Diesel: Addition of BlueSpark Pro + Boost Control
#76
Interesting, but confusing. Points to ponder:
1. Porsche claims max torque available from 1750 rpm through 2750 rpm.
Your charts don't even indicate that low. Were these tests by any chance conducted from a rolling start?
2. Further, Map0 is ostensibly straight through the BSP; factory settings, where torque and hp curves intersect around 4400 rpm. Intersecting curves are normal - and expected - on hp vs torque graphing. That's the data point around which gear changes are considered. From what I can see, your guy charted to 5000, yet didn't plot a single intersection.
3. It's also important to consider where the tests reveal your hp and torque peaks. Granted the changes are slight, but reasonably consistent. Generally, each successive map makes max hp and/or torque available a little sooner.
4. Additionally, your graphs demonstrate that Maps 7/8/9 progressively prolong the factory torque curve. In other words, it doesn't drop off as rapidly as does the factory default.
5. The data I got with my BSP suggests that Map 9 provides max horsepower, max torque provided in Map 8. This is not reflected in your graphs. I can't help but think that your dyno shop was using a different set of test parameters that did BlueSpark and/or Porsche (reinforced by #1 and #2 above).
I realize that both Porsche and BlueSpark are motivated to show their numbers in the best light. But at least they somewhat agree with each other. Your dyno data is inconsistent with both. Short version; I suspect you may not have gotten your money's worth.
//greg//
1. Porsche claims max torque available from 1750 rpm through 2750 rpm.
Your charts don't even indicate that low. Were these tests by any chance conducted from a rolling start?
2. Further, Map0 is ostensibly straight through the BSP; factory settings, where torque and hp curves intersect around 4400 rpm. Intersecting curves are normal - and expected - on hp vs torque graphing. That's the data point around which gear changes are considered. From what I can see, your guy charted to 5000, yet didn't plot a single intersection.
3. It's also important to consider where the tests reveal your hp and torque peaks. Granted the changes are slight, but reasonably consistent. Generally, each successive map makes max hp and/or torque available a little sooner.
4. Additionally, your graphs demonstrate that Maps 7/8/9 progressively prolong the factory torque curve. In other words, it doesn't drop off as rapidly as does the factory default.
5. The data I got with my BSP suggests that Map 9 provides max horsepower, max torque provided in Map 8. This is not reflected in your graphs. I can't help but think that your dyno shop was using a different set of test parameters that did BlueSpark and/or Porsche (reinforced by #1 and #2 above).
I realize that both Porsche and BlueSpark are motivated to show their numbers in the best light. But at least they somewhat agree with each other. Your dyno data is inconsistent with both. Short version; I suspect you may not have gotten your money's worth.
//greg//
Last edited by grohgreg; 09-04-2013 at 05:54 AM.
#77
2. Further, Map0 is ostensibly straight through the BSP; factory settings, where torque and hp curves intersect around 4400 rpm.
Why this dyno (or these runs?) doesn't use different scales for each is unknown to me, but that doesn't change that there is no real intersection.
3. It's also important to consider where the tests reveal your hp and torque peaks. Granted the changes are slight, but reasonably consistent. Generally, each successive map makes max hp and/or torque available a little sooner.
4. Additionally, your graphs demonstrate that Maps 7/8/9 progressively prolong the factory torque curve. In other words, it doesn't drop off as rapidly as does the factory default.
4. Additionally, your graphs demonstrate that Maps 7/8/9 progressively prolong the factory torque curve. In other words, it doesn't drop off as rapidly as does the factory default.
5. The data I got with my BSP suggests that Map 9 provides max horsepower, max torque provided in Map 8. This is not reflected in your graphs. I can't help but think that your dyno shop was using a different set of test parameters that did BlueSpark and/or Porsche (reinforced by #1 and #2 above).
The problem with comparing to the Porsche numbers is the test method. I'm not pulling my engine out to get a real crank measurement.
Your dyno data is inconsistent with both. Short version; I suspect you may not have gotten your money's worth.
Given how little change there is between the maps, operator error or unit failure has crossed my mind.
The other issue here is that even if you ignore the baseline of Map 0 which suggests a 17% drive train loss there would have to be ~33% loss to get to the peaks that they claim. There is a giant discrepancy here somewhere, but I don't know enough about dyno work (first time) to know what it is.
I would dearly love to see someone else run the same dyno tests on theirs to see what they get.
Last edited by gnat; 09-04-2013 at 08:07 AM.
#78
Sixth gear, 1:1 ratio. I get it. But the single pair of curves Porsche uses in touting the CNRB engine is why I suggested that your dyno guy employed different parameters. One consideration - and perhaps the basis for your drivetrain loss concern - is that Porsche numbers are measured at the flywheel. Hence your testing through the tranny at 1:1. But consider that the transmission is a torque multiplier. There's a chance that Porsche incorporated other data to gin up a hybrid set of curves
I wonder what the curve set would look like if your dyno guy would have added one last test; one foot on the brake, the other hovering over the accelerator, transmission in Drive. Floor it, releasing the brakes simultaneously. Let the tranny select its own shift points through sixth gear, stopping the test data at the 6-7 shift point. There will obviously be undulating curves produced while going through the gears, but one or more set of peaks might be revealing.
Oh, and what I asked BlueSpark for was individual hp vs torque curve sets specific to each map. At one point they said they're "working on them", but I've never bothered to follow up. Given the hundreds of different diesel makes/models/generations for which their boxes are produced, I'm not surprised they wouldn't have the time to develop individual curves for each. Besides that, I'm not even sure they'd have access to the US-spec CNRB engine.
//greg//
I wonder what the curve set would look like if your dyno guy would have added one last test; one foot on the brake, the other hovering over the accelerator, transmission in Drive. Floor it, releasing the brakes simultaneously. Let the tranny select its own shift points through sixth gear, stopping the test data at the 6-7 shift point. There will obviously be undulating curves produced while going through the gears, but one or more set of peaks might be revealing.
Oh, and what I asked BlueSpark for was individual hp vs torque curve sets specific to each map. At one point they said they're "working on them", but I've never bothered to follow up. Given the hundreds of different diesel makes/models/generations for which their boxes are produced, I'm not surprised they wouldn't have the time to develop individual curves for each. Besides that, I'm not even sure they'd have access to the US-spec CNRB engine.
//greg//
Last edited by grohgreg; 09-04-2013 at 02:02 PM.
#80
Other than the dyno not being as expected I haven't had any issues. I put it back to 7 after the dyno and have been seeing really good economy numbers (saw a 37.3 for a 16 mile mixed trip!).
The only failure lights I've had come on since I took delivery were the ABS and parking brake. Both came right after the dyno, both functioned normally, and both warnings cleared after a couple of restarts.
Even if the dyno is accurate, I still think I got my money's worth so far.
The only failure lights I've had come on since I took delivery were the ABS and parking brake. Both came right after the dyno, both functioned normally, and both warnings cleared after a couple of restarts.
Even if the dyno is accurate, I still think I got my money's worth so far.
#81
Original BSP+ apparently had a weak turbo boost circuit from the git-go, which slowly degraded over the months. BlueSpark replaced the unit without a whimper, it's in the car now. Not a single code thrown since. Preferred Map7 in the original, intend to stick with Map7 on the replacement.
//greg//
//greg//
#82
Original BSP+ apparently had a weak turbo boost circuit from the git-go, which slowly degraded over the months. BlueSpark replaced the unit without a whimper, it's in the car now. Not a single code thrown since. Preferred Map7 in the original, intend to stick with Map7 on the replacement.
//greg//
//greg//
What do you have your boost control setting at? Just under 100%?
#83
just about a screwdriver blade to the left of max
#85
BlueSpark v2
Based on the feedback on this forum I ordered up a BlueSpark Pro + Boost Control for my 2014 CD. The unit arrived in California just 5 days after being ordered. The design has been updated, see attached photo.
Jason of BS described the changes as follows: "We have actually updated the hardware to be more robust and also changed the adjustments to be easier to use. As confusing as it sounds the adjustments are the other way round. The 0-9 dial now takes the effect of the rotary blue adjuster because it is easier to set than the blue screw with limited markings. The 0-9 map selector is now changed to the jumpers 1-5 as this is plenty of maps for most people because on the old box most people tended to use maps 5-9 only anyway."
Based on that I've set the jumper to the middle (i.e. old 7) position, and the rotary dial to 8. Should get it in stalled this weekend.
Jason of BS described the changes as follows: "We have actually updated the hardware to be more robust and also changed the adjustments to be easier to use. As confusing as it sounds the adjustments are the other way round. The 0-9 dial now takes the effect of the rotary blue adjuster because it is easier to set than the blue screw with limited markings. The 0-9 map selector is now changed to the jumpers 1-5 as this is plenty of maps for most people because on the old box most people tended to use maps 5-9 only anyway."
Based on that I've set the jumper to the middle (i.e. old 7) position, and the rotary dial to 8. Should get it in stalled this weekend.
#87
Got mine three weeks ago after a four month wait. 1,400 miles later I love it. The one issue was a rattle from the dash which the dealer rectified today. Turned out to be a loose bracket in the firewall contacting the air vent. Drove me nuts, and took them a few days to correct.
#89
I've attached the updated doc.
"When the device has been fitted, turn the ignition key to the ON position, but do not start the engine. There should be a Blue light on the back of the unit which is now flashing. Once the engine is started the Blue light will turn steady. TheGreen and Red lights will flash in accordance with rpm when the engine is revved."
"When the device has been fitted, turn the ignition key to the ON position, but do not start the engine. There should be a Blue light on the back of the unit which is now flashing. Once the engine is started the Blue light will turn steady. TheGreen and Red lights will flash in accordance with rpm when the engine is revved."
#90
I've attached the updated doc.
"When the device has been fitted, turn the ignition key to the ON position, but do not start the engine. There should be a Blue light on the back of the unit which is now flashing. Once the engine is started the Blue light will turn steady. TheGreen and Red lights will flash in accordance with rpm when the engine is revved."
"When the device has been fitted, turn the ignition key to the ON position, but do not start the engine. There should be a Blue light on the back of the unit which is now flashing. Once the engine is started the Blue light will turn steady. TheGreen and Red lights will flash in accordance with rpm when the engine is revved."