I know that winter tires will be much more capable than all seasons but by how much? My question is whether the all season on a panamera 4 is capable enough to tackle northeastern winter. Changing between winter and summer set up is a hassle so I want to quantify if it is worth it or just stick with all seasons. Is the awd in panamera capable for winter condition even though it is tuned for performace? Is all seasons are bad, how bad is it? (Dangerous? Just a little less grip than winter set up?) All suggestions and comments are appreciated!

 

Simple answer is that it all depends . . .

What car/truck is your panamera replacing and how was it equipped? (a 4wd panamera with all seasons will likely do a lot better in the snow than a RWD BMW running the same all seasons, but would likely fare worse than a Toyota 4runner with all season truck tires)

What are your winter driving requirements/goals? (all seasons will do you fine if you plan to drive a "snow day" beater or are not needing the panamera to serve you in a blizzard -- conversely, if the panamera is your every day car and you're expecting it to take you through challenging snow days and on frequent ski trips, you might want dedicated winter tires)

What conditions are you looking to conquer? (all seasons might be perfectly good in the slush Philadelphia can get but lack the ability to stop quickly or handle well in the Icy weather in western PA -- conversely, dedicated summer tires are likely to provide a better ride, performance and lower noise than all seasons during the summer)

For me, it was a no-brainer, we chose dedicated summer tires on our panamera GTS (also 4wd) for their higher performance potential and, living in Denver (where it gets cold enough to have a fair # of icy/snowy and/or ski days), switch over to dedicated winter tires each winter (pirello sottozeros)

I ran all seasons once on my '86 911 (completely different car of course) and couldn't wait to replace 'em. Too much of a compromise, performance-wise on dry/warm roads and provided LITTLE confidence on snowy/icy/cold roads during the winter.

 

My experience is that if you expect to drive in snow, not merely in the cold, you want proper winter tires. 4WD is really less important than your tires. 2 wheels gripping with tires that can deal with the conditions is more effective than 4 wheels slipping sideways.

All-seasons are perfectly fine if you expect that the roads will be well-plowed. We got a ridiculous amount of snow this winter in Boston, but most days, I was driving on dry streets because the roads were plowed and the layer the plows didn't get melted fast enough, even in the cold.

It's the roads that don't get well plowed, or which don't get salted afterward, or which don't have much traffic that are a problem. Those are the roads that retain snow. When I was living in the mountains SW of Denver (Bailey area), the roads were never truly clear, and proper snow tires were a must for all cars.

 

Gus -- completely agree -- the situations where I've found dedicated winter tires to be a lifesaver have been those (generally unexpected) situations where I've been surprised by developing weather away from home -- i.e. hit by a burst of snow mid afternoon that I didn't expect to tackle on my ride home from work. In these situations, when surrounded by folks whose cars are generally not up to the task at hand, it's VERY comforting (and well worth the $$$/hassle of changing to winter tires) to have a car that's properly set up to get it through the unexpected conditions and home.

 

I have dedicated winter tires/wheels for my 2wd Panamera. We have had mucho snow this winter and the car performed very well in the snow. Realize also that the softer compound helps in just cold weather. It's not much of a hassle to change from winter to summer if you have a mounted tire.

 

I think a great deal has to do with where you live and the way your local area deals with snow removal. Where I live if you want to wait a day or two before venturing out in your car than you will be fine. I do not like waiting so I have a jeep since there is no way the Panamera is going to go through 8-10' of unplowed snow. All seasons are just that, and they will never be a good as real snow tires will be. Winters here used to not be as eventful though the last few years bitter cold and snow (making the potholes more dangerous than the snow) has made the roads around here a mess.

 

Even the best all seasons won't do what a snow tire will on hard pack and ice. Especially when it gets very cold. Check this link out. It answers a lot of questions about choosing all season vs. dedicated snow. To see dedicated winter tests, check this link out.

 

Since the Panamera will be my daily driver I expect to drive through anything the weather has to offer. I do expect to get quite a lot of snow in my area however I think the plows do try to clean the roads as fast as possible. Of course the roads are not always 100% clear so I expect slush and bit of powder on the roads. I have michelin pilot super sport right now and I am looking to change to Michelin pilot sport A/S or the pirelli cintarutaro P7 (not sure how it is spelled). But if I do get a winter set up it will be the pirelli sottozero or other dedicated snow tires. Any more suggestion? How much does it cost just to swap wheels with tires already on them, 50-100 bucks?

 

Having someone else swap tires 2X a year is a royal PITA. Hauling four tires to a shop is a nightmare in anything short of an SUV or pickup.

Wiinter tires (Sottozeros) are a must, IMO. And if you see a lot of snow, then go with snow tires (Nokian Hakkas, etc).

 

Depends on the shop, obviously. I believe $50 is about the top you should expect unless you're going through a dealer. It might even be less, since it's essentially comparable labor to a wheel rotation, which can be in the $20 range. With a Porsche dealership all bets are off, I've overheard them quoting very high prices for fairly routine work.

It's entirely possible to do it yourself, but it's enough work that I'll probably have my local NTB do it.

Actually, I've found that the Panamera has enough cargo room to haul a full set of tires in the back if the seats are down. I've done it twice now, once for its own summer tires and once for my wife's. It did require a little work to get them in and out compared to a pickup, but it wasn't at all hard.

 

And you must have used contractor trash bags for the takeoffs. Blech. Too much work. Too much chance for loose tires breaking something inside a $100K vehicle. Waiting for the shop to put the car on the lift, etc.

No thanks.

Don't let them use a torque stick on their eleventy billion lb ft air guns either.

 

NTB put plastic bags over the tires before we put them in the car. If you're finicky, you can buy really nice covers for fairly cheap. The tires don't slide around in the back, either. Regardless, it wasn't a nightmare.

I do agree about waiting for the shop. They're really, really slow. Ideally, you want to drop the car off and then pick it up when they're done. Part of my motivation for getting dedicated rims for the winter tires was to simplify changing them, so if I wanted to wait, it wouldn't be so darned long.

Against the time and effort in taking it to a shop you have to balance the time and effort of doing it yourself. I've never done it, but I've heard that while it's a simple operation, it's time consuming.

 

If your ptt will be your daily driver, and you will face snow and cold temps more than once or twice per year, definitely get a dedicated set of 19" wheels w snow tires.

I bought a set of victor equipment Badens (easy to clean) w michelin alpin and TPMS for ~$3k total. I live in Chicago and these tires plus the high setting on the air suspension have gotten me through 6" plus of snow on the roads wo any problems.

Go to costco and buy a floor jack for ~$100 and a torque wrench and just swap the wheels yourself - it takes 20mins.

The real benefit of the dedicated winter wheels is the superior performance you will get from May-Oct from the 20" wheels with high performance summer tires (eg;Michelin PSS). No all season will compare!

 

I just watched a video of a guy changing wheels on his 2013 Cayman S. Didn't look hard at all. He did mention that wheel hangers are a big help, since they make it much easier to align the new wheel, so you're not both lifting and trying to line up the lugs at the same time. He quoted about 30 minutes for the entire job.

 

So i got a quote for $400 to swap my wheels and transfer my tpms from my old wheel to new ones. Is that too steep? Swapping the tpms from one wheel to another is the expensive process, the dealer said. Changing the wheels only will cost 75 bucks. Can any tireshop or garage swap the tpms? Or should i go to the dealer just to be safe?