C63 AMG Kills M3 and RS4
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I am anxious to try the steering since it's been panned by a few magazines, but maybe they didn't have it in the "M mode?"
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Exactly it is just an M3.
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And that's why MB makes a C63, for people like you.
They'll be plenty of people that will take your place for than M3. The only real competition is the 335 with PROceed V2.
And you really can't compare when the E46 came out and the current E92. There was no competition at the time. Now just about every German manufacture has their own version of a big engined car, including the C63 and RS4. You have a lot more choices now, which is a good thing. Competition is always good for the consumer.
I just don't like how MB uses the same engine and detunes it for the C-class. An engine should not have it's ***** cut off. That's why the M engines win awards all the time.
They'll be plenty of people that will take your place for than M3. The only real competition is the 335 with PROceed V2.
And you really can't compare when the E46 came out and the current E92. There was no competition at the time. Now just about every German manufacture has their own version of a big engined car, including the C63 and RS4. You have a lot more choices now, which is a good thing. Competition is always good for the consumer.
I just don't like how MB uses the same engine and detunes it for the C-class. An engine should not have it's ***** cut off. That's why the M engines win awards all the time.
Last edited by aus; Oct 31, 2007 at 12:19 AM.
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+1...hmmm europe got a 320 hp e36 m3, we got 240, talk about raped, pillaged, and plundered. the new v8 m3 engine was the easy way out. porsche was pushing well over 100 hp/ltr on the 996 gt3, did they go to a v8? no! did they add displacement? NO! and yet they still come out with a motor that produces 1 more hp than the new m3 v8, has .4 liters less displacement, makes as much tq, and is an engine that only the 360CS has more hp per liter. bmw makes great engines, but Porsche makes THE BEST engines.
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you still dont know what time the car actually ran. well see what happens. richter says it ran 25 seconds faster than the e46 m3, but what number are they using it in comparison to? some internal number that no one knows?
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0-60 doesnt mean anything anymore - its the quarter mile where a car can really show its true potential and due to the way these cars are expected to perform... its not good... at all, period
My bone stock e46 M3 did the quarter mile in 13.2 seconds - .4 seconds better... isn't really that much better and 99% of the people will never go to the N-ring, and 90% will never track their car, so the only thing that really matters is how it will do on a day by day basis on the track of the regular streets where it will be devoured by many many MANY cars out there
the e46 when it came out, was in a league of its own, faster then almost anything on the street (minus the 996TT and the F-cars) this M3 shouldve done the same, it doesn't
and whats so bad about wanting straight line speed anyway? you say it like its a sin and the only thing it should do well is handle... personally i would rather have the C63, fast as all hell and handles well enough for the conditions that i would put it in, i'm not saying this because i have 2 MB's right now, this M3 is a disappointment in too many ways and i would never buy one... before its debut i couldn't wait, thinking it would be my next car, after the pictures alone, i put it out of my mine, been that way ever since
My bone stock e46 M3 did the quarter mile in 13.2 seconds - .4 seconds better... isn't really that much better and 99% of the people will never go to the N-ring, and 90% will never track their car, so the only thing that really matters is how it will do on a day by day basis on the track of the regular streets where it will be devoured by many many MANY cars out there
the e46 when it came out, was in a league of its own, faster then almost anything on the street (minus the 996TT and the F-cars) this M3 shouldve done the same, it doesn't
and whats so bad about wanting straight line speed anyway? you say it like its a sin and the only thing it should do well is handle... personally i would rather have the C63, fast as all hell and handles well enough for the conditions that i would put it in, i'm not saying this because i have 2 MB's right now, this M3 is a disappointment in too many ways and i would never buy one... before its debut i couldn't wait, thinking it would be my next car, after the pictures alone, i put it out of my mine, been that way ever since
OMG your such a ricer...Is straight line speed all you care about? How is the M3 supposed to keep up with the whored out AMG engine? It is a huge 6.3 liter engine in a smaller car, that has one purpose and that is to go fast in a straight line. Unlike the AMG the M3 is lighter, has better handling, is more of a drivers car, etc etc etc. I mean hearing you say proved you care a less about anything but that (go figure he drives to AMGs). If BMW wanted to they could have made this car the fastest car in the 1/4 in its class, however they have other things on their minds. Which is shouldn't have to tell you what they are.
I mean is the 1/4 where all cars show their potential? The 911s dont have great 1/4's? I guess they aren't anything special.
Oh and I think you forgot to mention that Car and Driver placed the M3 first in that comparison....
Heres a little quote for you AMG lovers; "The M3 wins because it is the best—the most sporting and emotionally appealing car in this group. It’s not the fastest, but its relatively light weight and deft handling, and the relationship it fosters with the driver, are the most compelling. And by the way, it is the least-expensive car of the three." - Car and Driver Magazine.
Last edited by GarrettM; Oct 31, 2007 at 08:04 AM.
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How fast do you want the M3 to be in a straight line? Thats not what the car is made for unlike the C63 and other AMGs. Sure if BMW put a huge 6.3 liter engine in it like MB then you would get there.
And no! The 1/4 is not where the car shows it's true potential
. Its an M3, not a Camaro. If you and all these other people you speak for want fast straight line speed buy a GNX for a fraction of the price and call it a day.
And no! The 1/4 is not where the car shows it's true potential
. Its an M3, not a Camaro. If you and all these other people you speak for want fast straight line speed buy a GNX for a fraction of the price and call it a day.you know what...the m cars *USED* to be about being light and nimble and more about a chasis faster than the engine. but its not that way so much anymore. they have made the cars softer, and i personally think they are making the new m cars more like AMG's...more emphasis on straight line rather than handling (even though for their size handling is pretty good)...which is obvious considering they prob play the hp game more than anything...bloated weight, 4200 for the m5, ~4000 for the m6, 3600+ for the m3, and hp number that are huge so people expect fast 1/4 mile times. lets be honest, 95% of drivers want a car that gives them a nice rush when they take off or when they enter an onramp for the highway. while m3 drivers used to be more purist (most have moved onto Porsches, and ferraris), people who didnt buy a real sports for any of the reasons of practicality or rear seat or storage space but wanted a driving experience that was good but still short of a Porsche, ferrari, or lambo and now the m3 for the most part is bought by a lot of posers. people who want to just say they have an M car and brag that it goes 0-60 in 4.5 seconds.
and...lets face it...99% of people who buy these cars 1) will never go to the track 2) will never be able to even operate the car at even close to its full potential.
Last edited by PorscheC4; Oct 31, 2007 at 08:02 AM.
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you know what...the m cars *USED* to be about being light and nimble and more about a chasis faster than the engine. but its not that way so much anymore. they have made the cars softer, and i personally think they are making the new m cars more like AMG's...more emphasis on straight line rather than handling (even though for their size handling is pretty good)...which is obvious considering they prob play the hp game more than anything...bloated weight, 4200 for the m5, ~4000 for the m6, 3600+ for the m3, and hp number that are huge so people expect fast 1/4 mile times. lets be honest, 95% of drivers want a car that gives them a nice rush when they take off or when they enter an onramp for the highway. while m3 drivers used to be more purist (most have moved onto Porsches, and ferraris), people who didnt buy a real sports for any of the reasons of practicality or rear seat or storage space but wanted a driving experience that was good but still short of a Porsche, ferrari, or lambo and now the m3 for the most part is bought by a lot of posers. people who want to just say they have an M car and brag that it goes 0-60 in 4.5 seconds.
and...lets face it...99% of people who buy these cars 1) will never go to the track 2) will never be able to even operate the car at even close to its full potential.
and...lets face it...99% of people who buy these cars 1) will never go to the track 2) will never be able to even operate the car at even close to its full potential.
M cars are still fairly light. BMW has to change, add more weight and make bigger cars. Because people want saftey, more room, better practicality. Cars change because the demand from people and the market changes. The E30 was designed for the market it was in and was E36, E46, and E92. And how can you say they are based on straight line? The new M3 is rumored to be great on the track and a great drivers car.
BMWs are not as bloated as MB. The C63 weight over 4000lbs, thats close to an M5. How can you say the M5 is bloated compare it to other cars in its class.
And how can you say the M3 wont give people a 'nice rush' when they hit the gas. Is sure as hell is faster then most cars on the street.
The M3 will handle with the Porsches and other sports cars. The rumored N ring time is a great time and id like to see it compared to the 997s and C63s times.
Last edited by GarrettM; Oct 31, 2007 at 09:04 AM.
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like all my current and previous cars are from that country - and did you say porsches dont have great 1/4 miles times? yea the turbo falling into the 11's isnt too good huh? and the GT3 in the low low 12's, also isnt too good, and standard carrera s's falling into 12's as well, for a 350hp engine sucks too....
damn kid you dont know anything about anything but bmw, and not much at that - no need to argue with someone who doenst know anything...
i win.....NEXT!
and the GT3 in the low low 12's, also isnt too good, and standard carrera s's falling into 12's as well, for a 350hp engine sucks too....damn kid you dont know anything about anything but bmw, and not much at that - no need to argue with someone who doenst know anything...
i win.....NEXT!
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Another thing, how can you say BMW cant compete with a huge engine?
The E46 M3 was a little bitty 3.2 and it took down any american monster is went up against, the vette, mustangs gt's and cobras, camaro z28 and ss's, the new hemis, and cadillac v series, which in some cases had double or almost double the displacement
bmw has been known for taking this little engines and making big power out of them, so AMG shouldnt shut the new M3 down the way it does
as said, the new M3 is not so much of a car for the purists anymore as the previous ones were - BMW expects to sell over 100k of the new M3... its more of a marketing ploy than anything... they have supposedly used many weight saving tricks only to gain a couple hundreds pounds at best, most will be more optioned out therefore bringing weight up
and how can you say if they wanted to make this car with the fastest 1/4 mile they would have... what?! i mean, for real... what?! do you work at bmw and have you spoken with the ceos and chris bangle himself asking them this question... the M5 and M6 has pretty damn quick 1/4 miles, but thats the potential of the stock engine, and the stock potential of the new M3 engine is a 12.6 1/4 mile...
The E46 M3 was a little bitty 3.2 and it took down any american monster is went up against, the vette, mustangs gt's and cobras, camaro z28 and ss's, the new hemis, and cadillac v series, which in some cases had double or almost double the displacement
bmw has been known for taking this little engines and making big power out of them, so AMG shouldnt shut the new M3 down the way it does
as said, the new M3 is not so much of a car for the purists anymore as the previous ones were - BMW expects to sell over 100k of the new M3... its more of a marketing ploy than anything... they have supposedly used many weight saving tricks only to gain a couple hundreds pounds at best, most will be more optioned out therefore bringing weight up
and how can you say if they wanted to make this car with the fastest 1/4 mile they would have... what?! i mean, for real... what?! do you work at bmw and have you spoken with the ceos and chris bangle himself asking them this question... the M5 and M6 has pretty damn quick 1/4 miles, but thats the potential of the stock engine, and the stock potential of the new M3 engine is a 12.6 1/4 mile...
And yes...A 6.3 V8 should take down a 4.0 (4.2? i think 4.0) V8. And yes a few hundered pounds off a car makes a huge difference, you didn't know this? Those few hundered pounds wont be put back on by options (are you serious what the 200lb dumbbell in the trunk option?). Also the designer of the new M3 said he wanted a fast TRACK CAR that can be humble on the streets (give or take a few words), had BMW wanted a huge gobs of HP and TQ they would of done it...So whats your point the new M3 much faster than 99% of the cars out there but so slow it fails?