 

I agree that the reason we don't see any Enzos on the Nurburgring list is because it would take a phenonminal driver to challenge the CGTs time. I'm not going to argue for the Enzo on the track. I would argue that in a straight line the Enzo would prevail. Take a close look at the second race with the 599 and CGT. The CGT edged it out by just a few carlengths. Now consider the Enzo, a car 500lbs lighter with slightly more hp than the 599. I don't think it is too far fetched to conclude that the Enzo would win. In a straight line, there is no contest the Enzo would prevail. On a track, all bets are off

 

i think you guys are also forgeting that the CGT is a stick shift with a brutal clutch
the 599/shmenzo has launch control etc etc
0 to 60 in NOT a fair comparision
i would like to see a 60-130 time for the CGT and shmenzo

 

isnt the carrera gt more of a race car and the ferrari 599 more of a sports tourer? race a carrera gt vs a enzo or something

 

which ferrari *** neg repped me LOL

 

According to AMS:

0-100km/h
Veyron - 2.5s (2006 test)
Lambo LP640 - 3.4s (2006 test)
599 GTB Fiorano - 3.5s (2006 test)
Enzo - 3.6s (2005 test)
CGT - 3.8s (2005 test)

0-200km/h
Veyron - 7.4s
Enzo - 10.3s
599 GTB Fiorano - 10.3s
CGT - 10.7s
Lambo LP640 - 11.2s

0-300km/h
Veyron - 18.2s
Enzo - 26.1s
599 GTB Fiorano - 29.9s
Lambo LP640 - 31.8s
CGT - 34.2s

Top speed
Veyron - 402km/h
Enzo - 355km/h
Lambo LP640 - 340km/h
599 GTB Fiorano - 335km/h
CGT - 334km/h

60-130mph time for the Enzo is around 7s, around 7.3s for the CGT. Beyond 130mph, the Enzo is definitely faster than the CGT.

The 599 and the LP640 have pretty impressive performance (considering their weight) although all indications are that the CGT is a much better car at the tracks.

 

Sportauto Supertest numbers for the LP640 added for comparision (the LP640 was on Pirelli P Zero Corsa R-compound tires):

'Ring:
CGT - 7:32.44
Zonda F - 7:33
Koenigsegg CCR - 7:34
LP640 - 7:47

Sportauto: The LP640 could have been faster if not for its tendency to understeer. Brakes are said to be perfect, didn't fade during the test.

Hockenheim:
CGT - 1:08.6
Koenigsegg CCR - 1:09.8
Zonda F - 1:10.8
LP640 - 1:11.8

Sportauto: Despite its weight and abundant power, handling is excellent and safe even for inexperienced drivers. Lost a bit of time due to understeer. Excellent traction due to AWD.

36 meter slalom:
Koenigsegg CCR - 138km/h
Zonda F - 137km/h
CGT - 135km/h
LP640 - 134km/h (same time as the 996 GT3 RS!)

IMHO, 1km/h off the CGT is excellent given the LP640's weight. I'm liking the LP640 more and more. Record holder is the 997 GT3 with 141km/h!

110 meter evasion test:
Zonda F - 159km/h
Koenigsegg CCR - 158km/h
CGT - 157km/h
LP640 - 153km/h

Skidpad:
Zonda F - 1.4G
CGT - 1.35G
Koenigsegg CCR - 1.35G
LP640 - 1.3G

Wet handling test:
LP640 - 1:29.2
Koenigsegg CCR - 1:33.5
Zonda F - 1:34.2
CGT - (not tested, the wet handling test was added a few months after the CGT Supertest was made)

Spectacular showing for the LP640 considering that it's on R-compounds. AWD does help. Record holder is the 997 GT3 with 1:27.2. Audi RS4 is second at 1:27.5!

The LP640 is faster than the CGT on the straights, and puts out solid numbers elsewhere. Kudos to Lamborghini.

 

I'm not really into this rep thingy but it boggles my mind why someone would neg rep me for anything I've posted in this thread. No comments, didn't even leave his name. So weird it's almost funny.