Anyone have the X-Cellerator crossflow exhaust? Feedback please.
#61
Sean... problem I have is that Noise is now a Major issue in UK/Europe... they are so, so strict now, most tracks are 105db max, some are 102db, we are instantly turned away if we don't meet the requirements... I now that some of the US circuits are also now starting to take this very serious and I can see this effecting future sales for some of your guys (certain circuits)
I can live with resonance, cabin boom and even a not so nice sounding exhaust note... my priorities are Lightweight, 105db or under, max freeflow as possible. I have mentioned this to a few vendors now and have passed on how they sound test with noise meter at the circuits here in UK/Europe.
It will also give a good indication to 6speed members here how loud these units are... Example I run the Europipe Quiet and this comes in at 102db on meter and the Europipe is overall relatively quiet.
Circuits will have various ways of testing, Static Test and Driveby Test, Driveby is usually quieter, the Static is usually done with noise meter held between 75 cm and 100 cm away from tailpipe and at a 45 degree angle (so it's not direct in the flow vortex)... they ask what the cars Rev limit is, I just say 6500rpm and they ask me to take it to 4500rpm (usually 3/4 of it's limit) This is the test they run at a few of the circuits in UK.
I can live with resonance, cabin boom and even a not so nice sounding exhaust note... my priorities are Lightweight, 105db or under, max freeflow as possible. I have mentioned this to a few vendors now and have passed on how they sound test with noise meter at the circuits here in UK/Europe.
It will also give a good indication to 6speed members here how loud these units are... Example I run the Europipe Quiet and this comes in at 102db on meter and the Europipe is overall relatively quiet.
Circuits will have various ways of testing, Static Test and Driveby Test, Driveby is usually quieter, the Static is usually done with noise meter held between 75 cm and 100 cm away from tailpipe and at a 45 degree angle (so it's not direct in the flow vortex)... they ask what the cars Rev limit is, I just say 6500rpm and they ask me to take it to 4500rpm (usually 3/4 of it's limit) This is the test they run at a few of the circuits in UK.
Ironically, Texas is the last refuge of Scottish style freedom
#62
Jeez... I'm now waiting on Jimmer to posts another dodgy pic of me in my kilt , common the William Wallace
#63
Thanks, Mark.
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991.2 GT3 RS Weissach Racing Yellow
991.2 Turbo S GT Silver
991.2 GT3 Chalk (Manual)
2022 Cayenne White
former 1972 911T white, 1984 911 3.2 Targa black, 993 cab white, 993TT arena red, 993TT silver, 996TT speed yellow, 991.1 GT3 white
www.speedtechexhausts.com
info@speedtechexhausts.com
Testimonials facebook SpeedTech Exhaust Videos
#64
Man, Until Mark posted that link, I'd forgotten about all those suppliers overseas in Asia. about 8 years ago I made the mistake of thinking seriously about opening a tuner shop with storefront and warehouse to sell parts out of & mailorder/ Internet... My wife and I had been approved for the business, but I was scared, quite honestly. The market is so fickle that I just didn't want to risk everything, and I'd have had to give up my current career, which has since turned into a lucrative business for us.
Anyway, we got bombarded with solicitations once we put our names/address/phone out there. Everyone that made and sold a product wanted to add us to their wholesale distribution list and "can we set up an account for you?" was the norm...
If you do a search in Alibaba in the Auto category, then engine sub-category, then exhaust sub-category, and search on PORSCHE, you'll see lots of "stuff" sold by some of our very own vendors!
This is just to funny!
Mike
Anyway, we got bombarded with solicitations once we put our names/address/phone out there. Everyone that made and sold a product wanted to add us to their wholesale distribution list and "can we set up an account for you?" was the norm...
If you do a search in Alibaba in the Auto category, then engine sub-category, then exhaust sub-category, and search on PORSCHE, you'll see lots of "stuff" sold by some of our very own vendors!
This is just to funny!
Mike
#65
There are some differences between the four... some have 2 mufflers only.. some four... meanwhile others use 2.5, 2.75 or 3" OD piping.... not to mention some X designs are done internally covered by a muffler meanwhile others are done outside with 2 or mufflers... some are custom made mufflers with unique sound and the ability to control it as the mufflers are made meanwhile others use high quality mufflers ....
All though they are all some sort of X design there are differences when you look behind what goes into making them and what is used...
BTW, BBI does one too...
best
markski
All though they are all some sort of X design there are differences when you look behind what goes into making them and what is used...
BTW, BBI does one too...
best
markski
Thanks!
My particular unit per Tym was an early one he hand made, like #1 or #2 unit ever. Not sure what is in it as it is covered, but he told me no expense was spared on the quality of the cats, etc.
Had you been around, I'd have called you for a unit I suspect! I really thought Kevin's was awesome too...sorry to hear about the issues he feels he had with it.
For me, sound is important as the car for me is a "fun thing" not a "tool thing" on many, many levels. I love to get max power, don't get me wrong, but if it were silent it'd be worse even if that gave me 50 more hp.
Sorry to leave BBi off.
Jeff
#67
Man I thought Mark was kidding - he's not! http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?...ry=&ssk=y&sq=y I saw "alibaba" and thought it was a joke - nope! lol
CJV, I'll be very interested in what you guys have figured out and release for sure. I think it will be awhile before I have those worries but still!
CJV, I'll be very interested in what you guys have figured out and release for sure. I think it will be awhile before I have those worries but still!
If we are right, I'm sure the system will be made available ....... but not by myself. I am strictly doing this for the sport. I am sure other's who are in the business will pick it up and run with it.
#69
Thanks to all of you for your input on this difficult choice...
I have decided to go with:
Speedtech X-Cellerator 2 1/2" system, 100 cell cats, unpolished with ceramic coating and twin tips
EPL K24 Tune from Tony
Billet Diverter Valves
BMC Filter.
In a couple of months I will go to the 18G upgrade, clutch and a 5 bar FPR and that will be it.. No need for more power than that for the track...
Great input from everyone...
I have decided to go with:
Speedtech X-Cellerator 2 1/2" system, 100 cell cats, unpolished with ceramic coating and twin tips
EPL K24 Tune from Tony
Billet Diverter Valves
BMC Filter.
In a couple of months I will go to the 18G upgrade, clutch and a 5 bar FPR and that will be it.. No need for more power than that for the track...
Great input from everyone...
Last edited by 80shilling; 01-02-2010 at 02:22 PM.
#70
It probably is not as odd as you think. We have been doing a lot of research and have found the 997tt knock sensor to be far better than the 996tt sensor. Yes, we believe there is a problem with knock sensing with the 996tt. They are microphones which are not the best solution.
When you start changing things on the 996tt you are changing frequencies and widows that the knock system listens to. I am not saying this "is" an issue with the X, but it could be. I know increased boost, cams, increased bore size, etc. is an issue.
Have you ever bothered to ask why the 996tt bend rods and lifts heads at 800 hp and the 997 does not?
We are designing a system that allows for the adjustment of frequencies and windows to avoid just such an issue.
When you start changing things on the 996tt you are changing frequencies and widows that the knock system listens to. I am not saying this "is" an issue with the X, but it could be. I know increased boost, cams, increased bore size, etc. is an issue.
Have you ever bothered to ask why the 996tt bend rods and lifts heads at 800 hp and the 997 does not?
We are designing a system that allows for the adjustment of frequencies and windows to avoid just such an issue.
Last edited by dgreen78; 01-02-2010 at 04:44 PM.
#71
We have not gone down that route as we believe at some point the 997tt system will have it's own issues.
Our Link system will not use microphones. It will tap the cylinder pressure of each cylinder. The frequencies and windows will be adjustable. We will be able to monitor major as well as insipid detonation.
Last edited by cjv; 01-02-2010 at 05:54 PM.
#72
It could happen is as little as a week or it could take longer. It depends where we decide to stop or hit a real high wall. We are a lot farther along than is being posted. You may have noted in our build thread that I said the reports would now be coming out in time delay. https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...-post3176.html
Still playing with a lot of motor management changes and want to exhaust all areas of concern with the boost levels we have the ability to enter. This motor makes at 1.1 bar what the current monsters make at say 1.5 to 2 times more boost.
Our current issue isn't how much boost she can make ....... rather where to safely limit the boost so as to preclude the motor from coming apart in a lot of pieces. Our main concern is what the case can safely handle. Absolute control of detonation is critical. We have no doubt this motor has the potential spin the tires at 3500 rpm's in sixth gear.
Last edited by cjv; 01-02-2010 at 06:07 PM.
#73
I was under the impression that the 997 TT comes with a much more advanced air/fuel system (dual MAF, better fueling, etc..) as well as a stouter bottom end.. ? Couple that with a more advanced DME and you can see how that extra 100HP is better supported in the 997 platform.
The stock 996 Air/fuel system even with larger injectors is at the ragged edge of fuel delivery and air measurement by about 650-700 HP... hence the need for aftermarket MAF, Injectors, FPRs and fuel pumps at the least. is this not correct?
I'm curious to see how tunable and durable the 2010 TT will be with higher compression and 3.8 liters.
Getting a bit off topic, but VW is planning a below Boxster level P car and has vowed to start accelerating the slow progress of P cars in general. I hope this means 600HP cars aren't far away. At the current rate of 20-50 HP per generation we would have to wait for the 999 to see 600HP cars.
The stock 996 Air/fuel system even with larger injectors is at the ragged edge of fuel delivery and air measurement by about 650-700 HP... hence the need for aftermarket MAF, Injectors, FPRs and fuel pumps at the least. is this not correct?
I'm curious to see how tunable and durable the 2010 TT will be with higher compression and 3.8 liters.
Getting a bit off topic, but VW is planning a below Boxster level P car and has vowed to start accelerating the slow progress of P cars in general. I hope this means 600HP cars aren't far away. At the current rate of 20-50 HP per generation we would have to wait for the 999 to see 600HP cars.
There really isn't any difference on the bottom end. The heads as in direct injectors and the system from the throttle body to the heads is where the real difference lies.
If this conversation is to continue we need another thread as this is way OT. I apologize.
#74
Well I didn't believe in paying a lot for an exhaust as these Porsche prices were silly. Yes they are a lot of work without a JIG made as it is a pain to take it on and off if your doing a one piece exhaust. On the other hand, its not rocket science.
I bought a couple Borla straight through 3" inlet and outlet mufflers with I think a 5" round cylinder and probably 15" long. I got 2 of them. I also picked up 2x 180 deg 3" bends and I think 3x J bends as well (I forgot the exact number). Some O2 bungs as well.
I good tuner by my house has done a lot of custom work on my Supra and can weld with the best of them. Parts weren't expensive but what is a good welded/fabricator worth?
My guy hooks me up but I asked him if he could do a mass production (10 units) at under $1500 and he said without a doubt if he made a JIG.
He cut the Borla mufflers in length to fit the porsche and rewelded them back together, this could have been skipped but I bought them too long on accident originally. Welded the 180 deg bends on the 2 mufflers and then cut them, weld them into a X design such as Markski's design, etc...We only used 2 mufflers instead of the four that Markski used, and no cats.
Final result: Very quiet. In fact surprising quite at idle but when you rev on it, it gets nasty! Very little drone. I also used some ceramic high temp paint on the whole thing which may or may not have any effect on the sound. X design crossover is a must for our engines as it changes the sound to an acceptable sound.
Old Exhaust: AWE Straight pipes with no cats, they sounded insanely loud and since the 2 banks of cylinders didn't cancel each other out, it had so much drone.
What I learned: Its a lot of work without a JIG and considering it has to fit perfect in a 996tt, you better be good! I would say if I were doing this again. I'd be willing to pay a little more for a good exhaust such as Markski's which has all the characteristics of a great exhaust system and looks good quality. By doing this exhaust as a one time only project, the learning curve will be a bit steep and may be worth a little more for a prefab one but definitely not some of these crazy expensive ones.
I bought a couple Borla straight through 3" inlet and outlet mufflers with I think a 5" round cylinder and probably 15" long. I got 2 of them. I also picked up 2x 180 deg 3" bends and I think 3x J bends as well (I forgot the exact number). Some O2 bungs as well.
I good tuner by my house has done a lot of custom work on my Supra and can weld with the best of them. Parts weren't expensive but what is a good welded/fabricator worth?
My guy hooks me up but I asked him if he could do a mass production (10 units) at under $1500 and he said without a doubt if he made a JIG.
He cut the Borla mufflers in length to fit the porsche and rewelded them back together, this could have been skipped but I bought them too long on accident originally. Welded the 180 deg bends on the 2 mufflers and then cut them, weld them into a X design such as Markski's design, etc...We only used 2 mufflers instead of the four that Markski used, and no cats.
Final result: Very quiet. In fact surprising quite at idle but when you rev on it, it gets nasty! Very little drone. I also used some ceramic high temp paint on the whole thing which may or may not have any effect on the sound. X design crossover is a must for our engines as it changes the sound to an acceptable sound.
Old Exhaust: AWE Straight pipes with no cats, they sounded insanely loud and since the 2 banks of cylinders didn't cancel each other out, it had so much drone.
What I learned: Its a lot of work without a JIG and considering it has to fit perfect in a 996tt, you better be good! I would say if I were doing this again. I'd be willing to pay a little more for a good exhaust such as Markski's which has all the characteristics of a great exhaust system and looks good quality. By doing this exhaust as a one time only project, the learning curve will be a bit steep and may be worth a little more for a prefab one but definitely not some of these crazy expensive ones.
Last edited by LamboTT; 01-03-2010 at 10:29 AM.
#75
here you go...
this is my custom muffler design with Full 3 inch all the way.... no reducers near the tips.... this is on a car with big headers, external 44Tial WGs and my custom 30R type turbo( big). No cats either...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0x69KiDG3I
this is my custom muffler design with Full 3 inch all the way.... no reducers near the tips.... this is on a car with big headers, external 44Tial WGs and my custom 30R type turbo( big). No cats either...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0x69KiDG3I
__________________
2001 996TT 3.6L and stock ECU
9.66 seconds @ 147.76 mph 1/4 mile click to view
160 mph @ 9.77 seconds in 1/4 mile click to view
50% OFF ON PORSCHE ECU TUNING BLACK FRIDAY SPECIAL
2001 996TT 3.6L and stock ECU
9.66 seconds @ 147.76 mph 1/4 mile click to view
160 mph @ 9.77 seconds in 1/4 mile click to view
50% OFF ON PORSCHE ECU TUNING BLACK FRIDAY SPECIAL