Erp Triple vs Clutchmaster stg 3- can someone give me a good camparo
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i cant recommend, who did mine but PM about that.
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[QUOTE=johnspeed;4054605]I hated my CM..[/QUOTE
Thanks for all the responses!!!!!
I am running the CM3 with lightweight flywheel and just think there is more to be desired in a clutch flywheel setup. Chatters a ton too, doesn't really bother me too much though.
I do have the GT2 slave conversion done on my car. don't get me wrong the CM3 is "ok" per say, but sucks on hills considering the pickup is so narrow and engagement is rough.
My other reasoning behind getting the triple ERP because it will help to take some of the pressure off of the transmission from talking to various people and reading some threads and articles.
Kyle, the erp will feel totally different than a CM. the erp is triple disc. engagement on stock gears will feel like a sachs 2.5... with a (longer) gt2 1st gear (which i think youre doing, right ? ) you'll have a LITTLE bit of judder when moving from a stop, so you'll have to ride the clutch a little more than usual.
an erp is 10000x better than a cm stage 3. you'll never have to replace an erp, even at your expected power levels.
20k miles on mine so far with enough launches to have broken an axle already. lol
think of a erp clutch like pccb;s for your transmission. pccb;s last forever (150-300k miles). an erp will last YOU for at least that much (because youre mostly doing highway pulls)
youre definitely going to want to do a gt2 slave conversion. i recently felt an erp cluch on a 996tt with the hydraulic slave and it felt horrible to me. i didnt "feel" the clutch if that makes sense.
an erp is 10000x better than a cm stage 3. you'll never have to replace an erp, even at your expected power levels.
20k miles on mine so far with enough launches to have broken an axle already. lol
think of a erp clutch like pccb;s for your transmission. pccb;s last forever (150-300k miles). an erp will last YOU for at least that much (because youre mostly doing highway pulls)
youre definitely going to want to do a gt2 slave conversion. i recently felt an erp cluch on a 996tt with the hydraulic slave and it felt horrible to me. i didnt "feel" the clutch if that makes sense.
triples will make more noise generally at idle clutch not pushed in, but wont shutter when you are taking off they just hookup.
i had a 964rs steel flywheel and sachs pressureplate in my car at first (same as CM stage1-3) now have a triple disc and the triple is louder at idle.
the release position can be changed some people know what length to cut the shaft so it releases properly. some installers dont.
i had a 964rs steel flywheel and sachs pressureplate in my car at first (same as CM stage1-3) now have a triple disc and the triple is louder at idle.
the release position can be changed some people know what length to cut the shaft so it releases properly. some installers dont.
Thanks for all the responses!!!!!
I am running the CM3 with lightweight flywheel and just think there is more to be desired in a clutch flywheel setup. Chatters a ton too, doesn't really bother me too much though.
I do have the GT2 slave conversion done on my car. don't get me wrong the CM3 is "ok" per say, but sucks on hills considering the pickup is so narrow and engagement is rough.
My other reasoning behind getting the triple ERP because it will help to take some of the pressure off of the transmission from talking to various people and reading some threads and articles.
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Chatter is when your letting the clutch out and the disc is grabbing and letting go and basically hopping up n down inbetween the flywheel and the pressure plate. slip, grab,slip grab,slip, grab
rattling at idle with clutch pedal not pushed, or when going slow in a parking lot the gear rattle is not clutch chatter.
alot of people confuse the two terms, most porsche clutches dont chatter, because we dont use ceramic buttons like other import cars of yeaster-year did.
we use oragnic/kevlar/fibertuff/ or do into dual disc and carbon metallic plates.
rattling at idle with clutch pedal not pushed, or when going slow in a parking lot the gear rattle is not clutch chatter.
alot of people confuse the two terms, most porsche clutches dont chatter, because we dont use ceramic buttons like other import cars of yeaster-year did.
we use oragnic/kevlar/fibertuff/ or do into dual disc and carbon metallic plates.
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if you call up a clutch company they will swear up one side and down the other their clutches for these cars dont chatter, which is true but you hear that noise and say to yourself wtf it still chatters. but infact they are two different things were talking about.
Good luck on your quest,
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i figured as much, but if you looking to eliminate the noise, upgrade etc. its good to know what can and cant be fixed.
if you call up a clutch company they will swear up one side and down the other their clutches for these cars dont chatter, which is true but you hear that noise and say to yourself wtf it still chatters. but infact they are two different things were talking about.
Good luck on your quest,
if you call up a clutch company they will swear up one side and down the other their clutches for these cars dont chatter, which is true but you hear that noise and say to yourself wtf it still chatters. but infact they are two different things were talking about.
Good luck on your quest,
Thanks!!
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I have researched it. I just wanted to see if anyone had both and good give a good comparison.
I have the clutch master stage 3 currently with GT2 conversion and find the engagement is rough and some drivability goes out the window.
I was seeing if people with the ERP Triple find a lot more drivability with it? This car will not be tracked and mainly just some highway pulls on the weekends but I feel the CM stg 3 just takes some enjoyment away from driving the car.
Thanks......
I have the clutch master stage 3 currently with GT2 conversion and find the engagement is rough and some drivability goes out the window.
I was seeing if people with the ERP Triple find a lot more drivability with it? This car will not be tracked and mainly just some highway pulls on the weekends but I feel the CM stg 3 just takes some enjoyment away from driving the car.
Thanks......
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kind of weird how some have problems with the CM3 and others do not.
Mine is perfectly smooth with no jidder what so ever. engagement point like stock. I am using the Evoms GT2 slave conversion kit. The kit comes with a new slave rod. The Evoms rod is longer than the stock one. 4.740 long.
With all that said, and I really do like the CM3. The EPR was not available when I installed mine. To do it today Im sure I would go with the EPR 3 disc.
Mine is perfectly smooth with no jidder what so ever. engagement point like stock. I am using the Evoms GT2 slave conversion kit. The kit comes with a new slave rod. The Evoms rod is longer than the stock one. 4.740 long.
With all that said, and I really do like the CM3. The EPR was not available when I installed mine. To do it today Im sure I would go with the EPR 3 disc.
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I hate to break this to you guys but.. Unless you move the fulcrum point cutting the rod does nothing. Hear me out.. Why use a hydraulic clutch?
1) you can ease the force needed by altering the piston size.
2) it always self adjusts..
With that said all that happens is the piston in slave is moved and the master returns and adds more fluid to the slave to take up the space you just removed from the rod. Think of your brakes, when your pads wear down does the engagement point of your pedal change? No it does not. why? as I stated above the fluid fills the space as the pads wear.
I know what you are thinking.. Carbonetics states you need to cut the rod.. Yes you do. Why? Because the stack up is different and it moved the fulcrum point by changing the angle of the clutch fork.
1) you can ease the force needed by altering the piston size.
2) it always self adjusts..
With that said all that happens is the piston in slave is moved and the master returns and adds more fluid to the slave to take up the space you just removed from the rod. Think of your brakes, when your pads wear down does the engagement point of your pedal change? No it does not. why? as I stated above the fluid fills the space as the pads wear.
I know what you are thinking.. Carbonetics states you need to cut the rod.. Yes you do. Why? Because the stack up is different and it moved the fulcrum point by changing the angle of the clutch fork.
Hmmm. Never thought of it like that.
My big complaint about my cm3 is the engagement point.
Most cars I've driven engage just off the floor. That's not the case with my 996.
Is there any remedy or are they all like that?
My big complaint about my cm3 is the engagement point.
Most cars I've driven engage just off the floor. That's not the case with my 996.
Is there any remedy or are they all like that?
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Yes. There are a few things. Make sure you buy a disc that has a marcel spring built into the disc. Stack up is everything. You cut the flywheel or the pressure plate surface engagement is out the window. If I remember right the stage 3 is a ceramic puck type? Those are thinner then the organic counter part ( changes the fulcrum piont by moving the diaphragm fingers out). Also I do not believe the marcel spring flexes the two sides apart enough to lessen the on/off feel, but smarter guys then I make these products and they work well. I used a CM stage whatever (ceramic puck) and it work and I learned how to drive it.
Bad thing with mine...PO had it installed, so I don't really "know" what it's all about. I originally thought it was a problem.
It holds fine on my set-up (that I just finished) but it has to have near 30k miles on it so I have to think I'm coming close to the end.
I guess we'll see what happens.
It holds fine on my set-up (that I just finished) but it has to have near 30k miles on it so I have to think I'm coming close to the end.
I guess we'll see what happens.
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I have a hardly used Tilton that we are removing. Years ago we helped pioneer this triple disc. It was nothing but problems.
Last edited by cjv; May 6, 2022 at 03:11 PM.
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I have a hardly used Tilton that we are removing. Years ago we helped pioneer this triple disc. It was nothing but problems.
Last edited by cjv; May 6, 2022 at 03:11 PM.