A Modded Car
A Modded Car
"Selling a Modded Car"
6speed friends:
I have modded cars in the past. Sometimes extensively. Each time I have meticulously reversed the mods to put back the car to stock condition before trading in.
I have a modded 2011 911 Turbo S. GT silver on black. I wouldn't call it extensively modded as everything is easily reversible. However, I am toying with the idea of selling the car as is. There is a reason. First and foremost I am very lucky and have a 991 TTS that I just finished a FBO/meth/upgraded turbo set up. I also have a 991.2 GT3 coming. I don't need all 3 cars. The 997.2 is both a straight line and track car where the 991 TTS will be straight line only and the GT3 will be track only. So that's my reason for selling the 997.2. Some redundancy.
So why sell it modded when I can probably make more $ by putting the car back to stock and selling the mods? Well, yes true, but it would be a shame to do so. In my opinion, this could be one of the most dialed in street car on the planet. My straight line exploits have been documented here extensively and while not discussed here much is all of the time, effort and money has been allocating to setting it up as a terrific track car as well. Now, how many cars can be actually driven to airstrip or road course events - beat virtually everything including trailered cars that show up to those events - and then driven home....and then driven to work and back the next day? That's what this car is about. I don't know any other car that can do this with the same level of performance, consistency or reliability except the absurdly expensive hypercars like P918.
One other note about the suspension build - it was done by GMG. It's a proprietary setup that maximizes both track and straight line disciplines. The configuration was done by GMG tech Sergey, who tracked his own 997 Turbo. Sergey did all the work on the car and it was fine tuned over a period of time. Little tweaks here and there until it was perfect. When he unexpectedly passed, so did the knowledge of the set up.
So even if someone had my exact mods and put the car together, it likely wouldn't perform the same.
The best scenario is to sell the car to an enthusiast who will keep doing what I've been doing. But do people even want to buy a modded car? This is an area I don't know at all. And how would I think about pricing?
I have all stock parts except intercoolers. I even have a set of PCCB direct replacement Brembo steel rotors and pads that haven't been installed yet that would go to the new owner. Car has 43,500 miles and was a $174k MSRP. Car has seen 4 track days and dozens of airstrip events and 1/4 mile. Not hiding anything. No deferred maintenance - car needs nothing is ready to go. Here is the car and mod list:
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...ml#post4032383
Cheers.
6speed friends:
I have modded cars in the past. Sometimes extensively. Each time I have meticulously reversed the mods to put back the car to stock condition before trading in.
I have a modded 2011 911 Turbo S. GT silver on black. I wouldn't call it extensively modded as everything is easily reversible. However, I am toying with the idea of selling the car as is. There is a reason. First and foremost I am very lucky and have a 991 TTS that I just finished a FBO/meth/upgraded turbo set up. I also have a 991.2 GT3 coming. I don't need all 3 cars. The 997.2 is both a straight line and track car where the 991 TTS will be straight line only and the GT3 will be track only. So that's my reason for selling the 997.2. Some redundancy.
So why sell it modded when I can probably make more $ by putting the car back to stock and selling the mods? Well, yes true, but it would be a shame to do so. In my opinion, this could be one of the most dialed in street car on the planet. My straight line exploits have been documented here extensively and while not discussed here much is all of the time, effort and money has been allocating to setting it up as a terrific track car as well. Now, how many cars can be actually driven to airstrip or road course events - beat virtually everything including trailered cars that show up to those events - and then driven home....and then driven to work and back the next day? That's what this car is about. I don't know any other car that can do this with the same level of performance, consistency or reliability except the absurdly expensive hypercars like P918.
One other note about the suspension build - it was done by GMG. It's a proprietary setup that maximizes both track and straight line disciplines. The configuration was done by GMG tech Sergey, who tracked his own 997 Turbo. Sergey did all the work on the car and it was fine tuned over a period of time. Little tweaks here and there until it was perfect. When he unexpectedly passed, so did the knowledge of the set up.
So even if someone had my exact mods and put the car together, it likely wouldn't perform the same.
The best scenario is to sell the car to an enthusiast who will keep doing what I've been doing. But do people even want to buy a modded car? This is an area I don't know at all. And how would I think about pricing?
I have all stock parts except intercoolers. I even have a set of PCCB direct replacement Brembo steel rotors and pads that haven't been installed yet that would go to the new owner. Car has 43,500 miles and was a $174k MSRP. Car has seen 4 track days and dozens of airstrip events and 1/4 mile. Not hiding anything. No deferred maintenance - car needs nothing is ready to go. Here is the car and mod list:
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...ml#post4032383
Cheers.
Last edited by longboarder; May 25, 2017 at 06:24 PM.
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Great looking car and love to see the runway exploits!
#1: Yes, people will purchase modified cars, however you obviously greatly reduce your buyer pool as a result of modifications. I for one have spent entirely too much money taking cars from stock to full-tilt and now seek out cars that are properly modified and with responsible owners as a means of reducing my overall investment in the car. Which brings me to the below:
#2: There really isn't a great way to properly factor the modifications into an increased asking price. Most people acknowledge that to the right buyer (me in some cases) the mods are worth anywhere from $.30-$.50/$1 of their initial value upon resale. However thats a very rough number and in some cases, I've seen heavily modified cars sell for zero premium to stock cars.
For ease, I would sell modified but not at a huge premium. For maximizing $, definitely return to stock as the parts on their own are clearly worth more individually than they are installed on the car.
#1: Yes, people will purchase modified cars, however you obviously greatly reduce your buyer pool as a result of modifications. I for one have spent entirely too much money taking cars from stock to full-tilt and now seek out cars that are properly modified and with responsible owners as a means of reducing my overall investment in the car. Which brings me to the below:
#2: There really isn't a great way to properly factor the modifications into an increased asking price. Most people acknowledge that to the right buyer (me in some cases) the mods are worth anywhere from $.30-$.50/$1 of their initial value upon resale. However thats a very rough number and in some cases, I've seen heavily modified cars sell for zero premium to stock cars.
For ease, I would sell modified but not at a huge premium. For maximizing $, definitely return to stock as the parts on their own are clearly worth more individually than they are installed on the car.
I will be sad to see it go but like you said, selling it as is to another enthusiast who will use it the same way you did would be a great scenario.
I think selling items such as the wheels & seats can get you more money rather than selling with the car while still retaining the bolt-on's & suspension setup which is the bread and butter of the car's success.
I think selling items such as the wheels & seats can get you more money rather than selling with the car while still retaining the bolt-on's & suspension setup which is the bread and butter of the car's success.
Great looking car and love to see the runway exploits!
#1: Yes, people will purchase modified cars, however you obviously greatly reduce your buyer pool as a result of modifications. I for one have spent entirely too much money taking cars from stock to full-tilt and now seek out cars that are properly modified and with responsible owners as a means of reducing my overall investment in the car. Which brings me to the below:
#2: There really isn't a great way to properly factor the modifications into an increased asking price. Most people acknowledge that to the right buyer (me in some cases) the mods are worth anywhere from $.30-$.50/$1 of their initial value upon resale. However thats a very rough number and in some cases, I've seen heavily modified cars sell for zero premium to stock cars.
For ease, I would sell modified but not at a huge premium. For maximizing $, definitely return to stock as the parts on their own are clearly worth more individually than they are installed on the car.
#1: Yes, people will purchase modified cars, however you obviously greatly reduce your buyer pool as a result of modifications. I for one have spent entirely too much money taking cars from stock to full-tilt and now seek out cars that are properly modified and with responsible owners as a means of reducing my overall investment in the car. Which brings me to the below:
#2: There really isn't a great way to properly factor the modifications into an increased asking price. Most people acknowledge that to the right buyer (me in some cases) the mods are worth anywhere from $.30-$.50/$1 of their initial value upon resale. However thats a very rough number and in some cases, I've seen heavily modified cars sell for zero premium to stock cars.
For ease, I would sell modified but not at a huge premium. For maximizing $, definitely return to stock as the parts on their own are clearly worth more individually than they are installed on the car.
I will be sad to see it go but like you said, selling it as is to another enthusiast who will use it the same way you did would be a great scenario.
I think selling items such as the wheels & seats can get you more money rather than selling with the car while still retaining the bolt-on's & suspension setup which is the bread and butter of the car's success.
I think selling items such as the wheels & seats can get you more money rather than selling with the car while still retaining the bolt-on's & suspension setup which is the bread and butter of the car's success.
Thx for the input gents. I am definitely looking to keep the car together rather than maximize my cash proceeds. Look I'm not completely altruistic but I've been very blessed in my life with some good financial choices and also the sake of not having to put the car back to stock and deal with part out is worth something to me. Stuff like the seats and wheels while I could sell for a good chunk of change, but I believe also give this car that extra edge so would be a shame to sell those or anything on the car.
And there is an emotional tie to this car as someone who likes to participate in enthusiast straight line and track events - seriously what could be better? And I would like to see the buyer to continue to have fun for years to come.
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Who ever is looking for a 997.2 and is looking to mod, would be crazy to pass up a proven, reliable , well rounded killer of a machine like this!!
Who ever gets this machine literally has nothing to do other then turn the key and enjoy!
Who ever gets this machine literally has nothing to do other then turn the key and enjoy!
Small buyer pool for a modded car. I've tried to sell modded cars and trucks in the past, none of them over 25k. You get a lot of tire kickers but people conclude that you probably abused the car or "rode it hard.". The people who are high on having a modded car are usually young and can't afford it. My cars sat on the market for months. When I put them back to stock they sold in a week or two. I'm not saying it is impossible but you are likely to have a tough time finding an enthusiast buyer.
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That's always a tough situation. I have owned and bought and sold a total of 103 cars - well, minus the 4 cars that I currently own and some have been very modified while others were left completely unmolested.
As you already know, you will never get 100% of what you have put into a car (parts alone) and will never get the time spent dialing things in, addressing issues, tweaking the car, etc.
At the same time, once you have dialed in a car 100%, it makes no sense back-tracking. My EVT car is the same way. There is NOTHING I would change to it right now as the car performs flawlessly in every category (corners and straight line acceleration) and in terms of looks and interior, it is exactly what I wanted in a 997.1. If and when I sell it, I will change NOTHING. If someone buys it, they will buy it as is and they will get a hell of car. I would most likely get more money taking things off, swapping parts for stock, but, what would the purpose be? Make a little more money, at a risk of the car not performing well or taking away some of the feel that makes the car shine? No.
I know someone will appreciate the car for what it is and they would be willing to pay a premium. How much of a premium is only determined by the buyer. Some will pay top dollar if the car is EXACTLY what they want, but let's be real, modifications will never bring what they are worth. My car for example has modifications in excess of US$ 100,000. For me to expect to get that much out of my car on top of what a stock car with 30,000 miles would bring, would be, criminal...LOL. I think I should be able to get 20-30% more maybe...
Again...that is a tough topic. But, if I were you, I would price it at what YOU think it is fair and go from there. If it sells, awesome...if it doesn't, then adjust the pricing based on feedback until you get to the sweet spot. You will know when that is. If you still are not getting the response/outcome you want, then you can take it from there and look at parting it out or at keeping it.
As you already know, you will never get 100% of what you have put into a car (parts alone) and will never get the time spent dialing things in, addressing issues, tweaking the car, etc.
At the same time, once you have dialed in a car 100%, it makes no sense back-tracking. My EVT car is the same way. There is NOTHING I would change to it right now as the car performs flawlessly in every category (corners and straight line acceleration) and in terms of looks and interior, it is exactly what I wanted in a 997.1. If and when I sell it, I will change NOTHING. If someone buys it, they will buy it as is and they will get a hell of car. I would most likely get more money taking things off, swapping parts for stock, but, what would the purpose be? Make a little more money, at a risk of the car not performing well or taking away some of the feel that makes the car shine? No.
I know someone will appreciate the car for what it is and they would be willing to pay a premium. How much of a premium is only determined by the buyer. Some will pay top dollar if the car is EXACTLY what they want, but let's be real, modifications will never bring what they are worth. My car for example has modifications in excess of US$ 100,000. For me to expect to get that much out of my car on top of what a stock car with 30,000 miles would bring, would be, criminal...LOL. I think I should be able to get 20-30% more maybe...
Again...that is a tough topic. But, if I were you, I would price it at what YOU think it is fair and go from there. If it sells, awesome...if it doesn't, then adjust the pricing based on feedback until you get to the sweet spot. You will know when that is. If you still are not getting the response/outcome you want, then you can take it from there and look at parting it out or at keeping it.
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I think there is a small market for modded cars. (Especially yours) I think it may take some time to find the right Buyer. I would think it would be someone on the forums looking to upgrade to a modified TTS. Someone who doesn't want to put the time and money into doing it himself.
But if you decide on a quick (and likely the most profitable) sale... Parting and selling as stock is usually the way to go. And may I call your ic's... My stock ic's only have 19k miles... For the record, I have always modded my cars and have always felt the way you are feeling. But in the end, parting was always the way to go for me.
But if you decide on a quick (and likely the most profitable) sale... Parting and selling as stock is usually the way to go. And may I call your ic's...
My stock ic's only have 19k miles... For the record, I have always modded my cars and have always felt the way you are feeling. But in the end, parting was always the way to go for me.
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Conventional wisdom suggests that a modded car is (1) not worth the sum of it's parts and (2) is usually worth more in the eyes of the seller (person who modded the car) because it was done to his/her tastes and specifications. If/when I sell my lightly modded TTS, I will factor in (i) max return $$$ and (ii) speed of sale when deciding whether to revert to stock and sell the AM parts or try to sell it "as is". I will likely be reverting back to stock for re-sale.
GLWS Adam, your car is a truly exceptional build I hope you find a buyer for it "as is"...my car isn't nearly as famous!
GLWS Adam, your car is a truly exceptional build I hope you find a buyer for it "as is"...my car isn't nearly as famous!
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I agree with most that have posted, its a weird market for modded cars. And I agree that usually a modded car will have a return of an extra 10-40% from the sum of parts purchased( Especially based on the platform). I think if your time frame for selling is irrelevant you have a better chance of getting a little more return on the parts with pricing it a little higher by just being patient for the right buyer. If you want to sell it quickly, price it closer to the 10% markup and it wont last long at all especially you having most of the stock parts. Someone that wants to try to buy or build a 997.2 is going to make out great regardless.
I will definitely miss watching you pilot this 997 at 1/2mile and destroying
Wish you luck
I will definitely miss watching you pilot this 997 at 1/2mile and destroying
Wish you luck
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When I'm in the market foresearch my next toy I'll be looking for a molded car that's well sorted and documented. The thrill for me is not the build its the result so if I can save time and money by finding a built car I'm game. GLWS
Small buyer pool for a modded car. I've tried to sell modded cars and trucks in the past, none of them over 25k. You get a lot of tire kickers but people conclude that you probably abused the car or "rode it hard.". The people who are high on having a modded car are usually young and can't afford it. My cars sat on the market for months. When I put them back to stock they sold in a week or two. I'm not saying it is impossible but you are likely to have a tough time finding an enthusiast buyer.
That's always a tough situation. I have owned and bought and sold a total of 103 cars - well, minus the 4 cars that I currently own and some have been very modified while others were left completely unmolested.
As you already know, you will never get 100% of what you have put into a car (parts alone) and will never get the time spent dialing things in, addressing issues, tweaking the car, etc.
At the same time, once you have dialed in a car 100%, it makes no sense back-tracking. My EVT car is the same way. There is NOTHING I would change to it right now as the car performs flawlessly in every category (corners and straight line acceleration) and in terms of looks and interior, it is exactly what I wanted in a 997.1. If and when I sell it, I will change NOTHING. If someone buys it, they will buy it as is and they will get a hell of car. I would most likely get more money taking things off, swapping parts for stock, but, what would the purpose be? Make a little more money, at a risk of the car not performing well or taking away some of the feel that makes the car shine? No.
I know someone will appreciate the car for what it is and they would be willing to pay a premium. How much of a premium is only determined by the buyer. Some will pay top dollar if the car is EXACTLY what they want, but let's be real, modifications will never bring what they are worth. My car for example has modifications in excess of US$ 100,000. For me to expect to get that much out of my car on top of what a stock car with 30,000 miles would bring, would be, criminal...LOL. I think I should be able to get 20-30% more maybe...
Again...that is a tough topic. But, if I were you, I would price it at what YOU think it is fair and go from there. If it sells, awesome...if it doesn't, then adjust the pricing based on feedback until you get to the sweet spot. You will know when that is. If you still are not getting the response/outcome you want, then you can take it from there and look at parting it out or at keeping it.
As you already know, you will never get 100% of what you have put into a car (parts alone) and will never get the time spent dialing things in, addressing issues, tweaking the car, etc.
At the same time, once you have dialed in a car 100%, it makes no sense back-tracking. My EVT car is the same way. There is NOTHING I would change to it right now as the car performs flawlessly in every category (corners and straight line acceleration) and in terms of looks and interior, it is exactly what I wanted in a 997.1. If and when I sell it, I will change NOTHING. If someone buys it, they will buy it as is and they will get a hell of car. I would most likely get more money taking things off, swapping parts for stock, but, what would the purpose be? Make a little more money, at a risk of the car not performing well or taking away some of the feel that makes the car shine? No.
I know someone will appreciate the car for what it is and they would be willing to pay a premium. How much of a premium is only determined by the buyer. Some will pay top dollar if the car is EXACTLY what they want, but let's be real, modifications will never bring what they are worth. My car for example has modifications in excess of US$ 100,000. For me to expect to get that much out of my car on top of what a stock car with 30,000 miles would bring, would be, criminal...LOL. I think I should be able to get 20-30% more maybe...
Again...that is a tough topic. But, if I were you, I would price it at what YOU think it is fair and go from there. If it sells, awesome...if it doesn't, then adjust the pricing based on feedback until you get to the sweet spot. You will know when that is. If you still are not getting the response/outcome you want, then you can take it from there and look at parting it out or at keeping it.
I think there is a small market for modded cars. (Especially yours) I think it may take some time to find the right Buyer. I would think it would be someone on the forums looking to upgrade to a modified TTS. Someone who doesn't want to put the time and money into doing it himself.
But if you decide on a quick (and likely the most profitable) sale... Parting and selling as stock is usually the way to go. And may I call your ic's... My stock ic's only have 19k miles... For the record, I have always modded my cars and have always felt the way you are feeling. But in the end, parting was always the way to go for me.
But if you decide on a quick (and likely the most profitable) sale... Parting and selling as stock is usually the way to go. And may I call your ic's...
My stock ic's only have 19k miles... For the record, I have always modded my cars and have always felt the way you are feeling. But in the end, parting was always the way to go for me.Conventional wisdom suggests that a modded car is (1) not worth the sum of it's parts and (2) is usually worth more in the eyes of the seller (person who modded the car) because it was done to his/her tastes and specifications. If/when I sell my lightly modded TTS, I will factor in (i) max return $$$ and (ii) speed of sale when deciding whether to revert to stock and sell the AM parts or try to sell it "as is". I will likely be reverting back to stock for re-sale.
GLWS Adam, your car is a truly exceptional build I hope you find a buyer for it "as is"...my car isn't nearly as famous!
GLWS Adam, your car is a truly exceptional build I hope you find a buyer for it "as is"...my car isn't nearly as famous!
I agree with most that have posted, its a weird market for modded cars. And I agree that usually a modded car will have a return of an extra 10-40% from the sum of parts purchased( Especially based on the platform). I think if your time frame for selling is irrelevant you have a better chance of getting a little more return on the parts with pricing it a little higher by just being patient for the right buyer. If you want to sell it quickly, price it closer to the 10% markup and it wont last long at all especially you having most of the stock parts. Someone that wants to try to buy or build a 997.2 is going to make out great regardless.
I will definitely miss watching you pilot this 997 at 1/2mile and destroying
Wish you luck
I will definitely miss watching you pilot this 997 at 1/2mile and destroying
Wish you luck
Thanks everyone for the wisdom and nice words.
The car hasn't been put up for sale yet I have multiple offers at a price that is apparently very realistic (priced at trade in assuming it's stock plus a small fraction % of the mods). The first person who contacted me has the first right to the car. So hopefully it works out and it stays in the 6speed family. The second person in line is actually is long time friend and someone who knows the car.
I live no regrets. But it's going to be hard and very expensive to do this over again. Basically I will need two cars at 3 times the cost to achieve what the silver bullet can do on the airstrip and track.
Anyway much appreciate the insights here and I'm not going anywhere. #Porscheforever.
Cheers.
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I think a car as well-modded and well-known as this one will find a buyer and at a decent price, but the question is about time. As others mentioned, the buyer pool is significantly reduced and you'll have to have a lot more patience and time to wait for the right buyer to come along and be willing to pay fair value for it.
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^ This.
My previous car was a highly modified Lotus Exige that was set up to race. Almost nothing was untouched, and I thought I would be doing some wheel-to-wheel racing with the Lotus Cup, CFRA, or SCCA. The engine had beefed up internals, the car was fully caged (including door bars), and it had window nets, fire suppression system, battery cutoff, racing seats, 6-point harnesses, and full carbon fiber aero bits like a trunk mounted wing with chassis reinforcement and front dive planes/canards, among many other things. I decided to sell it because it spent 360 days a year in my garage and I never found time to race it. I listed for what I felt was a fair price and I had the time and patience to wait for the right buyer. I got lots of lowball offers, and turned them all down. My rationale was that it was costing me a little over $2K annually to insure it, and taking $5K less than my ask was equivalent to me just keeping it and driving it for another 2+ years. About a year later, the right buyer came along and bought it for essentially my asking price, and he was looking forward to racing it.
My previous car was a highly modified Lotus Exige that was set up to race. Almost nothing was untouched, and I thought I would be doing some wheel-to-wheel racing with the Lotus Cup, CFRA, or SCCA. The engine had beefed up internals, the car was fully caged (including door bars), and it had window nets, fire suppression system, battery cutoff, racing seats, 6-point harnesses, and full carbon fiber aero bits like a trunk mounted wing with chassis reinforcement and front dive planes/canards, among many other things. I decided to sell it because it spent 360 days a year in my garage and I never found time to race it. I listed for what I felt was a fair price and I had the time and patience to wait for the right buyer. I got lots of lowball offers, and turned them all down. My rationale was that it was costing me a little over $2K annually to insure it, and taking $5K less than my ask was equivalent to me just keeping it and driving it for another 2+ years. About a year later, the right buyer came along and bought it for essentially my asking price, and he was looking forward to racing it.