996 Turbo / GT2 Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2005 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2.

K24 vs 24/18s - can you tell a clear difference?

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  #61  
Old 05-15-2010, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by dreamtripper
So with regards to lag, say you are always above 3000rpm, it shouldn't really be a factor, correct? When I look at dyno charts of various K16 and K24 hybrids, it looks like the torque comes on in a range that only differs by a few hundred rpm under 3000rpm. My K24s (to me) don't really feel "laggy." The only time I really feel lag and a non-linear progression of power is when I'm accelerating from a stand still or RPMs drop to less than 2,000 and I'm accelerating back up through the gears.

Trust me, big difference in lag between 16's and 24's. The lag starts over when there is no load. So even if you are at 3500 rpm's you will have more lag getting to peak boost. But in the 24's it is very noticeable in the lower rpms
 
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by emadelta86
If you lift off the throttle at 4000rpm and then punch it again, you will experience lag as the time that the turbo needs to build boost again after you lifted the throttle.

I think better wg's and intake reduce this "lag".

It would be nice to find a way to keep the turbo on boost while lifting off....like the old Formula 1 turbo cars had (if I remember correctly).
just don't lift off
 
  #63  
Old 05-15-2010, 04:43 PM
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Mikelly has K16/24's with a tune.
 
  #64  
Old 05-15-2010, 05:31 PM
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with my K24's i have full boost 1bar at 4000 RPM
 
  #65  
Old 05-15-2010, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Prche951
Yep, Mikelly has K16's for track use and I doubt he'd switch to K24's.

I did not realize that the 18g wheel was that much heavier that it would hamper spool up but it makes sense.

Where do GT30's and GT35's sit in the A28, K16,K24 size listing?
The larger the wheel, the more weight, the more power, the more lag.

GT30s and 35's are bigger than all of them.

35s, then 30's, then A28's, then K24, then K16.
 
  #66  
Old 05-15-2010, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by dreamtripper
So with regards to lag, say you are always above 3000rpm, it shouldn't really be a factor, correct? When I look at dyno charts of various K16 and K24 hybrids, it looks like the torque comes on in a range that only differs by a few hundred rpm under 3000rpm. My K24s (to me) don't really feel "laggy." The only time I really feel lag and a non-linear progression of power is when I'm accelerating from a stand still or RPMs drop to less than 2,000 and I'm accelerating back up through the gears.
Lag really isn't much of a problem in these cars until you get into the very large turbos. Even than it's not bad, compared to some other cars out there.

As long as you ensure you are always on the proper rpm range, lag is virtually non-existant. I've honestly never understood people's compaints about lag.
 
  #67  
Old 05-15-2010, 05:41 PM
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I think if K24/18g or K24/20g Billet exist the results will be amazing
 
  #68  
Old 05-15-2010, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by ttboost
The minimal difference in lag is greatly outweighed by the performance increase.
Not on the road course it's not. Spooling 1000 rpm on corner exit will not allow the other car to catch up, and at which point it does, it's traveling so fast it compromises the entry into the braking zone.

In other words, quicker exit > higher top speed.

Originally Posted by Divexxtreme
I think the lag in the 18g's is very low, but for Dez's specific purposes, billet K16s may be a better option. They make plenty of power for the road course.
Yes. Especially on tracks where you have turns where you are between gears and can't change gear sets like Corvette's. Rather than add a shift sometimes you'd rather stay in the higher gear, but that puts you in lag zone, so a quicker spooling turbo can save you a lot of time.

Originally Posted by Divexxtreme
The larger the wheel, the more weight, the more power, the more lag.

GT30s and 35's are bigger than all of them.

35s, then 30's, then A28's, then K24, then K16.
I've heard the A28's spool being compared to the K16, is this not true?
 
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Old 05-15-2010, 05:54 PM
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From what I've seen, A28's seem to spool quicker than K24/18g's, but I haven't seen any data comparing them to K16's.
 
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Old 05-15-2010, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by autodynamics
with my K24's i have full boost 1bar at 4000 RPM
are they k24/18g's or k24's?
 
  #71  
Old 05-15-2010, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Divexxtreme
Lag really isn't much of a problem in these cars until you get into the very large turbos. Even than it's not bad, compared to some other cars out there.

As long as you ensure you are always on the proper rpm range, lag is virtually non-existant. I've honestly never understood people's compaints about lag.

This is very true when you compare these cars to other turbo cars. The other day I drove a new Sti and I was shocked at how long it took it to get to full boost, I think it was around 4500 rpm. Of course 20% thinner air doesn't help much, but still I thought for sure it would spool faster than our cars.

HC, you would love how K16 hybrids spool. For track use I am sure they work better.
 
  #72  
Old 05-15-2010, 07:56 PM
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I've heard that when you send your 24's in for the conversion, you can pay a little more and they will port the turbine which will help it spool faster and increase power (slightly). Looks like for 1350 bucks you can send them in to Blouch for the compressor upgrade and a rebuild (they include the 1 bar springs) and then pick yourself a package from a reputable tuner that includes ICs, injectors, spark plugs, DVs, a good ECU program and you're in. It shouldn't cost you a fortune.

http://www.blouchturbo.com/turbos/Po...essor_Upgrade/
 

Last edited by 9Eleven; 05-15-2010 at 08:54 PM.
  #73  
Old 05-15-2010, 09:13 PM
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I'd send them to Mark before any1 else. The K24/18G set up ( I think for less then $1,350 ). He'll get you the right tune and the right mods for what ever your budget or HP goals are.
 
  #74  
Old 05-15-2010, 09:49 PM
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When I had my Porsche and wanted to go faster, I read many posts, countless hours online, called and spoke with several tuners. But more than anything I found one common denominator, BIG$$.. Eventually ended up on this forum and was looking desperately for someone to be sincere about what needed and not needed to be done without trying to "sell me a pkg", and I came across Marek"Marski", he spent many many hours telling me not to be such a hard head and listen to what I actually needed. No more, no less. You know what, he introduced me to Todd "Protomotive" and I never looked back. Even when I was at the track he was helping me out with shift points etc etc. Overall the entire 6speed community is awesome, but, I ended up surpassing any goals I had with a very, very basic 18g package. Marski is genuine and has tons of experience. Bobby his partner has sick fast cars and drives like a mad man. They are an amazing team and you will not get sold on anything YOU DO NOT NEED! There are other tuners that Im sure are awesome... I am just sharing my personal experience and it was a great one. just my .02 cents
 
  #75  
Old 05-15-2010, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Prche951
This is very true when you compare these cars to other turbo cars. The other day I drove a new Sti and I was shocked at how long it took it to get to full boost, I think it was around 4500 rpm. Of course 20% thinner air doesn't help much, but still I thought for sure it would spool faster than our cars.

HC, you would love how K16 hybrids spool. For track use I am sure they work better.

I know. My only problem with K16's is that the only ones that are making the power I will need are the Billet ones (I think) and you have to run a ton of boost or a ton of torque. The boost is less concerning than the torque (rods).

Most, if not all of said kits are new and have not been tested extensively. I'm not one to be a guinea pig no matter who's tuning it. On top of that I believe the K16's have a propensity to fall off on the top end.

I want a kit that drives more NA like, as little torque as possible with HP that climbs to redline but comes in extremely quick. This however may not exists, so I may have to find a middle ground.
 


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