My car (2002 C4S) had its driver's side door lock mechanism fail (apparently a typical problem on these cars and Cayennes). This was confirmed by the dealer and the indie (who happens to be the ex head mechanic at the only local dealer in the country).

I bought the piece at the dealer, but had the indie install it as his labor fee was nearly 1/3 of what the dealer wanted to charge me to replace the part. After much discussion, it appears that I either got the wrong part or the part is defective. Any way you look at it, my driver's side window no longer "dips" to open/close the door, nor my alarm will work to close the car (and when it does, you can still open the driver's side door!).

So, million dollar question is: who pays for the labor to replace this part? Dealer, or me? Who pays to connect the PIWIS and read any error codes? Dealer or me? Dealer's position is that I pay for everything as if I had done it with them (labor) they would take care of it under "warranty". My position is "if you would have sold me the right part or one that was not defective, I would not be in this position". Dealer knows the indie and respect him a lot as he is the only one to actually receive training/certifications at factory.

So, whose side are you on? Just want to see if I am missing something in my reasoning.

 

its hard to say.

obviously if i was in your situation, i'd want the dealer to pay.

however, from a third party standpoint, it really depends.
1) is the part defective, or is the the wrong part?
2) Did the dealer diagnose your car and tell you that you need a specific part #? or was it the indie that told you what part number you needed?
3) why didnt the indie just order the part directly from the dealership? usually the customer doesnt need to be the middle man (atleast thats how it works here, all indies ive been to order from the dealership)

if the dealer diagnosed it and told you that you need the wrong part, yeah they should not only pay but also reimburse a diagnostics fee, however if they simply supplied the correct part but its defective, then that falls on you.

 

1- to determine if the part is defective, they need to install another one, which requires labor, or they can plug the PIWIS to see if any error codes are thrown. In either case, it involves labor (i.e. $$) from the dealer.
2- Dealer and indie diagnosed the car and came to the same conclusion: need a new door lock. Dealer provided me with the part number, price, and item that corresponds, according to them, to the door lock for m car.
3- Indie could have ordered the part in USA, but would have taken 3 weeks for delivery and I was tired of barely being able to get out of my car, so timing was of the essence. USA vs. Lat Am is entirely different as to how things work...

I am pushing the dealer to make things right ($0 from me to diagnose the part, and if in fact it's a defective part, fix it at no cost to me). They may say the part was defective, but they are not responsible for the costs I need to spend to make things right (which as per me, is not right...).

 

In my opinion...

Dealers position is typical of the industry. If you buy parts only, you get a parts-only warranty. Labor to remove/install and any incidental damage is not covered.

If you buy parts & labor from the same place, independent or dealer, you should expect the additional troubleshooting and labor to identify and replace defective new parts to be included, although even in this situation, the dealer will often just sell you a *different* new part blaming something else for the failure.

Usually electrical parts will have no warranty if not installed by the parts seller, as the parts seller has no way of knowing if the part was damaged during the install or by another defect in the system.

Does that suck if you know for absolute certain that the part sold to you was defective and you are on the hook for additional costs? Yes. But one of the reasons shops and dealers charge inflated prices is to cover the occasional times they do a bunch of extra work for free, like when they are on the hook for diagnosing/replacing a defective part that they just sold you and installed.

I'd also say that if your installer 1) can not tell you for certain if it is the correct or incorrect part, and 2) does not have the correct tools to read Porsche diag codes and set configurations, then you should blame him for taking on the work in the first place and yourself for making a bad decision on a shop to work on your car. It is a distinct possibility that the problem has nothing to do with the part...

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Not trying to be overly harsh... Often I will pick a much less expensive shop to do certain work. And sometimes I find they don't know exactly what they are doing and have to step in and tell them how to do it properly or have the work done again at a more experienced (and typically expensive) shop. I accept those occasional misfires and additional costs as acceptable.

 

Tomorrow I shall have a final answer from the dealer's shop manager, but based on many comments heard, it seems that I am screwed. For the record: the installer of the part happens to be the ex head mechanic from the dealer, a person that the dealer still calls upon when they get "tough cases", so his ability to diagnose and fix issues is far better than the dealer's current mechanics. He has all of the tools that the dealer has, with the exception of the PIWIS, but there are other shops in town who do have PIWIS, but not the mechanical skills.
At the end of the day, even if I have to pay again to have the correct part installed by the indie, it will still be cheaper than having paid the dealer. I just don't find fair that one entity (dealer) sells me the wrong part/sells me a defective part and makes me incur in additional expenses due to an error they did, not me.

 

I would side with the dealer. The risk you took is why dealer charges more

If anyone should pay for the labor, it's the Indy. They should test the door lock and window before putting everything back. They should reinstall the right part at no cost or offer a discount

 

The indy did test the door lock once it was installed, but all he checked for was proper operation of locking and unlocking using the key and handles. He did not verify the window operation (doesn't go down to open or close the door) nor did he verify that the alarm doesn't work properly (horn beeps twice, door won't lock). We shall see what comes of this all sooner than later. Thanks for the replies, even if it is not what I wanted to hear!

 

There is a micro switch the lowers the windows. Maybe it got damaged/disconnected during the lock repair.

 

Could be, but that would not explain the fact that if all windows are closed (fully) the alarm will not arm nor will the dash power lock function properly. I have mentally accepted the fact that its a losing battle for me.

 

There are two micro switches on the doors. One for windows and one for the locking/alarm. Sounds like your installer did something wrong.

 

Grab a triple square bit that fits the bolts in the side of door. Sounds like the part isn't seated properly. I had something similar happen when fixing the window not dropping.

Loosen two bolts, move, re-tighten.

 

Before I took it to the dealer today, I called the Indy and he asked me to bring the car by. Long story short, he realized that the main plug on the latch came loose as he apparently did not "click it all the way through". My problem is solved and thankfully I didn't have to do much else.

"To err is human"

 

So in retrospect, was the dealer right or wrong in their position??

 

- this is a tough one to answer... The dealer's position is that they assume no responsibility at all and wanted to get paid to diagnose the part and to replace the part (if need be). That would have worked in this instance as it was an error in the installation of the part they sold me, but what if the case was, as I erroneously originally thought, where the part was in fact defective? In that case, I believe that I am still right as their negligence (be it a defective part or the wrong part) is the sole reason why I would have had to incur additional expenses. As stated before, luckily, it all worked out.

The indie did tell me that in his years at the dealership he had to flat out lie to some customers regarding parts that they (dealership) received that were DOA or defective and the customer had to pay for it anyways. This is one of the many reasons why he left. He has another mechanic that recently left the dealership and he too has had to face customers and tell them false information so the dealer does not accept responsibility.

Yes, the local dealer is "questionable" at best (regarding business practices), but there are no other choices and to top it off, they do a wonderful sales job, so even Porsche Lat Am will not support the end user and instead side with the dealer. Been there, done that, trust me.

 

At the end of the day I think the Dealer's position makes more sense. Without having control of the part after he sold it to you, there's no way he can know if the part was damaged during installation, etc.

The best "compromise" position would have been that the dealer paid for a new part and all labor had the part proven defective, and you would have paid for labor had the part been good and your indy's installation defective.

As it turned out the indy stepped up and fixed his error--kudos to him. You have found a good/honest mechanic.

Now, enjoy the heck out of the car!