2014 C2S.. 24K miles.. First time I've had to take it into dealer for an issue. (Typically do all general service items myself).

Figured I'd start the thread as a future reference on my experience and hopefully resolution (good or bad)

Background/Issue..

- Several months ago got starting getting CEL with P0456 type of fault codes. It would come and go... eventually came and never left. Swapped gas caps. Planned to get it in for service but never highly motivated as it didn't seem to impact performance or mileage. [P0456 continuous]

- Have also had a weird problem with the PDK, where intermittently from a stop (first happened when backing out of a parking spot and going into D") and just starting to lightly apply throttle, the dual clutch would seem to suddenly slip. Kind of a "pop" in the sense it felt like a manual if you were to be driving slow and popped into neutral with engaging clutch. Started happening more recently mostly when cold, but more than once now has happened when fully warmed up. Always in 1st just starting to move forward under light throttle. [No fault codes thrown]

- about 3 weeks ago, it would run a little rough at startup (RPM would jump around a little bit) settled out quickly after engine temps came up a little bit. Generally it was worse when the car sat for several days. But still no fault codes thrown other than the P456's [No fault codes thrown other than P456]

- Last week seemed to get noticeably worse. Really choppy at startup.. until fully warmed up. Drives fine at street and highway speeds... more and more feels a little sluggish on acceleration]

- Finally, last time I drove (fully warmed up on the way to work) when slowing down lost all power and red instrument panel indications.. Didn't see the exact message, but was red but had a drive on...(limp home). I limped into a side street, restarted and all seemed ok.. Carefully drove to work and then home.. but the complete loss of power in traffic spooked me. So I decided to just call Porsche roadside and flatbed to Riverside Porsche (Walters). I debated driving it, as it was probably ok to drive, but it's about 35 miles all on socal freeways, so I erred for once on the side of caution.

After the last drive, I hooked up the Durametric and it did finally throw a bunch of faults.. P1552 (Altitude sensor - F96 Open/Short circuit to ground), P2101 Throttle actuator - Control Motor circuit range/perf upper value exceeded. U0418 Upper Limit Value exceeded. and the PDK threw a P1990 and P199A which had descriptions as Positive engine torque intervention not possible..

Some of this sounds like it is likely related somehow to the MAF sensor, but I know there are other engine sensors that when they fail end up causing a ripple of failures. I've also been following the lastest on the Engine Hesitation which sounds like it may be related to the pre cadconv O2 sensors.

So this is where things sit now with the car in to the dealer. Got a call from service manager and gave him the basics... so we will see how things go...

I'm sort of dreading this knowing that it will likely take several trips to get the major issues resolved. But I'm about 3 1/2 years into warranty so it's best to work through them now..

I'll post as I learn more..

As a note, I wasn't completely thrilled with the initial consultation (over phone) as the service consultant seemed to want to talk more than listen and wasn't super interested in hearing what fault codes were thrown... Sort of blew me off and said they had tools to see all of that..

At first he seemed to just say, yeah we saw a CEL and will take a look at it and update software.. But finally he did pay attention when I gave him a detailed description of the issues.

So we will see. I'll withhold my judgment and see how it goes at Walters / Riverside

 

Update....

- So spoke with the service rep... Lots of software updates since I hadn't had it in since delivery..

Supposedly it cleared up the P0456 (which doesn't surprise me), but what seems really strange is that the rough running behavior seems to have cleared up after the software updates.

I suppose that in the last 3 or 4 years (since late 2013 when mine was built) it could be that the current ECU software version handles the natural drift and aging of the various engine sensors and has been improved (just speculating).

It just seems weird that an engine can run fine for 3 years, then start running really crappy and that a software update fixes it all..

Unfortunately it is the age old Porsche, if there isn't a fault code it by definition is running normal...

In any case service rep is having someone drive home and back in the morning.. So we will see..

Service rep also mentioned that one of the engine fan connectors wasn't connected (which was obviously my fault).. Never had any overheating problems, but what kinda of amazes me is that the fan's being off / disconnected didn't throw a fault???

 

update 2...

SM called me back this morning.. After driving the car back in this morning, he experienced what I was complaining about.. Started running rough, with total power loss (red drive on).. Had to restart car to clear the condition and drive back into dealer.

Luckily this gave them the fault codes that I described and they are replacing the throttle body.. Not really sure why the didn't see the fault codes I saw. The existing faults were still stored as I could see them with my durametric.. but I get the impression they have their own way of doing things.

Maybe it's me but it seems like the minute you say you looked at it with a Durametric they roll their eyes and think armchair mechanic..

But at least it looks like they found something... I just couldn't believe that it would start running bad and loading updated firmware would fix..

 

Got car back. They replaced the throttle body as the primary issue. 35 mile drive back from the dealer and it seems to drive like a Porsche once again.

A bunch of software updates, a smoke test and they replaced a sensor which was causing the original P0456 CEL failure.

Also replaced the engine lid strut as it was slipping. Forgot to mention that to them, but it probably annoyed them as much as it did me.

Happy it was all under warranty, but we will see if the solution sticks... The weird clutch slip that happens when cold at slow speeds wasn't addressed, but it seemed to get worse with the rough running engine, so maybe it was related.

Overall my experience with Walters was decent. I would have liked it if the service rep had paid attention to my original (detailed) comments. Might have saved a day, but all in all wasn't terrible.

I didn't appreciate that they don't offer loaner cars (they offered to hook me up with hertz) gee.. thanks...

So I may check out another dealer for my next service... Oh they mentioned that my 40K service will be $1900... Yeah no thanks..

 

Glad it got fixed Scatkins- and under warranty! I have never heard of not getting a loaner car.

ChuckJ

 

The car is under warranty. Porsche is going to have a list of procedures for the techs to follow. Certainly applying any DME updates is going to be near the top of the list. Then clear the codes and road test the car. What the car then does, or doesn't do, determines what's next.

One or more error codes can have from a couple of paragraphs worth of a write up to pages worth. It can take some time for the techs to work through these. Sometimes it involves replacing something and road testing the car.

I know from speaking to Porsche techs they chaff a bit at this because often they know what's wrong having gone through this before, but Porsche being Porsche guidelines must be followed, and documented on the work order.

After the car is out of warranty I'm pretty sure if you bring the car in and tell the tech it is this or that he'll oblige you and replace this or that. (Well, he might suggest you allow him to confirm your diagnosis but it reads like you'd say no.) Whether replacing what you ask for actually addresses the problem will not be the tech's problem.

(When I take my cars in for a problem I will provide the tech with as much detail, including error codes, as I can provide, and if he's receptive (and most of the time he is but once in a while I realize he's very busy and cut my talking short) I'll provide him with that I think is wrong. He politely listens (and not bragging but I've been told more than once I'm pretty knowledgeable for a non-professional mechanic) but I will almost always let him make the diagnosis, let him know I'm looking forward to hearing his diagnosis. A plus is most of the time the tech's time to do this diagnosis will not be billed or if it is billed the billed time is reduced.)

My experience is loaners are most often reserved for customers who have bought a car at the dealer. Even if one has bought a car at a dealer often just showing up with no appointment can have the loaners all gone. A busy dealer will have loaners in use all the time.

Even though I almost always take my cars to a dealer where I did not buy them sometimes -- not every time but sometimes -- when I call for an appointment the SM will advise me if I want a loaner if I can wait a day or two or wait until the next week when his appointment book is empty he'll have one available. Fortunately I have a 2nd car so I have my own "loaner" and all I need is a quick lift home which one of the shuttle drivers or if they are out another of the dealer employees provides me but almost always when I get a chance for a loaner I take it cause it gives me a chance to drive a car I would not otherwise drive. By taking a loaner, I've experienced a couple of different Audi models, a Cayenna and a Macan.

Also, I let the SM know if he needs the loaner back he can have mine back any time. He appreciates this though I don't think he's ever asked for one back early.
This tends to make the chance of getting a loaner a bit better.

 

Glad everything worked out and you are back on the road. I have a question (please don't take it with anything negative attached to it).. why didn't you go to the dealer when you first saw some codes or when the PDK started acting weird?

I haven't searched but I'm assuming you either do your own service or use an Indy.. which I totally get as the P dealer's prices are crazy..

Again, glad all is well and just curious.

 

Curious huh? I'm often "curious" why people just don't just say what they really think.. such as " That seems stupid" or simply "Why?" (or jab back with a smiley as well

The initial fault code I had was P0456 which is largely a nuisance code.. One of those things where you get it looked at the next time you are in the dealer for another reason.

For the problems you mentioned (rough running and PDK) neither of those were throwing fault codes, so as we all know (or find out the hard way) if there is no fault code, Porsche will tell you it is "normal". In my case even when I finally got a hard fault code in the DME, Porsche SM initially tried to blow it off and tell me a software update fixed it. (yeah right). It wasn't until their SM drove the car home and experienced a complete loss of power on a busy freeway that they acknowledged an issue.

In reality I was having a hard time getting the car into the dealer. My local dealers won't accomodate (even a dead car) without an appointment which has been at least a week. And for me the preferred dealer is 40 miles from my house and 70 miles from my office and with local traffic so it is more or less a day off work which I haven't had time to deal with. (Which is why I'm considering a new dealer for work).

Yep, service costs are a bit ridiculous...But to be fair, comparatively $1900 for a 40K service is not all that terrible for Porsche since I've read of folks paying up to $3K.. To each his own on the subject and it has been debated into the ground... In another lifetime.. I did lot of engine and auto work for a living... To me there is nothing mystical about scheduled services.. its fluids, and some inspections.. The amount you can charge for it is proportional to the cost of the car and not the amount of work. I prefer to do continuous maintenance and inspections (eg. every month or two) change my fluids and filters much more frequently... It isn't a matter of affordability, but I still just have a hard time getting my head around $600+ for what amounts to a dealer oil change.... We all have our hot buttons.. I guess that's mine.

I realize that not everyone has the skill or desire.. When I don't have the time, I'd rather use a good Indy, who is accommodating and will usually listen to what you are saying. So yeah.. my dealer visits are limited to warranty, which is what I mean when I say "no thanks".. That's not a slam on the dealers per-se as they are a business and entitled to get what they can. Just not my preference.

 

I've never found any correlation to where I buy a car and how I'm treated with regard to service. Sales and service just seem to be independent businesses entities. I also hear about people buying into some perceived "loyalty" in which they are treated more favorably down the line when they are long time customer (service or purchase).. Maybe that happens in Mayberry somewhere but in real life dealers are high capital business entities that turn over, get acquired by large auto groups. Some do a good job of treating customers fairly, others not so much.. But some return for customer loyalty is more about wishful thinking... Sure some markets are more competitive than others, and when that is the case I'm sure they are more accommodating.

Then again my indy is pretty accommodating as well. 5 minutes from my house and he always gives me a loaner and doesn't mind spending 15 minutes chatting about the problem and asking more problems.. And rarely tells me an obvious problem is "normal". simply because the OEM "procedures" say so..

 

Thanks.. you have satisfied my "curiosity"... and for the record I was just curious as I really couldn't care less what you do... but makes sense so I thank you for the explanation (I added the smiley per your suggestion)

 

Hi scatkins, I have 2013 C2S, 15k miles. Experiencing the exact same PDK problem you shared below. From “D” it pops and the gear indicator went blank and the red dot on “D” blinks. No fault codes thrown as well. Would appreciate if you can share your experience on how you solved this issue.

 

Seven year old thread so you may or may not get a reply.

 

Thanks admin!