Exactly my thoughts.

 

My thoughts exactly (twice now ).

 

Yes, they've made money and lost me as a potential customer. I'm sure they don't care. But Aston has survived and gotten to where it is because its owners have cared about making something truly special. Sure, they should have paid more attention to the bottom line at various (many) times during their 100 years. But when the bottom line is as all-powerful as it is now at VW/Bentley, the cars just aren't as special and desirable.

Does anyone who buys a Conti GT have the same level of passion for it as many of us who own Astons?

 

In contrast to Aston Martin, for most of its history Lotus hasn't built its own engines, and it hasn't built its own engines since the Esprit. That said, I like the Evora a lot, and the Elise/Exige are great cars. I haven't driven an Elise or Exige, but I have driven the Evora. I thought it handled extremely well, had fantastic steering and somehow, even though it's very heavy for a Lotus, still had that Lotus lightweight feel. However, that off-the-shelf, reliable, efficient Toyota engine was by far the least interesting part of the car, and to me that's a significant issue. It works very well, but it's rather uninspiring. "Uninspiring" is something that should never be said about the engine of a sports car. It could never be said about any Aston Martin engine.

 

So you'd rather have the ****box Ford engines with 20 year old technology that are in Astons now than have state of the art AMG slugs just for the sake of being different? Ford even has better engines than the ones they put in Astons today. By your logic a custom engine based off of a 1980s Yugo would be better to have in your AM than a new off the shelf AMG slug because it would be bespoke. Do you realize how retarded you sound? Do you even realize that basically all the parts in your AM are made by contract mfgrs and the car is just assembled by AM?

 

You are taking his comment to the ridiculous extreme (1980's Yugo) to support your thesis as though it's self evident. It is not "retarded" to want a unique engine in your Aston Martin. Where it gets tricky is how much of the engine needs to be bespoke before it is considered an Aston engine rather than AMG.

 

2) Current Aston engines aren't "***box Ford engines." Perhaps you should learn something about their design and development rather than repeating the uninformed-but-frequently-repeated notion that they're simply Ford engines.

3) Ford engines, even when they're "merely" Ford engines, aren't ****box engines. Have you no knowledge of the millions of Ford engines powering taxis (among other things) that routinely cover a reliable half-million plus miles?

4) If everything were perfect, and identical, it would be quite boring. So yes, differences matter, and variety makes things interesting. It's why some people prefer Astons, some prefer Ferraris, some prefer Porsches...

5) You mean Bosch builds electronic stuff? Aston hasn't manufactured its own gearbox since the David Brown 4-speed? No way!!!

6) By your reasoning, if an AMG car is the state of the art, then what we should all really want is an AMG wearing Aston Martin badges. Silly me! I didn't realize how awesome that would be


Edited to add: BTW, if you pay attention to what I've written in my posts, you'll see that I have never suggested that Aston should just continue with the current engines in their current form, but rather that they need to catch up from a tech standpoint. It's how they do it that matters, and if they drop another firm's engines into Astons, it would be a crying shame.

 

well I am not unhappy about AMG as the choice going fwd! better than say BMW, just my thoughts from a brand point of view, personally liking the AMG power and reliability.
However what will it do to the resale value of our existing cars? make the bottom drop out even further? or make a low miler that is immaculate even more collectable who knows??

The thing with Audi and Lambo is valid and makes the R8/ Gallardo not desirable, but if I had the space and the cash I would not object to an Aventador sharing my garage with my Vantage and I dont think anyone would care who built the motor or drive train.

 

Would you prefer they go out of business and stay "true" to the brand vs. create a partnership which allows them to continue to exist?

 

I think this is all a perception issue.
AMG are the initials of the new facility for Aston engines; Aston Martin Germany.

 

I think this says it all.

It is hard to understand the pronouncements of some here that they will not buy an Aston Martin with an AMG/Mercedes engine. Say it as many times as you want. Nobody cares and we heard you the first time. Especially Aston Martin does not care about the people who make this statement. Stamping your feet and demanding that they continue with the old Ford stuff is pointless. They spend hundreds of thousands if not millions on market studies. Rest assured that Aston knows exactly what the vast majority of its buyers want and is taking the right steps to stay in business and grow its business.

Consider this:

Aston didn't have variable valve timing in the V-12s until recently, and that showed up like what, 10 years later than others (on the back of the One-77)? There is still no direct injection, everybody else has had that for like 5 years maybe?

Engines aside, transmissions are also a problem that Mercedes can solve.

Look at the drop in sales numbers this year, even with launching the new Vanquish. I drove one two months ago. Beautiful car. Sexy car. The transmission is an old 6 speed piece that has been around for ages and in my estimation after driving not up to the promise of this car. Embarassingly old technology in a $300k car. The dash set up won't take a stick either I don't think. I would otherwise buy a Vanquish today if it had a decent transmission. They have lost my sale and I am an existing owner who wants to buy their cars. If you doubt this go drive one for yourself.

Look at how the transmission in the One-77 was panned, or in the new V12S for that matter. Hard to say if its the software, hardware or what but it doesn't matter. They can't figure it out or move it any farther forward. According to Motor Trend, Aston says a DCT can't even be put in the platform. I will not buy a Vanquish until they address the engine and the transmission.

ASTON WILL GO OUT OF BUSINESS WITHOUT NEW TECHNOLOGY INJECTION FOR ENGINES AND TRANSMISSIONS.

Aston does not have a choice but to do this deal and take these engines. They are lucky to get AMG.

So let's see, they have two choices:
1) Stick with the old Ford based stuff and go bankrupt, sell to even a less desireable set of owners and reverse all the progress of the last decade, or
2) Put the highest engine technology in the world in the car, build on the success, and take the company to the next level and lose a few sales to people who object to AMG?

Nothing personal to anybody, no insults intended. Everybody is free to believe what they want and buy whatever they want.

 

Perhaps Ricardo would have been a better choice for engine supplier. They are building an amazing engine for McLaren!

 

The ZF trans in the Vanquish is not embarrassingly old tech. It is a thoroughly modern torque converter auto. The fact that it has 6 speeds instead of the 8 in some later versions is not a 'tech' determiner. And I have driven it and find it perfectly suits the character of the car and its intended audience. To suggest that the Vanq is not equipped with a "decent transmission" calls into question your objectivity in the matter.

If you would run out and buy a Vanq if it had a manual trans, then why don't you go out and buy a DBS?

Without AMG, Aston would go on as it always has since it's primary fan base is not driven by ultimate performance, as so many here seem to be.

 

Aston can't sustain the way they are running today. They are taking a net loss and their sales are down even with a new DB9 and flagship Vanquish released this year. The demand is obviously not there. If they keep doing what they always have, they will be out of business in a few years.

Things need to change and they picked an excellent engine manufacturer to help them catch up. I'm not sure what they will do in the transmission category but I'm hopeful that 2016 will bring great new products and tech to market. Till then, times will be tough and they will continue to bleed.

 

The reason I bought my V8 Vantage was for the looks as IMO,from this aspect, no other car is better. However the same cannot be said for the technology under this skin. I'd be quite happy for Aston to concentrate on what they are best at and let AMG supply the engines. For me this would then be the best of both worlds. Also I'm sure it will bring in far more new customers than old ones it would lose.