I was gonna get mine ported when I had the k16/k24 hybrids installed....should I also have them polished or coated?

 

Leave them alone. They're fine. Ask RUF, Manthey or 9ff if they do anything to the headers of any of the cars that they modify. They have 700 plus hp kits with no mention of new DV's, wastegates or headers. Don't get caught up in the B.S.

 

yeap..and not to mention, no intakes either.

 

I put some on just for the looks, dont forget the "cool factor"!

dc

 

I had mine ported and polished just for improved air flow/reduced turbulence...and I finished the outsides as well with high temp paint. Intakes on the other hand are yummy and add much power.

 

9Eleven,

I would not recommend headers to the car in question. He is not to the stage where there would be any worthwhile gain. There is a hp area where headers, external waste gates and larger/shorter intakes are a must as there is no other way to attain that kind of power otherwise.

I would question your knowlege of the real high hp Porsche motors when you call it being caught up in BS. This is not a personal attack.

 

You would gain noting with a polish, however coating will all a few ponies. Is it worth it .......... probably not as I would venture to guess that most people would not be able to feel or recognize a 20/25 hp gain.

 

I believe everyone here keeps forgetting about the "weak link." wross996tt, when you mentionedthe intake, you just happened to stumble upon the next weak link.

 

Sorry guys, but I have been listening to headers being bashed for six years now with these motors. Are they the answer to everyones dreams............ of course not. Will they make more power than ported stock headers .......... of course they will............. at a certain power level.

As a general statement, I would venture to bet that most people could not determine the difference between the power gained with ported Porsche headers or custom headers in cars with motors under 600-700 hp. I guarantee you could tell the difference with a car equipted with ported Porsche headers versus custom headers equipted with external waste gates and Garrett GT30 or 35R's (which the stock headers will not support due to the waste gates (internal vs external) and the intake diameter size differences ). One is like sucking through a straw underwater.

 

isn't scott running stock headers?

 

Nope, they are custom made from Proto. Same as Mark.

 

No offense taken. Let me clarify my statement. Unless you are going for a very high horsepower motor (700 plus fwhp) where the only way to get there is to upgrade the turbos; then yes, I would agree that upgraded wastegates and headers are probably necessary, but so are a lot of other components for that type of horsepower. Although, none of these engines have been tested without headers, DV's and/or wastgates to see if there really is a difference. I wonder how RUF does it? I assume that new turbos are supplied with their own wastegates, so new turbos would solve that issue. I do believe that either Markski or Scott were both running stock headers prior to their last horsepower increase.

If you are happy below that level, then unless there is evidence to show otherwise; IMHO, stock headers, wastegates and DV's are just fine. If you want to replace the stock DV's for peace of mind; great, but it isn't necessary. My wastegates are stock and I simply adjusted them and they are holding the boost just fine. I changed my DV's for the piece of mind (billet vs. plastic), not for any perceived horsepower or boost gain. If you want to see an immediate true gain, a flash and exhaust are the answer. Everthing else beyond that point absent a 700 fwhp kit is negligible with regard to any true horsepower gained versus the investment. Ultimately, it is the decision of the car owner to determine if these modifications are producing the desired results for the investment.

 

I went with B&Bs headers and couldnt be happier...and I def felt a gain but Im at well over 120 a good degree of time and would be able to feel any higher rpm/speed effect...

 

9eleven,

Your first sentence is very accurate with the exception of the word "probably." Headers by themselves do not add power. Remember, only additional fuel with the correct oxygen volumn makes power. All the other components only facilitate the air and fuel. Ported OME headers are not a very real restriction unless you climb above 650 hp. Let me explain. The other headers will actually slightly hinder power/torque under 500 hp. There can be a gradule increase in power from 500 to 650, but as I said before, most drivers wouldn't really feel the increase unless you were on a track and were measuring the tenths of a second gained duringa lap.

Headers really should a benefit when coupled with large turbo's. I' speaking about turbo's that do not utilize internal waste gates because these waste gates are not conducive with big power. They take up room. In addition they cannot move the volumn of gasses that external one can. The external WG's are simple bigger. Remember, the weak link theory. Well, these big turbo's require big everything else. Not going into engine internals, you need a larger fresh air supply. The route of the existing filter to turbo is simply too restrictive to supply the volume of air required for these turbo's. That is why the distance is shortened and tubes enlarged to about 100 mm. They usually locate these cone filters in the rear fenders. Then you need larger tubes IC's and piping to the Y pipe and then larger throttle body and MAF. A MAF rated for a minimum of 1000 hp is preferable.

I have not covered everthing, but you get the idea. I can tell you from experience, there is no way the ported headers will even come close after 850 hp and it is a slow losing battle for them after 650.

You mention Ruff, Ruff does well with their set up, but remember, Ruff isn't making 800-1000 hp motors. I can remember about six years ago when Ruff was making more hp and especially more torque than everyone else. I can also remember discovering that their secret was the larger tube from the filter to the turbo. My how things have progressed. I see this whole arguement as arguing about nothing. A 650/700 hp car might be 15/20 hp less without a good set of turbo's. In addition, overall this car is far more conducive with the street. Do you know the longevity difference between a 650 hp motor compared to a 800 and then a 1000 hp motor. The big motors are great for a short period of time. But I will guarantee you that a big motor will not last 20,000 miles til rebuild unless the owner is babying it. I believe it would even be less with the spring pressures I see these motors running at. Remember a 450 hp race motor is good for 30-50 race hours. How many race hours do you think a 700, 800, 1000 or 1200 hp motor will last. That is unless you drive it like a little old lady the majority of the time.

This whole arguement is about apples and oranges.

 

I remember a few guys that dynoed and actually lost power w/ headers.