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Haha 9k whoa! On pump gas we are pulling hard all the way to 7800 which is what we talked about and are all happy with. Gonna log it on the street to verify how it does up top because the graphs were on and off with the heat. There's just no motion cooling off EGT's which we have really set up for in the recipe when the cars on the road. It was doing pretty well to about 73/7400 on E. Even 7800 with just a low hp drop. We are cool with that. You could see the turbo chargers moving from 570 up to 590 g/s of air progressively as commanded all the way up to redline and fuel trims started getting richer with higher exhaust gas temperature's. On the road this won't happen. The car is just really low with front splitter too and there was no air moving underneath it. The Dyno reads a few rpm lower. You set it to 7400 and it logs 7800+. The car is a blast and on the road she goes deep close to 8k! It's built to handle 8. Without the head work we would never have made this kind of power.
LMAO 9k was a typo! 8k I meant and power starting to drop before 6.5k in that graph. This is a really awesome setup engine wise but I still think a VTG setup on it is not making what this setup is truly built for as top end for which i assume you built the head isn't really shining when pushed with the VTG. Was there not an 800hp car with VTGs by GIAC and Champion on the stock engine as well? Of course it wouldn't last there and it won't do 8k reliably at all on the stock engine but I think they were able to flow that?
Sam - thank you for all the work you and your team have put into this build!!!
I think we've accomplished the objectives we set out to. Ensure we can still daily drive the car but at the same time push the limits with the VTG setup and built forged engine. This car should run mid 140s all day long in the 1/4 mile. The power curve looks awesome. It's good to know it can do 800 to the wheels but to your point, I don't need to run it on "Kill 11 Tune".
While some may certainly feel that bigger turbos would push more power, one of my objectives was to ensure we weren't pushing the car so hard to damage long term other components - transmission, drive train, axles, etc. I'd like to feel confident that every time I blast it I'm not going to break something or better yet create a widow-maker of a car.
Perhaps down the road, if I ever felt I needed more (which I doubt I'll rarely use the power in it except on the track), I can look at bigger turbos. But the more power we start adding here other components start to come in to play - fuel, etc.
Can't wait to get the car back next week, this has been quite the journey and can't say enough about your support through the build process.
Thanks again to you and your crew and for everyone else on the forum providing your positive feedback. I'll update the post later once I get it back with some Vbox runs in Mexico. In the meantime keep your comments coming and let me know what you think.
Guys this came out real nice and you should be proud of the results. 800whp VTG setup, probably one of the top if not the top VTG car I have seen (seems to be alot of mystery surrounding the CMS car it also ran real high boost if I recall). Even on the backed off tune the car has a great powerband for the street . All this at relatively low boost pressure because of the head work/cams.
Can the engine do more on GT30s+ of course it can. When the lucky owner gets bored of his mere 900hp flywheel he can go do over 1khp with confidence.
Dguth start saving cash for bigger turbos LOL. We all know you will go bigger only a matter of time
This was a really cool build keeping the VTG architecture in there. STOP making me want to spend money!!!
Last edited by M3 Maestro; Sep 15, 2017 at 07:15 AM.
Cheers Daniel! It was a pleasure working with you and I'm also really proud of my team for getting it done so quickly considering the scope of work. Even when done we had engine break in, three oil changes, some interior components, some suspension and tires, brakes etc. Then 2 dyno sessions and some street tuning.
I don't think he will want to larger turbo chargers. Like I said on the street in clean air she pulls all the way and very nicely. It just leaves you not wanting more especially with the tires spinning. I guess the main thing for me is that there is no boost controller's, gigantic injectors or funny stuff. The car is like factory. To me it's a great place to be. Gives you the pucker factor for sure
Thanks J! Can't wait to start pushing E85 on your car! We have to try to hide the crack pipe right now ha ha.
Thanks Maestro, coming from someone who knows what he's talking about from all three sides that's a nice pat on the back!
Last edited by SamboTT@ByDesign; Sep 15, 2017 at 09:42 AM.
Hello everyone, been traveling quite a bit and thought I would give everyone an update on driving impressions. I wish I had more quantifiable data to give you but for now, you just get my verbal gushing! I'll try to plan and do some vbox runs in a couple of weeks once I can find a safe place to do it.
Initial reaction is, holy crap can this car move
I couldn't be more pleased with how it turned out. For example, this morning, driving to work, in bumper to bumper traffic, slogging at 900 to 1000rpm - the car is perfect, no bogging, just smoothly shuttles along. At any blip of the throttle, power is instant, and above 3k it's lights out to anything behind or beside. I can't begin to explain how fast this car is from 60 to 130mph. I'm in triple digits without even blinking or the car feeling out of breath. The best part of it is, while the power is eye sucking, the car never feels out of sort or like the rear end is squirmy or can't handle the power. Sam and his team did a great job with the new DSC model and rear toe links. The torque and power delivery is very smooth and linear - this really helps keep the car in check as the power surge comes on and pulls all the way the 7500 rpm.
That's my update for now, I can't wait to keep driving this car. Puts a smile on my face and feel grateful to be in a position to drive it.
Huge thanks again to Sam and his team, perfect job and he's still there for support even after the build which means a lot.
Here's a couple of pictures I took the other night; enjoy.
Glad to hear it Daniel! That last map I sent you should have the drivability dialed in Better than before we w mr big just like I had it on 93 when I was playing around in traffic here in Los Angeles. Your car is looking really good in the logs buddy! 600 g/s of air moving through that baby! On the streets in your area with your pump E85 she's doing really well. Under 85/90% injector duty leaving a little extra in case she wants to cool her self down a little.
Thanks Sam. I appreciate it. What does that mean however?? It seems that whenever someone posts up a build thread and then a simple technical question gets asked, no one can really provide a simple answer. Not a biggie, I was just curious. When people ask me what parts we used in my builds, I have no issue telling them exactly what stuff went in. If you guys wanna keep it top secret, as some guys do for proprietary reasons, then I fully understand. Car looks very cool btw.. congrats!
Last edited by pwdrhound; Oct 2, 2017 at 03:02 PM.
Cheers guys. John we are friends and you know you can call me anytime. There's honestly a couple reasons why I don't post those specific details.
1- There are several ways to skin a cat as many know. So a different approach maybe take into suit a different need. Sometimes guys will read and gather the wrong information.
2- Opinions can be quite strong and sometimes experience is not there to back them up. Usually when you get into extreme detail a popcorn Festival insews LOL. It's different when you're a vendor.
3- athere is also a little bit of proprietary information in there although it's not the main point. Somethings some of us learn the hard way and we keep it close. Again that's one part of it. Also I have respect for John my builder who is one of the best in the world if not the best on these motors. He always keep things close for everyone because he gets it and there's a lot of knowledge he has that gets out there and is not applied properly. You may have noticed there's a lot of cowboy engine builders now and also a lot of guys that try doing it themselves. Sometimes it works out fine but many times it doesn't either in the long or short term.
Things just are not that simple. There's a lot to the whole picture and customer requirements, data, tuning play a big part. I would rather just avoid all of that and take care of my guys. But I'm always available to help someone individually even with simple advice or guidance for whatever my two cents are worthy a l personal level. Even though I've been doing this for over 20 years I'm not a welder, I'm not an engine builder, I'm not a dedicated tuner etc. So I'm lucky enough to have a really good team that I work with and give everyone Who works with me the best value and support I can
. All this at relatively low boost pressure because of the head work/cams.
