what you mean with this "if"?

this amp I used instead original in non bose car with pcm3. it comes with harness with standart iso plugs, on second photo brown plug changed to pcm3 version.

 

Understand, but in the US, MAYBE one in ten cars does not have the Bose stereo. In fact, I don't think I've seen a car without it. So, it may be true in a non-Bose car, but you aren't going to find one here.

 

Ah, you got me. I lost it there for a minute. Clearly there are the conversion harnesses to adapt to a new head unit, but you're right, I don't actually recall a MOST conversion harness to go to a new amp. I just suspect one would be available. Sorry for the misstatement. Purely an assumption on my part.

You can check my budget install thread, of course. I've replaced all the drivers in the car and am running them off the stock Bose amp. There is PLENTY of power to drive them and I've never even clipped the amp so I don't even know how loud it would go. If you keep the stock head unit, I would highly recommend just changing the drivers first before dumping $400 plus into an amp you won't need.

 

well, I've seen alot US cars here without bose, but this no matter at all, and out of topic . main thing - pcm is same, analog/optical out switched by programming it with piwis. so you can cut this optic, or leave aside. in any car.

 

Serg- If I'm understanding your post correctly, then this should work:

1) BOSE amp is left installed to complete the MOST network.

2) Take the 8 channel line level signals from the PCM and input it this to an aftermarket processor & amp which will drive all speakers.

3) Leave PCM programming alone as it thinks the Bose amp is still in the MOST network.

The attraction to this solution would be a virgin signal from the PCM and avoid the Bose amp processing before going to an aftermarket processor.

It's also easily reversible to go back to stock.

Now...will it work?

 

Wow, this is the first I heard of this..... Hmmm..... this raises big questions....

The CD player will play DVD-A formated, 5.1 discs (and MP3s etc)..... what comes out of the analog lines? Is it 5.1? If it is, then the digital to analog conversion is happening in the head unit and therefore, I can preserve the full functionality of the system. This implies the analog outs have many outputs L, R, F, R, Sub, Center channel etc........ Really???

Other issue is if there is a fiber optic line out, then that line is purely a digital signal and therefore the digital to analog conversion is happening in the amp..... I strongly doubt there is digital to analog conversion in both systems, the head PCM and the amp. In my friend's '05 with a Bose, there is a fiber optic out but that is for the bass unit only IIRC.

Something is not right here........ my instincts are telling me the Bose system is simply different.

By the way, I have been in many many USA 997.2 cars and never saw a car without a Bose system. Anybody know of a USA car without Bose?

Information??? I would LOVE to swap out the amps.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

 

By the way, i-sotec does not show a Porsche solution on their website. Need more information......

http://www.i-sotec.com/

Peace
Bruce in Philly

 

Sorry to keep posting.... I keep finding new information....

That amp is only a 4-line output, 2-channel stereo system, and therefore by definition, not a replacement system for our USA Bose systems.....

http://www.i-sotec.com/soundloesunge...20-verstaerker

Peace
Bruce in Philly

 

seems like you missed something.
programming ABSOLUTELY IMPORTANT. please read carefully again, no sound without. leaving optical plug plugged in or not absolutely no matters.
analog out is 4 channel only, but yes, any amp, with or without processor
reversing back is owners wish only. somebody wants this, somebody prefer to sell freed parts like amp etc

do you have cd-player at home? when you plug in headphones - do you hear a music when playing 5.1 disk? you do, but in headphones only L and R. player always give you L and R, others - SUB, Center etc is work of amplifier. read how dolby system work, and roles of player and amp in this system.

analog out on pcm3 is only 4 channel, not amplified. by the way - where you saw amp with subwoofer in?

your instincts didnt lie to you

maybe all us cars without bose are sold to russians as they are cheap? I dont know for sure why is that but BOSE IS OPTION.

you didnt get at all what I'm talking about. and yes, i-sotec for sure not a replacement for bose amp, it is SUBSTITUTE.

 

No I don't hear music and my CD players reject the disc. A DVD-A audio disc is a unique format and unlike standard "Philps Red Book" CDs or file-based discs that have MP3s. The "CD" player in our cars is more like a computer disc reader and provides the digital stream to a set of processors. The system detects the type of disc and reads according to that disc mastering standard. Then, it passes the digital stream to a converter chip that converts the stream into something the digital to analog converter(s) can process.

I suspect, I don't know, that the converter chips (digital to analog converter - DAC) is a native 5.1 DVD-A chip. I say this because the sound quality is best with well recorded and mastered DVD-As and consequently stereo "Red Book" CDs. MP3 conversion and XM radio conversion is not great as the stream has to be converted and manipulated to meet the DACs native requirements. These conversions are not as simple as most folks think. The converter has to extrapolate missing information and timing...... and quality is never perfect by definition and subject to the algorithms selected by the engineers and limited by the power/cost of the selected chips. (By the way, I am describing this as a set of functions.... these functions may all exist on one large chip or in separate chips built into an overall circuit design.)

I've listened to many DACs and file formats and when you have a player that plays more than one format, only one of those input formats will sound best due to the DACs having really only one format that will generate a swing in voltage (anlog output) and therefore other formats have to be converted..... again, converting is by definition, never perfect and will always degrade sound quality. How much degradation is a function of will and cost.

For example, I had an XM processor installed into an existing Nakamichi system in my last Porsche. This Alpine XM radio had a dedicated XM optimized DAC that output and analog signal to the Nakamichi aux ins. This XM system sounded much better than the non-optimized XM system in our Bose system that I strongly beleive, has to process the XM digital format to fit the 5.1 DACs. I know XM is not a great sounding format, but it can sound better than it does in our Bose systems.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

 

just perfect

 

Hey, appreciate seeing your input and I know you've run the PCM3 conversion thread - which unfortunately I never could understand because it is in no way clear how much such a .1 conversion would cost. But I digress a bit.

As I understand it, all one needs to do is have the PCM 3 reprogrammed for non-Bose application by a PWIS and then simply use the 4 channel line output from the PCM3 into any amp. If you don't do a PWIS reprogram for the non-Bose application, there will be no output through the 4 channel line outs, since the system is only using the fiber optic out for the Bose amp. This also suggests why you need a fiber optic connector for an aftermarket head unit as the Bose amp requires a fiber optic input. Sounds like one would be much better off to simply use a $400 4 channel amp and connect it to the new head unit and then to the speaker connectors going out of the Bose amp. Not sure why anyone would choose a $600 MOST adapter instead. Seems silly to me, but I guess that retains more of the "stock" stereo - of course the worst part!

Still argue that the Bose amp is a very adequate unit and really will power aftermarket speakers very well. I'm interested to know if the PWIS programming for non-Bose is really that simple. In respect to non-Bose cars, there is no question ROW cars are often equipped differently than US cars. As Bruce said, I've seen MANY US 997's and I've never seen one without a Bose stereo.

 

Oh, okay, I found the PIWIS diagram you're probably referring to. Yes, there's a Japan Navigation System set if inputs with wire colors referenced. So, if those wire actually exist on your car, it should be pretty easy to tap into them at the wiring harness that connects to the Bose amp. And as someone else mentioned, you'd just have to reprogram the system. Now you've got your signal and a location to tap into them without removing the PCM3. But this is assuming the wires in the diagram were actually wired in your car too.

Honestly, I really wanted to keep my PCM stock too. My solution was to take leave the PCM3 in, and tap the SPEAKER-LEVEL outputs of the Bose amp and sum/de-EQ them with a system integration unit (I chose the JBL MS-8), and then send the outputs to an aftermarket amp. If you don't want to deal with all this experimentation, this might be a good option.l

Although, it's a slippery slope. Once I upgraded the speakers, I decided I wanted a better HU, so I ended upgrading that too to a Pioneer unit.

 

price is simple to understand. typical installation of pcm3 in 997.1 with climate and button strip is about 5000$ including all parts and labour - with about 80% of that is parts only... if you do it yourself - count all parts together, plus add summ for activation codes (bluetooth, navi etc).

you understand all correct. you can use not only 400$ amp, you can use hi-fi 4000$ amp with 5.1 out, and use factory wiring "from bose to speakers" and drive aftermarket hi-fi speakers and subwoofer.

when replacing bose speakers it needs to remember about impendance, or you will burn amp sooner or later... so, to me - if go replacing - replace all to match amp and speakers

we here have some sort of business - to order new US Pcar with no options, bring it here and sell. so here we have alot of (we call them)"drum" US Pcars with almost no options but cheap, and when this car gets older it became more and more cheaper.

for you to know - I've tested week ago to plug Burmester amp instead Bose - and it works

 

Thanks for the feedback.

That's what I thought about the pcm conversion. I respect that you've done it, but I think the cost is crazy. You can do a lot to the audio system for $5k! After the pcm you still have the poor amp and speakers!

It is interesting that people would use a harness to adapt a new head unit to the old Bose amp. Why the heck would anyone do that?

Adopted a Burmester huh? Now that would be a real waste of money! How much do they get for those units???