Good video of the 991. Doesn't seem like a "huge mess" to me....

 

Another one:

 

the 991 a mess?

 

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First there was a badge thread now a gender assignment thread of a car.

 

Not sure if its a mes but many people are not overly thrilled with it.

I was starting to believe that at the performance limits and without the gizmos it would be close to the thrill of the 997.

However I am now very concerned about this bufferring effect at high speeds with windows open. It this is not fixed then this car is a mess IMO.

 

posted several times...but thanks anyway

 

In my not so humble opinion it is an overpriced , techno gadget, repeat failure like the 996 was . the 991 will never go down as the 911 to be remembered .It's luxury component has ruined one of the best cars ever made .

I may not buy a GTR and i still love Porsche .. but I will not buy the first Gen 991 .
In contrast the used 130K Gt3Rs will be an ICON.

Even now the 997 cars have gone up in value which is an indicator of failure in my opinion. Much like the Bangled BMW cars or in recent times the newest Honda Civic . When no one wants the newest cars the older model suddenly spike in value on the used market.

The next step for Porsche woild be to offer attention deficiit high residual lease deals just to move units because if they think that the technology wont evolve faster than the the rest of the car they must be dreaming .

Nissan will beat them in this domain . '
BMW might even beat them in this domain.

By the time this current 991 is two years old .. new gadgets will replace the old and that 130K gotta have it car will be dated .

The 991 is even in worse shape than the Panamera . All porsche has to do is restyle the rear of the Pany and resale on the current car will plummet .. With the 991 .. the entire car needs help starting with the larger panamera interior and audi ish shape with a price tag that makes one gulp.

 

thatīs the direction it had to go to keep up with its tec-laden competitors.
i agree that with every new generation the 911 has lost some of its "thrilling/dangerous" character but it`s still undeniably a 911.
the 911s of today are not for the chosen few, they have to appeal to the broadest cross-section of buyers to make it a sales success and to guarantee it will live on.

 

I can't argue with what you are saying from a business point of view.

 

PS .. In contrast the Boxster s is a step forewad but at 80K it may have priced itsef out of the market .

My genwral view is that a modest powered convertible wth some luxury gives a "fun weekend car" factor to those who like this . I happen not to like convertibles thuogh as i detest outside road filth blowing on myself as wwell as the cars cabin but to each his own . I do realize that many love this and the Boxster is a home run with its new redesign .

 

I second your opinion. The 991 forum police must be coccing ( on purpose so the other forum police will not *star* me out) their weapons by now.. The 991 is a 2 door Panamera, looks like it inside, looks like it outside...quacks like a duck so it must be a duck. But that is from a purist visual and proportion-correct view of the world. Not from a business perspective. I doubt that there is anybody out there that believes the New Porsche lineup looks remotely as well designed as the Aston Martin or the Maserati for instance ( comparing the 2 door and 4 door variants of those brands).
On a similar note.... I have not seen any technical attention to the new engines in the 991... What gives?? No RMS / IMS / timing chain / water pump / etc discussions? Yet we are seeing some full engine and gear box failures but nobody has a clue??

 

itīs all about sales, emission and safety numbers these days.
the new e-brake is a pain in the ****, but it`s a logical step in terms of technological progress and most customers won`t complain,
so that won`t change imho.
the new steering is a step back in responsiveness but more comfortable and a step forward to meet CAFE standards
(together with start-stop, DFI etc.). so that won`t change as well but thk good there is lots of room to improve it.
the new PDCC takes away some of the cornering drama, but it makes driving safer and faster,
so thatīs just the beginning of such driving assist gizmos.
the PDK takes away some of the interaction between the car and driver but it is more comfortable, faster and more fuel efficient.
but Porsche will offer the manual as long as there is enough demand.
sadly, we all have to get used to it, otherwise we will be living in the past.

 

yep, and that rubber smells too. Maybe some of the remaining questions will be muted after it begins winning races.

ChuckJ

 

Well said! And when I go back and drive a 70 something 911 I ask myself why I thought that was so good at the time. Maybe in 2050 people will be saying the same thing about the 2012 991.

ChuckJ

 

Have you driven it? Nobody likes body roll. In the past they had to make the suspension so stiff to eliminate body roll, than it was uncomfortable to drive anywhere other than the track. Look at the member here who didn't get PDCC and is looking at new springs.
You don't have to get the PDK. If you want to be slow, get the manual. But the 911 is all about speed while still retaining some comfort around town. If I wanted pure speed, I would have saved money and bought a GT-R.

Obviously this is all a matter of personal taste, but I love the 991. How many less horsepower does the 991 S have compared to the 2012 GT3, and yet they get the same time at Nurburgring? And you actually complain?