Going Green -

Why get Cabon Fiber at all then? If he spent thousands to get it with the car and its not routine wear plus he documented it all along then if Porsche doesn't replace it why should he ? I've seen some aftermarket pieces which look nice but there are others that look like they are ill fitting and cheap (just my opinion) .. in fact I think carbon fiber in general looks cheap despite its high price. Plus the center stack on his car is aluminum and carbon doesn't even match (compared to a leather one),

Carbon was very nice 10 years ago when it first came out . NOW .. in my opinion it's dated . And BTW I do have carbon in my car .. but NOT in the cabin . It's great for an intake in the engine and oddly enough my carbon intake is NOT worn out despite the engine heat .

So I agree that its not just the heat .. but the overall quality on interior pieces just doesn't cut it ... In my personal opinion it's pure high priced ugly ghetto styled bling crap ( that adds nothing to the drivability of a car).

PLUS -- he'd still have to pay to buy it and always have doubts as to whether this would happen again .

My vote = replace it with aluminum id Porsche won't replace it . Spend as little as possible . The car is 6 years old .. save the money.

 

yrralis,

Weather or not it looks cool isn't mine or anyone else's concern but the OP. I'm just giving an experts advice on why its bowing/warping.

(Carbon fiber being dated? Lol yes lets progress back to alum, steel, maybe mahogany even. Get use to it because as chemical and mechanical technology advances this material will be used on almost everything.)

I did say "reputable" So you wont have to worry about it replacing it. If its done right from a "reputable'" company it won't have to replaced for probably a life time.

My 2c was to just explain why the possible reasons in which this is happening and what the next option would be considering the OP still likes the "look" of CF.

B

 

You might try contacting Eric over at bumperplugs. He does quite alot of carbon fiber products.

 

That's how it should have been on day 1 but we are discussing 6 years later on an older car . Unless there's another side to the story (we only read his but for the sake of discussion lets say he's being truthful) ....then he ought not have to spend a dime . If he does have to incur an expense it ought to be the least possible.

Anything he spends is just total loss on resale and whether one agreess or not on aethetics (personal opinion) .. one thing is precise .. the price ... and carbon is not cheap .

 

Sé exactamente a lo que te refieres.

 

What do you mean crime wise or just old school people bump into it and not notice or care stuff?

I am moving to Europe soon, I was looking into Barc. cause la esposa y hablo español

B

 

Just a thought... Carbon fiber is generally very stiff (at least in one direction, although it can be isotropic). I bet this could simply be a CTE mismatch and/or poor adhesive choices. For example, say the car interior thermal cycles as it would on any normal day. The foam dash underlayment expands as it heats up. The carbon parts expand at different rates. If the adhesive used has a poor peel strength and/or is not low enough in durometer to withstand the shearing forces from the expansion, parts start popping off after repeated cycling.

Now you wouldn't have this problem with a leather (or soft plastic cover), because the leather would stretch and contract with the underlayment. Although we all know with plastics, after a while they outgas, become more brittle, and can eventually crack, and leather can have it own issues, but that is another story.

Now, as for what to do. If you can't get Porsche to fix it. I'd ask some adhesive experts, like Henkel, what they'd recommend. Then find a shop to help you fix it. Or if you're a DIYer, have at it.

 

thanks for your help, but anyway it doesn't really matter if you think that carbon fiber is outdated or old style, it is an accessory Porsche sells, and as it should the the quality required for the price you pay. Besides this, the probably the way to repair it will be to substitute it from an aftermarket carbon fiber as you are suggesting. I know some people wont like th interior but that has nothing to do with the quality requirements, and this car is a car that is not supposed to be sold in the close future, i mean, i didn't buy this car intentionally to sell it i just did it for fun.

Relating to the safetly of Spanish roads, don't worry too much probably is the same as other countries but i just prefeer not to leave it outside, and i'm living in a city near Barcelona so if someone is thinking about moving here don't worry too much thats a nice place to live

thanks

 

I agree that the quality ought to satisfactory from day 1 . It's an expensive option .
I don't feel the cheapest way to repair it is to replace it .
The cheapest way is for Porsche to replace it for you with OEM for FREE and retain your loyalty as a customer

BUT --
since we don't get to hear their side of this .. (as well as see the complete documentation and the methods you chose to notify them when it wasn't resolved ) ..
Then all i can say is good luck.

 

I bought many stuff from Ray at RotTEC and it seems the quality is amazing! I'm always happy with his products and had time to compare his to OEM. To this day, I'm not sure what Porsche produce actually was real carbon fiber or just overlay like aftermarket products. There seems to be many many different CF combinations out there. Can anyone confirm if oem products are actually real CF?

 

It seems from the video that even OEM parts are overlay? It peels right off.

 

What about this production error where the weave of the carbon fiber meet?

 

The way of claiming was the official done by Porsche, first i refered to the Porsche Center where they took photos of everything that failed and after they transfered the complain to Porsche Iberica, few weeks after they called me from the PC telling that they could do nothing and telling me to call to Porsche Iberica directly, that was what i did, then i also applied for a complain and actually they contacted my PC for the photos and documents. Few weeks later i received an email form Porsche saying bye bye we wont do anything. I have all the documents in my hand, i mean, i did what it was supposed to be done.

thanks!

 

CF composites are normally used to provide high strength with low weight. The parts are normally made with thermoset resins and do not look very nice. That is, not designed for interior trim pieces. The production process is low volume / high cost with many defects that normally need to be discarded-not very efficient. They can afortd to waste a lot of money when producing aircraft but not cars.

The CF parts used for trim pieces in cars are there for the wrong reasons... because "it looks cool". There needs to be a high gloss surface. Therefore, traditional CF composite resins are not used. If the clear resin is turning yellow, I am sure it is polycarbonate....... a not so high-tech resin. Since these parts are produced in relatively low volume, the quality very likely will not live up to the high cost compared to traditional engineering plastics that are injection molded. The latter is a much more developed process. I personally would stay away from CF trim pieces. The plain plastic ( or metal) parts are cheaper and will last much longer.

 

Of course i keep all the records for the maintainance that has been done, and a lawsuit (or something similar here in Spain) is already started up and in course.

Another thing that i would say relating to your post is that when i claimed porsche because the CF parts were getting off they said they would stick them again, as i am not a CF expert, when i collected the car it looked ok. That is why i agreed to sign the car paper back, i mean, it is not my job to know technically how CF works, now i know that because i have this problem but when i leave the car to a PC i expect to get it repaired/serviced perfectly, thats what i pay for.

In Spain they are oblied to give two year warranty for the repaired parts and since the last repair regarding to the CF was done back in 2009 i am using this trying to get it repaired again but they played bad because in the form they just wrote: Review of the CF complements. They didn't write repairment or something similar... i couldn't expect this to happen as i am not an expert in this kind of materials.

Maybe i played a noob part but i couldn't expect this from a brand as Porsche, i hope you all agree with me, and probably i could have done more in the back but they glued it and it looked ok until one year or so later that suddenly it become worst.

I know they are a company and they are supposed to keep care of themselves, but me, as a customer i don't think i desire this treatment.

If you want i can show you the mail we had between porsche and me where they directly refused to help me or even consider helping.

Thanks!