996 Turbo / GT2 Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2005 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2.

Brief comparison between 991s and 996TT

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Old Feb 29, 2012 | 07:45 PM
  #16  
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Great review Aerodude. I haven't done the driving thing yet - but went to the introduction event here - and walked away loving my 996TT even more.

1. What is it with Porsche wheels? Lightweight - sure - but the designs always leave a lot to be desired. The 991 wheel choices are terrible. Ok - the 997TT were pretty good, the Twists too - but thats about it IMO.

2. Front view - looked "happy" to me. I hate cars that look happy. Give me mean.

3. Already said - Panamera interior. Not terrible - but not "ooooh!!!"

4. They had a bad color here in Nashville. Not gonna mention it - cause I don't want to hurt any feelings here. But it wasn't black, red, white, yellow or silver. And it was metallic. Shiver....
 
Old Feb 29, 2012 | 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Aerodude

I agree that the exhaust note was very nice when you opened up the throttle. In some ways, the car was almost too quiet cruising in 6th or 7th on the highway. But when you opened her up..... On a related note, I thought the salesman was telling me about some sort of sound enhancement button. I didn't really catch what he was saying, but it sounded like there was a feature to enhance the sound inside the cabin.
the combo of the ( it sounded "simulated" ) throttle matching when you blip to downshift, is very compelling. it's as if they've replicated the sensations and movements of the car in sound and in feel, from really heel toe matching,.. if not by function, but they exist only as a feature of the auditory and sensory input of driving it, that those of us who have driven these have come to expect over the years. is there a "sound enhancement" button?! ( it wouldn't surprise me to find, ) if it does exist it would also mimic the kind of "throaty" blip one gets when rev matching ( well, thats' automatic now too..) or downshifting.

in my short test, it was hard to differentiate between genuine engine performance cues, and those that felt "simulated" based upon whatever "mode" or driving condition the selectivity of the sport mode(s) on/off or simple "auto' drive mode would provide. if i had to try and sum up that rather disjointed summary, i'd say that the car has some serious multiple personality issues, by design, the majority of the newer Porsche customer might find desirable.

again, these are not the 911's many of us grew up driving years ago e.g 67 911s.

a simpler summation would have been to say: however nice it is. they're taking the "driving" out of the 911.
 

Last edited by '02996ttx50; Feb 29, 2012 at 08:06 PM.
Old Feb 29, 2012 | 09:37 PM
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I found a writeup on the sound enhancement feature in the 991 that the salesman was telling me about. It's called a "sound symposer" (see link). I'm not sure yet whether I like this concept or not -- seems a bit contrived. But it's certainly not as bad as piping in engine sound electronically through the audio system -- which could be where we're headed with future all-electric sports cars.

http://www.sae.org/mags/SVE/10374
 

Last edited by Aerodude; Feb 29, 2012 at 10:45 PM.
Old Feb 29, 2012 | 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Aerodude
I found a writeup on the sound enhancement feature in the 991 that the salesman was telling me about. It's called a "sound symposer" (see link). I'm not sure yet whether I like this concept or not -- seems a bit contrived. But it's certainly not as bad as piping in engine sound electronically through the audio system -- which could be where we're headed with future all electric sports cars.

http://www.sae.org/mags/SVE/10374
it's pretty close to what you've just described, as i read it. thanks for posting it, i find it fascinating. they've introduced elements into the design of the car that influence us and these are performance based sound events, that elicit genuine physical responses from the driver, but are in fact, psychologically suggested, eg increased "sound(s)" under certain driving conditions, the car "says" you're experiencing, hopefully resulting in more of the "sports car experience".

the following taken without attribution is from the article you cited:

At a recent technology workshop for the 2012 Carrera and Carrera S, Hatz and other Porsche engineers noted that creating a unique sound quality "between the engine and the tailpipe" has been a leading criterion for the 911 ever since the iconic sports car's 1963 debut. For the new Type 991 series (see http://www.sae.org/mags/aei/10167), the development team focused on “mechanical engine sounds characterized by high frequencies with tonal elements” together with low-frequency intake noises.

So significant is the 2012 car’s symphony as deemed by Porsche that the interplay between induction and exhaust was part of the car's design and engineering specification. Computer modeling mapping, as well as analysis of the configuration and dimensions of manifolds, pipework, catalytic converters, and mufflers, was carried out at the company’s Weissach Development Center.

The required sonic profile had to satisfy all possible operating states—from engine starting and idling (conveying power without disturbing the neighbors) to wide-open throttle on a racetrack. The goal was not only to deliver the aural “emotions” expected of a 911 but also to provide the driver with feedback about the car’s mechanical status while meeting Europe's 74 dB(A) drive-by noise requirements.

Electronically synthesized noise is not a Porsche solution, so the engineers developed a new Sound Symposer that is standard on both versions of the car. An acoustic channel picks up intake vibrations between the throttle valve and air filter and a membrane incorporated in the channel reinforces the vibrations and transmits them as an engine sound into the cabin. The system is driver activated or deactivated via a “Sport” button that controls a valve ahead of the membrane.

The result is a direct acoustic link between the cabin occupants and the engine, providing optimal transmission of the load-dependent sounds. The sound of gearshifts can also be enhanced.

The Sound Symposer incorporates a tunable Helmholtz resonator to achieve an harmonious sound pattern, damping out unpleasant noise occurring at around 5000 rpm.

If the Sound Symposer is deactivated, an aperture in the air filter housing still allows the basic engine and exhaust tones to be heard—"because we don’t want it to sound boring!” explained Dr. Bernhard Pfäfflin, General Manager of the Noise and Vibration Department.



looks like everything now down to marketing cars is a psyops exercise. or maybe they just mixdown the sounds of the car as they might a dance mix of a record
 
Old Feb 29, 2012 | 10:46 PM
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Yup -- pretty soon when you step on the gas, the engine sound will go up, the gauges will move, the seat will tilt back a little, but the car won't actually be going any faster.
 
Old Feb 29, 2012 | 11:10 PM
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Most high end cars are headed towards this "dual nature" goal. I think It's GREAT. You get a comfortable, quiet car with a supple ride and relatively quiet car when you're cruising and the car physically transforms into a sports car when you're feeling frisky. The suspension stiffens, the engine mounts go solid, the exhaust gets louder, the throttle response sharpens, etc.... I think that's great.

The crazy thing is that the GT cars start on the "stiff" settings of the normal cars and turn into race cars when you wake them up. That's been true of the 997 GT cars for quite some time. Put the PASM on sport and a GT3 goes from stiff as hell to cement truck! It gets so stiff that you can feel every pebble on the road. Makes total sense for a street car IMO. Same thing for the exhaust: Goes from sporty to Hell Yeah all at the touch of a button or a flex of the right toe.
 
Old Mar 12, 2012 | 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Aerodude
Yup -- pretty soon when you step on the gas, the engine sound will go up, the gauges will move, the seat will tilt back a little, but the car won't actually be going any faster.
After just purchasing my 04-996tt-X50 about 3 weeks ago, and putting on about 1500 miles including a r/t from San Fran to Pebble Beach, I drove my wife's '04 AMG CL 55 last night for the first time. I've been driving her car for about 6-7 years, so it's not as if it's new to me, but...

I really love my 996tt. First thing that I do when I get in her car is to put the clutch in. D'oh! At least I guessed the correct side for the ignition. It's a very smooth, manageable car, but doesn't have the soul of the 996. I think I'm keeping this car for 20 years (or until my gout kills me and I can't put a clutch in anymore).
 
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