Intercooler upgrade

[tclayj]

I currently have an APR tune and am looking to upgrade my exhaust and intercoolers. I would appreciate any feedback/suggestions regarding ones personal experience in this matter and what I should anticipate from these changes. Thanx.

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[Mike/A.W.E.]

Originally Posted by tclayj

I currently have an APR tune and am looking to upgrade my exhaust and intercoolers. I would appreciate any feedback/suggestions regarding ones personal experience in this matter and what I should anticipate from these changes. Thanx.

tclayj,

Bravo for considering intercooling as well. We don't know why these are so often overlooked.

Porsche's OE Intercoolers are decent, but once you start modifying the car, your IAT's by nature will go up and better cooling is paramount.

We have full time ME's on staff that have done extensive R&D on an intercooler that not only fits as it should, but will provide better performance without a massive pressure drop due to incorrect core or end tank design.

Our bar and plate cores are welded in house to a cast end tank with an embossed A.W.E. Tuning logo. They are 37% larger and resulted in improved intake temperatures by a massive 55F and an improved drop pressure resistance through the core by 1 psi. Please do your homework and see if any of our competitors have this same data.

Other highlights include:

-Thick silicone boost hoses with proper profile where they mate to turbo
- Choice of Black, Blue, or Red hoses
- T-bolt clamps for extreme clamping force
- Direct plug and play install that is easily reversible
- +16 crank hp dyno verified

Please visit our web site for more detail:
http://awe-tuning.com/pages/shared/p...ttintercoolers

Just a few pictures of our work.










Excerpts from our data testing:

Data was collected on our Mustang MD-AWD-500-SE AWD dynamometer, on the street, and on various race tracks, using dual Omega DPi temperature meters outputting to the dyno's integrated data acquisition, and via a portable lab grade datalogger. Several runs were made recording temperatures and pressures before and after the stock and AWE Tuning intercooler assemblies and then averaged, with graphs of the changes shown below. All tests were done on our in house 2007 997TT with a prototype 700S turbo kit installed. 93 octane fuel was used for all tests.

Below: Temperature drop is the measurement of how much heat the intercooler is able to remove from the intake air. The higher the temperature drop, the denser the air charge, resulting in more power and less tendency for detonation in the cylinders. Our design was able to hold intake air temperatures to a maximum of just 20F higher than the start of the run vs a 65F climb with the stock intercoolers.



Below: Large intercoolers can do well in reducing intake air temperatures, but they can also introduce a lot of restriction to the intake air. That restriction will result in power loss even with the improved temps. Too much intake flow restriction means the turbo cannot deliver as much boost to the engine. Bigger is not always better with intercoolers. Our design excells in temperature drops and also in how pressure restriction is minimized to levels 1 psi less than the stock configuration.



Final dyno testing:





Please email me directly if you have further questions.

Mike@AWE-Tuning.com

[raclaims]

Nicely written Mike!

I have to stop going on these sites...really...

[Mike/A.W.E.]

Originally Posted by raclaims

Nicely written Mike!

I have to stop going on these sites...really...

Thank you.

We focus not just on the reselling of parts, but the manufacturing of them as well. We feel this gives us a competitive edge and it also allows us to make such comprehensive posts like the one above.

We have 25 full time staff members with most working in Engineering and Fabrication. We are very proud of that fact.

We are just off the PA Turnpike and 20 minutes from the New Jersey border. If anyone is ever in the area, please stop by for a tour.

[cannga]

During my car's tuning session at GIAC the intercooler is the single most often mentioned component by GIAC engineers.

I can't remember how many times I was told I should have mine upgraded as the next step of improvement.

[04GT3RS]

"improved intake temperatures by a massive 55F" Quote
Curious of what Manifold pressure were you running. What is the discharge temp of turbo prior to intercooler. What is the Inlet temp to engine. What delta were you seeing with the factory intercoolers. I like to see more than what you are offering for data, still great but it is for sales, i like the engineering data. What is the delta P before and after? Don't get me wrong and misunderstand my message. These are the things that before I buy I want to know as a reseller or we would make things ourselves, which a lot of times is what we do, since we find that a lot of things offered are smoke and mirrors, not implying that thses intercoolers are but you get my point.

[Mike/A.W.E.]

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

"improved intake temperatures by a massive 55F" Quote
Curious of what Manifold pressure were you running.

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

What is the discharge temp of turbo prior to intercooler.

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

What is the Inlet temp to engine.

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

What delta were you seeing with the factory intercoolers.

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

I like to see more than what you are offering for data, still great but it is for sales, i like the engineering data. What is the delta P before and after?.

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

Don't get me wrong and misunderstand my message. These are the things that before I buy I want to know as a reseller or we would make things ourselves, which a lot of times is what we do, since we find that a lot of things offered are smoke and mirrors, not implying that thses intercoolers are but you get my point.

No misunderstanding at all. We like to be questioned about our products and methods. It gives us the chance to show what steps we take and how we are not just rebadging something brought in from China...

Some of your questions are answered with the graphs above, but I have more info coming. Here are a few other graphs that will answer your additional questions.

Stock IC's.


AWE IC's.


Stay tuned, and thank you for asking!

[Mike/A.W.E.]

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

What is the discharge temp of turbo prior to intercooler.

Peak compressor outlet temperature was ~300 deg F during dyno testing of the 750R kit.

[combo3010]

anybody familiar with the switzer MONSTER intercooler? it sure looks HUGE! wonder how it compares with other competitors.
http://www.switzerperformanceinnovat...97tt_pkgs.html

[Shotcaller]

Originally Posted by tclayj

I currently have an APR tune and am looking to upgrade my exhaust and intercoolers. I would appreciate any feedback/suggestions regarding ones personal experience in this matter and what I should anticipate from these changes. Thanx.

AWE works awesome in stock vtg's and upgraded vtg's

[04GT3RS]

Mike

Thanks for posting the data regarding my questions. As you know a lot of folks do not provide enough or any at all, and you know that i want to know everything. Thanks again and keep up the good work. Also think about the Cayenne!!

[Mike/A.W.E.]

Originally Posted by 04GT3RS

Mike

Thanks for posting the data regarding my questions. As you know a lot of folks do not provide enough or any at all, and you know that i want to know everything. Thanks again and keep up the good work. Also think about the Cayenne!!

My pleasure. If there is anything else you need, just say the word.

[cannga]

Thanks for the very interesting posts.

I read your explanation that the increased dyno power comes from the denser air charge.

I have a question about IAT please:

1. What happens when IAT becomes "too high"? Does the ECU "react" by pulling timing, or reducing boost?

2. In other words, is the advantage of the AWE intercooler related ONLY to a denser air charge? And not better timing & boost? (I saw in the one example you posted, that boost levels seem to be the same between stock and AWE intercoolers?)

Thanks again for the educational posts.

[freeman]

intercooler upgarde is always a safe upgrade for any chipped turbo,even for stage I power level.

If you drive your car hard or on a race track, a more effecient intercooler is a must-have.It won't hurt to install one earlier if you ever plan to have more power later. It will make your tune safer and stronger.

There will be slight pressure drop for a much bigger IC which is expected. You can correct it by a simple retune.

I guess that
denser air = cooler air @ the same elevation.
IAT too high = lose of power

[Mike/A.W.E.]

Originally Posted by cannga

2. In other words, is the advantage of the AWE intercooler related ONLY to a denser air charge? And not better timing & boost? (I saw in the one example you posted, that boost levels seem to be the same between stock and AWE intercoolers?)

Thanks again for the educational posts.

Regardless if it is stock or a properly written aftermarket tune, the timing will retard if the IAT's get too high. Boost can be pulled, but that would be rare. Boost will not go up due to lower IAT's either.

So the coolest most dense air is the ideal scenario. That will keep the ECU in check and make sure you have the maximum amount of power on tap.

Hope that helps...