Why in hell do you bother to participate in this forum? Go and get a souped up Toyota, as you clearly cannot tell the difference.

 

Really...dumbed down Toyota's? I tell you my 911 rides rougher and has more direct feel than any Toyota or Honda I've ever owned. Steering input is almost precise and not slow to respond much like Honda's. Trust me I've owned two of Honda's high end car - The NSX and the 911 trumps it all over the place. My father had a TT Supra and although quick in a straight line...its a Toyota - plastic interior and slow to respond in cornering.

Maybe mini's are your ideal car? The STi you own is damn cool but you need to place yourself in a nice 997 Carrera or Carrera S and you'll quickly forget the STi.

As for the response from Porsche... There is no substitute.

 

Okay, I went overboard with the Toyota reference. The truth (to me) is most sports cars have lost their feel for the road in exchange for air conditioned seats and heated steering wheels.

I've owned a few P-cars over the years...from 356's to Boxsters and 996s. Every single time that Porsche has came out with a new design, the car is usually faster, much more comfortable and always less concerned with road feel.

So, my apologies if I've offended anyone. The reality is that you should drive your car and enjoy it regardless of what anyone has to say on a public internet forum.

 

I don't know if the STI is a cool car but it does give you a great feel for the road and at, 30k (2010 STI SE)...I couldn't go wrong. I am, however, getting tired of every 20 year old on the road trying to race me...hmmm.

 

Breathe

 

May I suggest a GT3 test drive? As they are track oriented cars. You might find the raw race car feel in a GT3 that you want.

 

Seems to me that a car with the nicer amenities takes away from the driving experience for you... so sit in a new spyder that has no ac, no door handles... or ride in a GT3 and get back to us with your new opinion. :P

 

Apology not required. I agree with you that many 911s bought today are laden with useless doodads (this forum is full of reports of such cars) that simply add weight and rob it sport qualities. If you had stated that I would not have reacted...

 

I could easily take a GT 3 out for a drive...a test drive! I would , however, be wasting everyone's time since it is not a deal that I can close at this time...too bad, what a wonderful machine!

I know that I'm not the only one that doesn't need 400+ horses on a car...give me a well balanced 2500 lbs car with 300 horses, a low center of gravity, I'll take A/C and a heater, keep the rest of the lux items off of it...oh, and it would be great to be able to get in/out of the car (ahem, Lotus!).

 

You and I think the same way.

 

Don't forget the radio!

 

just to add a few cents & personal opinion to an (interesting) post....not intending on sparking furhter debate.

hard to compare the 2, personally own an older p-car & would not trade up to newer one (new boxster spyder is enticing however), have driven mini's both new bmw produced and old "real" cooper version (absolute hoot...like a go kart on jetfuel!!).

cost of a new mini Like most of the bmw product seems way steep for whats on offer and while a cute & fun drive not soul stirring.

if i was considering a mini buy (and believe me that would NOT be a buy decision between a mini and a p-car )......i would defer mini decision until new
Abarth from Fiat arrives these shores....(which it will i believe under Fiat's rescue plan with Chrysler).

1st of all Fiat and related cos. now build 1st rate - dependable vehicles....
I had 2 late model Alfa Romeos (now Fiat owned)while posted in Japan....1st rate....no maintenance issues and about 2X better than prior BMW's owned, in terms of drive/fun factor.

Abarth test reports - 1st rate , highly successful in Europe and sales doing very well here in Japan.

 

I have had a 78 and an 80 911 and currently have the good fortune of owning a 997.

I think that something everybody has forgotten is that Porsche had to change their strategy drastically in the 90s for survival. They used to build race cars that they'd tone down a little and outfit for the street.

Things needed to change to avoid being taken over or bankrupted and sadly they had to make some consessions. They created the boxster and cayenne, reduced costs by sharing parts between models etc etc. All in all, becoming more mainstream helped the company live to race another day.

My point is that Porsche knows how to make a sports car. For many of us they have designed a car that is a pleasure on the road and track. I believe that there is no other car that you can drive every day, rain, shine or snow and then thrash at the race track. I believe the current 997 is the perfect comprimise of pure sport and practicallity.

Not interested in comprimise? Buy a GT3. You can find a 996 for $50K and believe me, there is no comprimise with that car.

 

ATR911, I agree with you there. There was once a time when ALL of the porsche cars had a credible motorsports heritage. Certainly one that was admired by all other makers (except ferrari, a competitor). Now, they have SUVs and a 4 door sedan that can only have a racing heritage by way of a CF and tube chassis that has about as much similarity to the base car as a nascar racer does to a ford taurus.
I hope they don't become a brand alternative to BMW. By that I mean every product being sold from a hatchback to near-minivans. But I guess the market will drive the product!
It would have been fun to see what mini had up their sleeves.....
But, even on an autocross, a 997.2S would destroy a mini. My times on a solo-type course against a mini S driven by a national champ driver were better by over a second. (40-50 second course). And, I was the inferior driver. That is not to say they aren't awesome, it is just that braking and accel. have applications on even the shortest courses. Unless they make the straightaway on the track a continuous slalom with 'chicago-boxes', I can't see how the mini would win......

 

Not to single you out, Jorge, but for all the complaining that I've heard over the years about this topic, I wonder if anyone has done some research on the relativity of this issue. I'm not sure if that's the right way to phrase the question, so I'll try it this way - I wonder if there's always been a Lotus Elise to Porsche's 911 or 356. A lighter, more purpose-built sports car. Without looking into it, I would imagine that the Porsche car of the era (any era) has always been heavier than that purpose built alternative, had more creature comforts, less road feel, etc. I think if Porsches as great, sporty, reliable, nimble, capable of driving comfortably daily, etc, but not necessarily the ultimate of any of those categories. However, IMHO, it's always been the best combination of all of those attributes. That's as true today as ever, as far as I'm concerned. Porsche still has to stay profitable, so they must move with the times.
Just my $.02