Do you ever wonder if this is the last generation of really good fun cars? I personally have an 05 C2S which I bought new and really enjoy. I try to follow the new cars from P BMW and Ferrari. More and more I read about the newer cars coming out touting for the enthusiast better fuel economy for CAFE standards with smaller displacement engines, automatic start/stop features and unbelievable wizardry such as beefing up the exhaust sound through the stereo system. Who is going to fix these things and for how much money a year after the warranty expires. I'm not trying to jerk the chain of those who have ponied up for a 991-its a cool car no doubt, just saying that things really seem to be....progressing and I'm not sure for the best. Maybe the 993 guys are saying this about us 997 owners.
Jim

 

Not so many years from now they will be saying it about the 991.

 

A lot of people feel that way, me among them. I've certainly seen this with BMW, and there's a lively debate about whether the 991 has gotten too far away from the classic 911 feel. And to me, getting a performance car and then worrying about gas mileage is silly -- gotta pay to play!

 

I thought the "golden era" ended when gas shortages caused complete detuning of muscle cars in the 70's. Then came the 90's and newer ways to increase HP and maintain some reasonable MPG. Now, it just gets better and better. They'll be asking that question every decade to come.

 

But that's the key question, does it keep getting better and better? A lot of people feel that, while objective performance may be increasing, the fun factor has finally started to truly decrease. Technology and refinement can reach the point of getting in the way of driver/car/road connection. The 991 vs 997 comparison is case in point, and I've noted my reservations about the 991 in the 991 forum.

 

/agree with original poster.

 

The manufacturers are supplying a product that is market driven. As long as the market accepts the direction of travel the manufacturers will continue down the current path. The good news is the consumer can always take a step back or sideways to that which scratches their itch.

I found the 991 to be a very nice car and wondered what it would be like to track one. I also wondered about all of the additional electronics. But I'm also about to turn 65 and my spine surgeon has told me to stay off the track. So my body might be secretly nudging me to a slush mobile nirvana.

At any rate I plan to keep the GTS for a long time.

 

true...lets see how the market reacts over time.

as for your GTS...its an awesome car....glad to see you will keep it a long time.

 

Spot-On. I wish I'd said this!

 

If your Porsche doesn't look like this - it's no fun.


or this:

Obviously, the line is blurry, because of the objective nature of cars/opinions. Some people find that the newer cars are MORE fun, because there is less of a chance to kill yourself (read: able to drive again the next day).

 

I have to agree with you, Manifold. I would say that Porsche is doing the best job, but I am bothered by the interaction of two trends:

1. I can't agree with Alan that the changes are market driven any longer. Every design engineer pays attention to the market or becomes unemployed, but the front end of the design requirements phase is uniformly legislation. Across the entire industry, legislative mandates set the agenda. Then, within the limits of their technology, the various design teams try to satisfy their target market. That is a long way from market-driven design.
2. Our technology is too damn good. For those who don't know, I made my living building the technology, so I don't say this as some sort of neo-Luddite. I mean it this way: the texture of technique is being lost.

We are people who love cars for themselves, not for how quickly we can get to work. The latter has been legislatively limited in most jurisdictions for half a century. It is the feel of a car we love. A good fraction of that feel is the interplay of g-loads as we take a nice road. Fair enough. And modern cars are far better at that then in the heyday. For much the same reasons, they are far faster on tracks. But a significant portion of the joy comes from the way a car feels when doing those things. No time to get into this, busy day ahead. Maybe later. But basically, the feel of an older sports car came from technology pushed to the limits, from the sensation of this or that constraint being overcome by some neat type of suspension, or new type of gearbox, and the subtle distinctive sensations of that technique or this one, or the combination. The swing axles of the early Porsches and VW's and Spitfires were terrible for absolute performance, so they make a good example. Their feel was completely different from the solid axles of an MG and a myriad other 'conventional' designs.

Okay, quickly. Like this. A staple of good cooking is the mirapois. One chops up celery, onions, and carrots and the sauteed mix becomes the substrate for a dozen different dishes. Mexican food uses a different combination and goes by a different name, but without knowing how to cook, we nevertheless recognize the underlying substrate immediately as good eaters -- if you will. Modern technology being used to overcome nearly impossible legislative mandates comes very close to a cook blending onion juice, celery juice, and carrot juice, and adding half a cup to the pan before starting a recipe. Theoretically the ingredients are all there, the flavor mix has been provided, but the texture is gone.

Gotta run. No time to edit.

Gary

 

I agree with everything said here.. I would also just like to point out that for the average person (not us on this site) a car that is safe, numb, quiet, efficient, isolates the outside road from the driver is what the larger market wants. So thats where the auto companies focus their goals. This is my first Porsche after coming out of a 2010 Mercedes E class. The above describes that car. I had a 1998 E class and it was more of a drivers car and in some aspects I was a little bored and disappointed with the new E. Don t get me wrong, it s a fantastic car for the most part just not as fun as cars have been in the past. I guess it depends on your starting point for your car history.

 

It seems with every new generation of 911 there is a post very similar in nature to the OP. You could make the argument that the 911 died with the Air-cooled 993, now we have electric power steering!

It's all relative, as was already mentioned in this thread, US fuel regulations and the costs of fuel are playing a factor in what Porsche (and everyone else) is doing.

A lot of us are Petrol Heads, so that thought of trying to service a crazy hybrid/electric system scares the crap out of us. Give me fuel/spark and I'm fine.

 

My daily driver is a VW Jetta, so my soulless, water-cooled 997 seems pretty damn fun

 

I would tend to agree with the original poster. Sports cars for the masses are going in the direction of the masses. I could have purchased a 991 S albeit less optioned for the same as what I got my 997 for. However, I feel that the 991 is a slow departure from what Porsche means to me. Then again, I also like the 993. I wanted a good modern example of the tradition to keep for years to come. I am quite happy with my purchase and don't feel for the 991 in its current state. Certainly take one for free, though as I type that, I don't feel it.