Fahrberichte does not mean get a feel. It's a test lap, the Z06's test lap was only 2 seconds slower than the real one.

What dont you understand about the fact that he drove it hard enough to make the statement that even below 7:40 is optimistic and that 7:50 represented the real potential.

That's now TWO respected guys that have driven the GT-R with a little moisture on the track and said even with dry track it wouldnt go much faster.

You are putting to little stock into the driver impressions.

 

This is interesting. Now granted that it's not the same day and not the same driver. But, if it's even remotely accurate, the cars on this list that have much less HP, the RS4, 997 Carrera S, C6 Vette and especially the R33 GTR are only 3 to 2 seconds slower than the current GTR. Again, not the same day and probably not the same conditions and more importantly not the same driver.

7:58 --- 156.66 km/h - Audi RS4 4.2 V8 FSI, 420 PS/ 1650 kg, Frank Stippler, (10/05) www.8200rpm.com/forum/read.php?f=10&i=16841&t=16841\
7:58 --- 156.66 km/h - 2009 Porsche Carrera S (manual transmission) www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=127326
7:59 --- 154.82 km/h - Porsche 997 Carrera S, PASM setting "Performance" (Walter Roehrl WHEELS 06/ 2004)
7:59* -- 154.82 km/h - Chevrolet C6 Z51, company test driver Dave Hill (*mfr.)
7:59* -- 154.82 km/h - Nissan Skyline R33 GT-R (*free of the speed limiter standard on UK versions, so it was discounted) www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/228511/

 

That's what we've seen in NASA time trials with STOCK GT-R's too.

The Nissan GT-R runs ~ equal to the C5 Z06 which puts down almost the same lap times as a C6 Z51.

Note: the C5 Z06's ring time was 7:56 !!!

Of course... NASA doesn't have "The Special Nissan GT-R Driver"...

nor the Ringer GT-R that was used by Nissan @ Nurburgring !!!

Cya @ the track,

Trumper

 

Yeah, one of the very first stock GTRs in America racing against tuned cars. Very fair comparison..

How about when the R35 driven by a newbie beat the legendary Jim Richards in his Porsche GT2 to win the Quit Targa Tasmania road rally in Australia? Less we forget?

Now something doesn't add up here:
- Porsche engineer got 7:38 for the turbo and 7:55 for the GTR
- Harris got 7:49 for GT2 and 7:56 for GTR.
So, does that mean that the turbo is faster than the GT2? I don't think so. Someone is telling big lies here - and i don't think it's Harris.

 

How are you going to compare two different drivers to draw that conclusion?

Your rationale is aweful. The very same guy drove the GT2 to 7:34.

 

Both the Porsche engineer and Harris got similar times in the GTR, (mind you, the Porsche engineer should've been faster because Harris drove on a damp track and with the inferior Bridgestones), and yet the Porsche engineer was substantially quicker in the turbo than Harris was in the GT2. From basic reasoning, you can see that the time of 7:38 that the engineer got for the turbo is total BS.

 

The Porsche engineer was on Bridgestones too, isnt that what you were whining about before? Dont even try to change now to suit your arguement.

You just changed your stance that quick, first it was the GT2 is slower than the Turbo until you forgot that the same guy drove the GT2 faster than the Turbo on the same day.

Anyone who's driven on Sport Cups in the wet can understand Chris' reservations to go all out, especially in a 530 hp rwd car on a bumpy track. But that takes something other than magazine expertise.

I wont argue that Aichtner (sp) probably drove the Porsches harder, because he has to know them like the back of his hand. And that the time of their respective runs, Harris had more seat time in the GT-R and is more familiar with it.

But that's the other thread, the MAIN POINT IS THAT NEITHER OF THEM THINK THE PRODUCTION GT-R IS CAPABLE OF 7:29, SO YOUR DIVERSION TACTICS ARENT GOING TO WORK. HORST VON SAURMA DOESNT THINK SO EITHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

It doesn't matter what people think - it's the result that matters and so far, no one has proven that the 7:29 claim by Nissan - with full video footage is fake!! HVS hasn't even taken the GTR for a super lap yet so it doesn't matter what he thinks. When he does indeed take it for the super lap then we will know. Hell, before the Veyron was made, Gordon Murray (creater of the Mclacen F1) and Jeremy Clarkeson THOUGHT that it was a stupid and childish idea from VW and that the car would be a total disaster. When they finally got to test drive it, they retracted their earlier comments, with Clarkeson even claiming the Veyron to be "the best car ever made".

So you believe that a Porsche engineer can lap the Nurb in the turbo faster than their dedicated test driver? What the hell is he doing being an engineer? He should apply to be a race driver for Formula 1.

 

Well it's looking as though most knowledgable people think...

NISSAN USED A RINGER

when they turned the ~7:29 lap.

No one has come close to duplicating that fabled lap...

in a STOCK GT-R !!!

And if "it doesn't matter what most people think"

why in the World are the GT-R luver's continuing to defend the indefensible ?

When Y'all have to resort to claims like:

" Only A Special Nissan Driver can achieve the times posted by Nissan's PR department"

All LOGIC has been abandoned...

 

7:49-7:40 is 9 seconds not 2, and the 911 was 15 seconds faster then its run.

So your telling me that a 3800lb car in the wet will run the exact same time in the dry as it does on a wet track? If it ran a 7:50 on a wet track its not gonna run the exact same thing on a dry track.

 

It IS a fair comparison. It's funny to see you ignore data when it hurts your argument.

Look at the GT-R's times at Texas Speedway and Road America. Tell me those are times for a "supercar." With a Nissan support crew, the GT-R should have performed MUCH BETTER if it really is a 7:29 N'ring car. I don't care if it was racing against modified cars or not. The time itself tells you something important. In fact, the time tells you how the GT-R did on tracks that most of us (except you) have been at, and have personal data to compare against.

Instead of using magazine data, why don't you take a look at real life. In fact, Chris is the only one that has posted any data about the two cars, and is the only data set I'm willing to look at without bias.

One Lap - easy to forget when you are reading magazines all day long.

 

Ring times do not necessarily translate at other circuits.

From my experience driving both GT2 and M3 CSL on a variety of tracks including Nurburgring, Spa, Silverstone etc etc, there are vast differences in relative performance.

The ring in very technical, very bumpy and whilst it has fast sections, favours a car with handling and balance.

An M3 CSL is almost perfectly matched to a GT3 at the ring and this is reflected in the reported lap-times. On an open GP track, without bumps, where power can be more easily deployed in higher hp cars, then the CSL suffers in comparison and is several seconds a lap slower than a GT3 at, for example, Spa, Silverstone, Donington etc This has been proven by timings and also in my own eyes whilst driving.

I would therefore expect that a GTR would have much more difficulty keeping up with a GT2 on a traditional track than it would have at the ring.

 

What are you talking about? I'm talking about both sport auto laps the super test from sport auto vs the test lap.

 

You cannot be that daft. We have several renowned ring experts driving completely stock productions GT-R's and getting no where near Nissans' time.

No one said the video is fake, we are saying that Nissan used a non production spec car, which seems to be the widespread beleif to anyone who just refuses to believe it.


= Y O U

 

You cant be that daft.

As explained before the damp track was ideal for the GTR. The GTR didnt suffer any handling issues, where it suffered was in the power, braking, tyre and weight department. This is why both Porsche and Driver Republic achieved a similar result for the GTR.

The GT2 on the other hand with 2WD and dry weather tyres was a handful in the wet. CH has to lift off on many corners, short shift, and fishtail his way through the track. CH believed that the GT2 can hit the 7:30 Porsche time, it was just the condition and the driver that prevented it.



More from Driver Republic.
A side by side video with commentary of handling characteristics for every bend and where time can be gained/where it has been lost.
http://blog.drivers-republic.com/?p=201