Not sure about sport Chrono
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It appears as though there is not a thorough understanding of what the engine mounts do. A race car has none as the engine is bolted solid to the frame so there's no movement of the drivetrain to upset the chassis. In a normal car this is not a big issue, however in the 911 a substantial amount of weight is outside the wheel base.
As the car rotates, even at a moderate speed, the movement of the weight will continue to move after the rotation has ended casing the rotation to want to continue. This upsets the chassis. It doesn't happen with the race car as the engine is bolted solid.
In a street car they use elastamer mount to isolate engine vibration but this allows the engine to move. In the 911 the engine can move about 2 inches with standard mounts and amount to a feeling similar to pulling a trailer; depending on weight transfer and force of the turn. With the active mounts they work like regular mounts until called upon in a turn and limit the movement to about 1/2 of an inch thus it the car is more stable and reactive. If you are like a lot of drivers that don't take there cars past about 50% of there capability then it is no big deal, but for someone like me; I would not buy a 911 without it.
I do not drive on the track, but drive mostly in the mountains on twisty roads and tend to drive at about 60% to 70% in the turns. At this level you can feel all the movements of the car as the weight transfers.
As the car rotates, even at a moderate speed, the movement of the weight will continue to move after the rotation has ended casing the rotation to want to continue. This upsets the chassis. It doesn't happen with the race car as the engine is bolted solid.
In a street car they use elastamer mount to isolate engine vibration but this allows the engine to move. In the 911 the engine can move about 2 inches with standard mounts and amount to a feeling similar to pulling a trailer; depending on weight transfer and force of the turn. With the active mounts they work like regular mounts until called upon in a turn and limit the movement to about 1/2 of an inch thus it the car is more stable and reactive. If you are like a lot of drivers that don't take there cars past about 50% of there capability then it is no big deal, but for someone like me; I would not buy a 911 without it.
I do not drive on the track, but drive mostly in the mountains on twisty roads and tend to drive at about 60% to 70% in the turns. At this level you can feel all the movements of the car as the weight transfers.
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Wow, thx for a great explanation. A further question...can anyone weigh in on the importance of Dynamic Chassis Control on 991 with PDK and Sport Chrono. It is equally useful and relevant?
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The 7 MT with SC is the way to go. While I understand that the PDK may be faster than the MT, as the owner of a prior dual-clutch car, its just not as much fun to drive IMHO. Sure, if you're a professional racer where winning means dollars, PDK may be the way to go. But, for a daily driver and track car for fun, a MT cannot be beat IMHO.
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While all these explanations are great (and correct), it still does not really address whether an individual actually needs these options or if it will truly be wasted money.
I'm willing to bet that if Porsche listed "Firm kick in the A$$ with a big boot @ $1,000" in the performance section of the configurator,.....a good majority of people would select it just because it was there.
Look at it like this, when the Cayman S first came out in 2006 (I bought one) a fully loaded model with PASM, PCCB, SC, 19" wheels ran Nurburgring in 8:16 while a bare bones version sans all of them did it in 8:25. So :09 difference with every performance option compared with none. Roughly about a .01% improvement for $12k worth of options. On the street it would equate to nothing. BTW, one of the fastest times reported for a 997.2 was with a stick, so if you think you are gaining much street performance with a PDK, it might not be much if any.
Buy what you actually need for your type of driving, but don't make Porsche an even more profitable car company by buying something you will never come close to using.
I'm willing to bet that if Porsche listed "Firm kick in the A$$ with a big boot @ $1,000" in the performance section of the configurator,.....a good majority of people would select it just because it was there.
Look at it like this, when the Cayman S first came out in 2006 (I bought one) a fully loaded model with PASM, PCCB, SC, 19" wheels ran Nurburgring in 8:16 while a bare bones version sans all of them did it in 8:25. So :09 difference with every performance option compared with none. Roughly about a .01% improvement for $12k worth of options. On the street it would equate to nothing. BTW, one of the fastest times reported for a 997.2 was with a stick, so if you think you are gaining much street performance with a PDK, it might not be much if any.
Buy what you actually need for your type of driving, but don't make Porsche an even more profitable car company by buying something you will never come close to using.
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I have a .2S with PDK and SC. I use the Sport buton every day, but have never used Sports + or launch control. My understanding is the 991 comes with a sport mode standard. If that is the case, I will consider not ordering SC on my new 911. On an earlier reply, the exhaust sound is mentioned. I don't believe SC affects that at all. That's where PSE comes in. My only reserve is if you don't get SC on your initial build, it isn't going to happen. Tough decision.
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Agreed. I have an MT and didn't see any need for it (certainly nothing worth justifying the $). And I don't like the wart.
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I guess the issue is that the Porsche advertising and marketing people are as good at their job as engineering and production are at theirs. SC and PDCC are promoted as great technology even for the non racetrack driver, and they hook me. I think my tendency is to buy into the hype for SC with pdk, still not sold on PDCC and would like anyone else's take on it.
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I agree with all the arguments on both sides but it really does make sense to me to error on the side of caution when it comes to re-sale. When you are spending north of 6 figures on a car you want to make sure it holds its value. Think of the 2k a bit of extra insurance. Plus you can't go wrong with the extra technology that accompanies the SC. I have MT and still went with the SC despite the real advantage of SC being equipped with PDK. Thats my two cents congrats on the purchase!
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ChuckJ
PS Sorry for getting emotional
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While all these explanations are great (and correct), it still does not really address whether an individual actually needs these options or if it will truly be wasted money.
I'm willing to bet that if Porsche listed "Firm kick in the A$$ with a big boot @ $1,000" in the performance section of the configurator,.....a good majority of people would select it just because it was there.
Look at it like this, when the Cayman S first came out in 2006 (I bought one) a fully loaded model with PASM, PCCB, SC, 19" wheels ran Nurburgring in 8:16 while a bare bones version sans all of them did it in 8:25. So :09 difference with every performance option compared with none. Roughly about a .01% improvement for $12k worth of options. On the street it would equate to nothing. BTW, one of the fastest times reported for a 997.2 was with a stick, so if you think you are gaining much street performance with a PDK, it might not be much if any.
Buy what you actually need for your type of driving, but don't make Porsche an even more profitable car company by buying something you will never come close to using.
I'm willing to bet that if Porsche listed "Firm kick in the A$$ with a big boot @ $1,000" in the performance section of the configurator,.....a good majority of people would select it just because it was there.
Look at it like this, when the Cayman S first came out in 2006 (I bought one) a fully loaded model with PASM, PCCB, SC, 19" wheels ran Nurburgring in 8:16 while a bare bones version sans all of them did it in 8:25. So :09 difference with every performance option compared with none. Roughly about a .01% improvement for $12k worth of options. On the street it would equate to nothing. BTW, one of the fastest times reported for a 997.2 was with a stick, so if you think you are gaining much street performance with a PDK, it might not be much if any.
Buy what you actually need for your type of driving, but don't make Porsche an even more profitable car company by buying something you will never come close to using.
MT is great except when you are in traffic and as a DD, I assume you will have traffic. Sports plus is fantastic, but if you aren't on a track, it is unlikely to be used after you try it a few times after break in and you will use launch control once. Some like PSE, but it is just noise, no performance gain, so no reason to discuss need here. PDCC is one of the few things that I think is a need. 911s have always fought the physics of a rear engine. Tap the breaks and the weight moves forward and off of the drive wheels. Momentum now kicks in and you can find yourself headlight to headlight with the guy who was behind you. Every generation has gotten better, but the PDCC is a big help with this in a curve by forcing the contact surfaces of the tires to remain in maximum contact with the road. For a DD, you will be feeling your oats one day, or be running late and need to make up time, and you have this hot car, and you are not thinking and take that curve just a bit too aggressively and PDCC will save your a$$ - assumiming you did not pay for the optional a$$ kicking (great point by the way!)
You have it right. How you drive should rule. JMO. And all of that said, I bought almost everything, except PSE. But then, I love a good a$$ kicking!
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The main advantage of dual clutch is rapid shifts. To maximise this SC is an advantage. IMO its an advantage if you like to drive in a spirited manner. With respect if you dont plan to drive in a spirited manner perhaps another type of vehicle would suffice. Perhaps I can put it this way....PDK without SC is like a vodka Martini without the vodka.
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It appears as though there is not a thorough understanding of what the engine mounts do. A race car has none as the engine is bolted solid to the frame so there's no movement of the drivetrain to upset the chassis. In a normal car this is not a big issue, however in the 911 a substantial amount of weight is outside the wheel base.
As the car rotates, even at a moderate speed, the movement of the weight will continue to move after the rotation has ended casing the rotation to want to continue. This upsets the chassis. It doesn't happen with the race car as the engine is bolted solid.
In a street car they use elastamer mount to isolate engine vibration but this allows the engine to move. In the 911 the engine can move about 2 inches with standard mounts and amount to a feeling similar to pulling a trailer; depending on weight transfer and force of the turn. With the active mounts they work like regular mounts until called upon in a turn and limit the movement to about 1/2 of an inch thus it the car is more stable and reactive. If you are like a lot of drivers that don't take there cars past about 50% of there capability then it is no big deal, but for someone like me; I would not buy a 911 without it.
I do not drive on the track, but drive mostly in the mountains on twisty roads and tend to drive at about 60% to 70% in the turns. At this level you can feel all the movements of the car as the weight transfers.
As the car rotates, even at a moderate speed, the movement of the weight will continue to move after the rotation has ended casing the rotation to want to continue. This upsets the chassis. It doesn't happen with the race car as the engine is bolted solid.
In a street car they use elastamer mount to isolate engine vibration but this allows the engine to move. In the 911 the engine can move about 2 inches with standard mounts and amount to a feeling similar to pulling a trailer; depending on weight transfer and force of the turn. With the active mounts they work like regular mounts until called upon in a turn and limit the movement to about 1/2 of an inch thus it the car is more stable and reactive. If you are like a lot of drivers that don't take there cars past about 50% of there capability then it is no big deal, but for someone like me; I would not buy a 911 without it.
I do not drive on the track, but drive mostly in the mountains on twisty roads and tend to drive at about 60% to 70% in the turns. At this level you can feel all the movements of the car as the weight transfers.
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I tend to agree, but, taken to its extreme, do we need a Porsche? A, and it hurts to say this, Honda, will get you from place to place.
MT is great except when you are in traffic and as a DD, I assume you will have traffic. Sports plus is fantastic, but if you aren't on a track, it is unlikely to be used after you try it a few times after break in and you will use launch control once. Some like PSE, but it is just noise, no performance gain, so no reason to discuss need here. PDCC is one of the few things that I think is a need. 911s have always fought the physics of a rear engine. Tap the breaks and the weight moves forward and off of the drive wheels. Momentum now kicks in and you can find yourself headlight to headlight with the guy who was behind you. Every generation has gotten better, but the PDCC is a big help with this in a curve by forcing the contact surfaces of the tires to remain in maximum contact with the road. For a DD, you will be feeling your oats one day, or be running late and need to make up time, and you have this hot car, and you are not thinking and take that curve just a bit too aggressively and PDCC will save your a$$ - assumiming you did not pay for the optional a$$ kicking (great point by the way!)
You have it right. How you drive should rule. JMO. And all of that said, I bought almost everything, except PSE. But then, I love a good a$$ kicking!
MT is great except when you are in traffic and as a DD, I assume you will have traffic. Sports plus is fantastic, but if you aren't on a track, it is unlikely to be used after you try it a few times after break in and you will use launch control once. Some like PSE, but it is just noise, no performance gain, so no reason to discuss need here. PDCC is one of the few things that I think is a need. 911s have always fought the physics of a rear engine. Tap the breaks and the weight moves forward and off of the drive wheels. Momentum now kicks in and you can find yourself headlight to headlight with the guy who was behind you. Every generation has gotten better, but the PDCC is a big help with this in a curve by forcing the contact surfaces of the tires to remain in maximum contact with the road. For a DD, you will be feeling your oats one day, or be running late and need to make up time, and you have this hot car, and you are not thinking and take that curve just a bit too aggressively and PDCC will save your a$$ - assumiming you did not pay for the optional a$$ kicking (great point by the way!)
You have it right. How you drive should rule. JMO. And all of that said, I bought almost everything, except PSE. But then, I love a good a$$ kicking!
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I used a 7 speed dual-clutch tranny car for my 42mile round trip, DD commute, for 2.5 years/39k miles in Atlanta traffic. I missed a MT and regretted not getting one almost immediately. An auto-box like DSC, F1 or PDK are fine for race cars and sporty luxury cars, but for a sports car such as a 911, a three-pedal tranny is the way to go. If you can't easily drive and enjoy a MT in traffic, especially with the auto-hold like the 991, you need a Panamera or AMG, not a 911.
ChuckJ