CEL *ELL! (Rich at Idle)
CEL *ELL! (Rich at Idle)
OK, maybe not quite *ellish, but certainly a PITA and terrible timing right before Memorial Day.
Here's my sad story: Have about 5k miles on my T4S since installing the exhaust setup shown in my signature. Cars runs great. First popped a CEL a couple weeks ago, immediately following a brake flush and oil change by my indy (well-known and respected former Porsche tech). CEL popped up immediately after reaching temp on that first drive post oil/fluid change. He couldn't diagnose the problem, so I went straight to the local dealer and they switched off the CEL and said let's see if it comes back. Code was P2188 Rich at Idle Bank 1.
300 miles of hard-driving later, it came back. Drove with it one for another 200 miles (including a track day). Coming out of the track day, it then turned itself off for 50 or so miles, then came back on. This time P2190 Rich at Idle Bank 2.
Took it back to dealer who ran full performance diagnostics and said it's not the MAF, loose oil cap, gas cap, hoses, etc. He says it's definitely the cats and suggested either O2 spacers or "just taking out the O2s" (done by my indy. I have a very good relationship with the dealer so he gave me this advice off the record).
Anyone know whether this code is typically fixed by O2 spacers? Anyone know what it means to "take out the O2 sensors" and what are the consequences come time to check emissions?
Thanks very much in advance for any advice. Would be great to know if it's an O2 issue before wasting time and money on the wrong "solution."
Here's my sad story: Have about 5k miles on my T4S since installing the exhaust setup shown in my signature. Cars runs great. First popped a CEL a couple weeks ago, immediately following a brake flush and oil change by my indy (well-known and respected former Porsche tech). CEL popped up immediately after reaching temp on that first drive post oil/fluid change. He couldn't diagnose the problem, so I went straight to the local dealer and they switched off the CEL and said let's see if it comes back. Code was P2188 Rich at Idle Bank 1.
300 miles of hard-driving later, it came back. Drove with it one for another 200 miles (including a track day). Coming out of the track day, it then turned itself off for 50 or so miles, then came back on. This time P2190 Rich at Idle Bank 2.
Took it back to dealer who ran full performance diagnostics and said it's not the MAF, loose oil cap, gas cap, hoses, etc. He says it's definitely the cats and suggested either O2 spacers or "just taking out the O2s" (done by my indy. I have a very good relationship with the dealer so he gave me this advice off the record).
Anyone know whether this code is typically fixed by O2 spacers? Anyone know what it means to "take out the O2 sensors" and what are the consequences come time to check emissions?
Thanks very much in advance for any advice. Would be great to know if it's an O2 issue before wasting time and money on the wrong "solution."
Guys, i'm updating this thread in case anyone has this CEL in the future. It was a faulty MAF. Cleaned it repeatedly but didn't help, so replaced it. 2 lessons:
1. had i listened to the dealer, i would have installed 02 spacers or removed them entirely -- bad move! Luckily i found enough info on this great forum to suspect that it was a pre-cat issue. thanks to some good listening and help from rhonda at FVD and alex at sharkwerks (neither of whom tried to sell me anything or were connected to the problem), i zero'd in on the MAF and had it fixed.
2. Dealer wanted $900 to replace the MAF. i bought it from Suncoast for $300 and paid my Indy $100 to swap it.
1. had i listened to the dealer, i would have installed 02 spacers or removed them entirely -- bad move! Luckily i found enough info on this great forum to suspect that it was a pre-cat issue. thanks to some good listening and help from rhonda at FVD and alex at sharkwerks (neither of whom tried to sell me anything or were connected to the problem), i zero'd in on the MAF and had it fixed.
2. Dealer wanted $900 to replace the MAF. i bought it from Suncoast for $300 and paid my Indy $100 to swap it.
Guys, i'm updating this thread in case anyone has this CEL in the future. It was a faulty MAF. Cleaned it repeatedly but didn't help, so replaced it. 2 lessons:
1. had i listened to the dealer, i would have installed 02 spacers or removed them entirely -- bad move! Luckily i found enough info on this great forum to suspect that it was a pre-cat issue. thanks to some good listening and help from rhonda at FVD and alex at sharkwerks (neither of whom tried to sell me anything or were connected to the problem), i zero'd in on the MAF and had it fixed.
2. Dealer wanted $900 to replace the MAF. i bought it from Suncoast for $300 and paid my Indy $100 to swap it.
1. had i listened to the dealer, i would have installed 02 spacers or removed them entirely -- bad move! Luckily i found enough info on this great forum to suspect that it was a pre-cat issue. thanks to some good listening and help from rhonda at FVD and alex at sharkwerks (neither of whom tried to sell me anything or were connected to the problem), i zero'd in on the MAF and had it fixed.
2. Dealer wanted $900 to replace the MAF. i bought it from Suncoast for $300 and paid my Indy $100 to swap it.
Good info Lee. the board certainly is a great place to get info.
And great job saving th ebucks.
Hope to see you soon at NJMP.
Schatt this week. Sorry your not making it.
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